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The Battle To Watch: Volkswagen Vs. Toyota
Forbes ^ | 4/28/2009 | Jerry Flint

Posted on 04/29/2009 1:17:09 AM PDT by bruinbirdman

Toyota's place as No. 1 in the world faces a challenge. Not from Detroit, but from Wolfsburg.

Volkswagen is where the action is.

General Motors (GM) and Chrysler are sinking away, Toyota (TM) is losing money, but in Wolfsburg (the lair of the German car company), Volkswagen (VLKAF.PK) is planning to conquer the world (or at least be No. 1) by 2018.

Let's look at a few of the recent headlines:

In the first quarter this year VW worldwide sales closed the gap on No. 1 automaker Toyota. VW sales of 1.4 million fell 11%, while Toyota's 1.8 million dropped 27%--narrowing the first-quarter sales gap to 363,000 vehicles from 840,000.

VW said it would build its new series of small cars (near minicars) in Slovakia, the now-independent half of once-Czechoslovakia. Production starts in 2011, and VW expects at least 500,000 global sales a year.

VW says it expects to be profitable this year. First-quarter profit was $403 million, but that quarter stayed black because of the sale of its heavy truck business in Brazil to an ally. (I am sure VW figures are correct but will never forget what a then-VW CEO, an old friend, said to me many years ago: "There is accounting, there is German accounting, and there is Volkswagen accounting." Times and standards have changed, but sometimes old habits die hard.)

Plus there is the major expansion in the U.S. with new plant in Tennessee. A new car is to be built there to challenge Toyota's and Honda's (HMC) dominance of the family sedan market. VW hopes to sell 1 million VWs and Audis here by 2018, which is enormously ambitious considering sales last year were 315,000.

VW has nine brands worldwide; the best known are VW, Audi (1 million worldwide sales), Skoda (the old Czech brand)

(Excerpt) Read more at forbes.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: automakers; economy; germany; topten; toyota; volkswagen; vw

1 posted on 04/29/2009 1:17:10 AM PDT by bruinbirdman
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To: bruinbirdman

Toyota’s losing money has nothing to do with Toyota.


2 posted on 04/29/2009 1:24:06 AM PDT by libh8er
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To: bruinbirdman

Interesting.

I’d be interested to know what the numbers are on VW’s build quality these days. I know a several years back they were having some issues with quality control and overall reliability - at least relative to Toyota and Honda.

I *would* love to have an Audi TT roadster, though...


3 posted on 04/29/2009 1:35:02 AM PDT by DemforBush (Somebody wake me when sanity has returned to the nation.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.


4 posted on 04/29/2009 1:38:17 AM PDT by bill1952 (Power is an illusion created between those with power - and those without)
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To: libh8er

Sure it is. It didn’t happen in a vaccuum.


5 posted on 04/29/2009 1:40:46 AM PDT by packrat35 (You could make a fortune as a politician if you have the moral standards of a convicted pedophile)
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To: DemforBush
"I’d be interested to know what the numbers are on VW’s build quality these days."

VW owns Bentley and is eyeballing Porsche.

yitbos

6 posted on 04/29/2009 1:42:43 AM PDT by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: bruinbirdman
VW has not gotten past it's horrible electronics platform. It's reputation for problems in that area kill it's name among many knowledgeable buyers. Toyota should be killing them on quality outright.
7 posted on 04/29/2009 1:55:51 AM PDT by Caipirabob (Communists... Socialists... Democrats...Traitors... Who can tell the difference?)
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To: bruinbirdman

VW already owns controlling share in Porsche.


8 posted on 04/29/2009 2:00:43 AM PDT by neb52
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To: neb52

http://jalopnik.com/photogallery/CarCompanyFamilyTree/1001026196?viewSize=thumb1280x1280


9 posted on 04/29/2009 2:01:20 AM PDT by neb52
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To: DemforBush
There, fixed it...

I’d be interested to know what the numbers are on VW’s build quality these days.

10 posted on 04/29/2009 2:08:17 AM PDT by Las Vegas Dave ("Thou shalt not speak ill of any fellow Republican." - Ronald Reagan)
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To: bruinbirdman

I thought they were allies...


11 posted on 04/29/2009 2:08:20 AM PDT by BigCinBigD ('When a man believes that any stick will do, he at once picks up a boomerang,')
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To: bruinbirdman

Somewhere in Hell an old paperhanger smiles.


12 posted on 04/29/2009 2:29:31 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (The age of 0bama: the transient ischemic delusions of adequacy decade.)
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To: bruinbirdman

13 posted on 04/29/2009 2:38:08 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (Arjuna, why have you have dropped your bow???)
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No matter who wins this one, we’re squandering our treasury on the slow death of Government Motors.

“Plus there is the major expansion in the U.S. with new plant in Tennessee. “ Good for them. Must mean people willingly pay for their product.


14 posted on 04/29/2009 2:39:59 AM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: D-fendr

Yeppirs, Clueless Jenny and Ron Givemthefinger lost that one for Michigan fer sure. On the day that VW officials met with Grandmole, Givemthefinger had the UAW out on strike against Delphi chanting threats to the life of Delphi’s chairman. Their close ally, Clueless Jenny, took no steps to reign them in for purposes of PR. VW promptly decamped to Tennessee. Hello Senator Corker, Goodbye Karl Lenin.


15 posted on 04/29/2009 2:47:09 AM PDT by RushLake (Democrats & Maobama have never met a terrorist they didn't like.)
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To: bruinbirdman
From the article:VW will be getting 50 miles per gallon or more in its small cars in a few years, and its adoption of dual-clutch transmissions and turbo- or super-charging is being followed by many around the world. The VW Jetta TDI (turbo diesel) is a huge hit with car testers in this country.

Will be getting 50 mpg or more in a few years? I've been getting 50+ mpg with my Jetta TDI for 6 years now. Their Turbo Diesels are great engines, but they are becoming more and more complex these days and that is what might kill the diesel here in the US ... idiotic regulations.

I know the VW dealer I deal with can barley keep a VW TDI on the lot. People want them badly. If VW would double the amount of TDI's they send to the US, they would easily sell them.

16 posted on 04/29/2009 3:05:17 AM PDT by CapnJack
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To: RushLake

Not only that but I also hear they are in the process of moving their HQ from Michigan to Ashburn, VA, very near where I work. No surprise that MI is circling the drain.


17 posted on 04/29/2009 3:46:37 AM PDT by Crolis (Kill your television!)
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To: DemforBush

VW has had quality problems for years. They’re almost like a German version of Chrysler, from what I’ve heard. I even had a friend a few years back complaining about the quality of her Audi. I would find that totally unacceptable in a luxury car.


18 posted on 04/29/2009 3:49:51 AM PDT by Hardastarboard (I long for the days when advertisers didn't constantly ask about the health of my genital organs.)
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To: Caipirabob
VW has not gotten past it's horrible electronics platform. It's reputation for problems in that area kill it's name among many knowledgeable buyers.

My stepmother has a "new" Beetle and while she loves it, it's had all sorts of electrical and mechanical problems over the years. Luckily she's got an extended warranty that handles everything, but I shudder the think of how much that car would have cost her over the last 4 years without that warranty. Most repair shops in her area refuse to do anything more complicated on the car than change the oil and filter. I seem to recall her telling me that she had to go to a dealer to get a headlight element replaced.

Mark

19 posted on 04/29/2009 4:04:31 AM PDT by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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To: bruinbirdman

In the article it says Porsche owns 51% of VW.


20 posted on 04/29/2009 4:04:54 AM PDT by arthurus (ACORN + Amnesty = Venezuelan Democracy in the USSSA)
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To: neb52

Other way around, I think.


21 posted on 04/29/2009 4:05:21 AM PDT by arthurus (ACORN + Amnesty = Venezuelan Democracy in the USSSA)
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To: MarkL

Did England’s Lucas move to Germany? Lucas electronics on British cars and motorcycles earned the company the title “Lucas-Prince of Darkness” many ears ago, at least for motorcycle riders.


22 posted on 04/29/2009 4:09:18 AM PDT by arthurus (ACORN + Amnesty = Venezuelan Democracy in the USSSA)
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To: arthurus
Did England’s Lucas move to Germany? Lucas electronics on British cars and motorcycles earned the company the title “Lucas-Prince of Darkness” many ears ago, at least for motorcycle riders.

I'm familiar with the jokes, and as we all know, the very best jokes are always based on the truth! I had a friend in high school who was restoring an old MG, and he really sharpened his cursing skills working on the electronics on that car!

The "Prince of Darkness" jokes are classic! "Why do the Brits drink warm beer? Because Lucas makes the refrigerators!"

Mark

23 posted on 04/29/2009 4:31:35 AM PDT by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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To: arthurus

Yes you are correct.


24 posted on 04/29/2009 4:34:36 AM PDT by neb52
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To: Hardastarboard
I even had a friend a few years back complaining about the quality of her Audi.

The two people within my circle who own Audis will never buy another because of the frequency and cost of repairs. Great cars when they work, but mechanical and electrical glitches are making their owning experiences the proverbial death by a thousand cuts.

My own interaction with VW only extends to a customized '61 Frankenbeetle that looked cool but combined the comfort of riding on a lawn chair inside a cattle watering tank with the reliability of an Arlen Specter promise. It was abandoned in a snowbank one night after one too many failures to charge one too many batteries, and was one of the very few cars that was never once mourned over by at least one member of the family.

Mr. niteowl77

25 posted on 04/29/2009 4:40:15 AM PDT by niteowl77 (You wanted him, and now you have got him. I say, "Good day to you," America.)
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To: bruinbirdman
Volkswagen is a major player in the East - Asia, that is. Its also the biggest auto seller in mainland China. Auto sales in China were 1 million in 2008 and are expected to double in 2009. That's more than USA sales. Volkswagen is expected to be #1 there in 2009 also. Toyota is #2 in China. Sales of autos are ecpected to double each year doe the next several years. Its a wide open market. China is only now coming on line with domestic auto brands - and the quality of these is very bad at this point. But its improving.
Foreign auto brands build in China through partnerships with Chinese companies. So that means a technology steal for China.
26 posted on 04/29/2009 4:44:23 AM PDT by Tainan (Where's my FOF Indicator?)
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood

I used to drive a Porsche (VW) 914. From a driving perspective, my favorite care ever. Fast, engine in back and so low to the ground. Loved the removable top too. However, its reliability sucked. The problem was:
1. Air cooled engine—very prone to vapor lock
2. Fuel injection system broke every 4 months like clockwork—eventually, I got smart and started carrying replacement relays around.

I wish they’d build ‘em again with modern technology. I’d buy one.


27 posted on 04/29/2009 4:51:54 AM PDT by rbg81 (DRAIN THE SWAMP!!)
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To: bruinbirdman

I’ll take Lamborghini, Audi, Porsche over Toyota any day…


28 posted on 04/29/2009 4:55:04 AM PDT by GoShow (Peoples Car)
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To: arthurus

Try this, he he

http://www.kitcar.com/articles-kitcar/humordept/lucas-prince.html

Regards

alfa6 ;>}


29 posted on 04/29/2009 4:57:00 AM PDT by alfa6
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To: MarkL

Well, I take back what I said about buying a “new” 914. These modern quality problems are exactly what I experienced back in the late 70s. Sounds like they learned nothing.


30 posted on 04/29/2009 4:58:40 AM PDT by rbg81 (DRAIN THE SWAMP!!)
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To: GoShow
I’ll take Lamborghini, Audi, Porsche over Toyota any day…

you're comparing apples to oranges. You'd compare Toyota with Volkswagen/Skoda/SEAT while you'd compare Audi to Lexus. Porsche as a sportscar doesn't really compare with Toyota and Lamborghini as a supersports car doesn't have any comparable Japanese brand, it's only rivals are Italian: Ferrari and British: McLaren and maybe that Swedish firm that starts with S (can't recall the name now).

Bentley as a superluxury car only compares with the Maybach or Rolls Royce or the DB6 from Aston Martin, no Japanese brand competes in that category.
31 posted on 04/29/2009 5:27:49 AM PDT by Cronos (Ceterum censeo, Mecca et Medina delenda est)
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To: alfa6
Lucas Electrics

ROFL.

Hubby's motorcycle? Dunstall Norton.

Our black cat? Lucas, prince of darkness.

32 posted on 04/29/2009 9:04:50 AM PDT by TheOldLady
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