Posted on 10/02/2008 5:30:51 PM PDT by BGHater
This time around, House leaders aren’t taking anything for granted.
Heading into Friday’s sequel to the historic Wall Street bailout vote, both Democratic and Republican House leaders were furiously counting votes, twisting arms, counting again and desperately trying to wrangle — and hold together — the necessary 218 votes on the Senate-amended bill.
And while leaders on both sides tried to project confidence, there were signs that trouble is still lingering on the horizon.
With the world watching, the House can ill afford to fail a second time in passing legislation giving the Treasury Department some $700 billion to buy troubled debt from banks in the hopes of unfreezing the credit market.
That is why House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) told reporters Thursday afternoon that she won’t bring the bill to the floor if leaders don’t have the votes to pass it.
The Senate amended and passed the original bailout plan overwhelming Wednesday evening, 74-25. And President Bush called more than three dozen House members Wednesday and Thursday.
The stock market closed down 348 points Thursday in a three-year low for the Dow Jones.
Democrats have been adamant that the onus is on the Republicans to deliver far more than the 65 votes they delivered on Monday, when the bill went down in a 205-228 ball of flames.
“It’s up to the GOP to do their part this time,” a Democratic leadership aide said.
In a sign of how tense the vote-counting might be, Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.) on Thursday admittedly backed down from a Wednesday assertion that the Republicans needed to deliver 100 votes for the bill to pass.
“On reflection, I have decided that the safer course and the more appropriate course is to say we need a significantly greater number of Republicans,” Hoyer said. “In other words, I don’t want to put an arbitrary number on it.”
But Democrats may have significant problems in their own backyard with a powerful bloc of fiscally conservative members of the Blue Dog Coalition who are fuming over the Senate’s inclusion of $149 billion in tax breaks that will go directly to the government’s books as deficit spending. Of the Blue Dogs’ 49 members, 23 voted for the bill Monday.
One possibility is that the bill’s Blue Dog supporters will still vote yes, but vote against the procedural rule needed to bring the bailout to the floor for a vote.
Rep. Allen Boyd (D-Fla.), a top Blue Dog leader, said he will oppose the rule Friday. He added that the topic of opposing the rule was widely discussed at a Blue Dog meeting Thursday, but no official Blue Dog position was taken, explaining, “You bet it came up.”
Rep. Jim Cooper (D-Tenn.) said that while most Blue Dogs intend to stay put on the bailout bill itself, “there are changes in nuance.” Rep. Jane Harman (D-Calif.), who voted for the rule on Monday but opposes the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT) patch without offsets, said she will vote for the bill, but was leaning toward voting no on the rule.
If the Blue Dogs protest the Senate’s changes by voting against their party on procedural questions, they risk derailing the bill and the entire agreement that got the bill through the Senate.
Because of the Blue Dog threat to vote against the procedural measure, Hoyer is asking Republican leaders to round up votes to pass the rule. Those procedural votes usually fall along party lines, and Republicans generally vote against them as a bloc.
And if Democratic leaders can’t prevent the Blue Dog protest, they will have to find an equal or greater number of Republicans to vote for the Democratic rule. That was only adding to migraines that leaders on both sides were experiencing on Thursday.
Even though a number of Republicans — including Reps. Zach Wamp (Tenn.), Lee Terry (Neb.), John Shadegg (Ariz.), Jim Gerlach (Pa.), Tim Murphy (Pa.) and Patrick Tiberi (Ohio) — told national media outlets they might switch their “no” votes to yes, Republicans leaders were having a difficult time as of Thursday afternoon convincing a large swath of their members to support the bill, according to some sources.
And in between meetings with Hoyer, GOP Whip Roy Blunt (Mo.) was calling members into his office by the truckload, supplementing a hard push by Minority Leader John Boehner (R-Ohio) and the White House.
“Everything we’re doing to reach out to members is predicated on the fact that failure is not an option,” said Blunt spokeswoman Antonia Ferrier.
But not all of those efforts were fruitful. Blunt’s visit to the meeting of the Republican Study Committee (RSC) was met with criticism that leadership was asking them to vote for a bill that members now considered “impure” because of alleged pork projects.
Two sources said that Rep. Don Manzullo (R-Ill.) raised his voice to Blunt at the RSC meeting, telling him, “We elect you to represent us, and you aren’t doing it.”
Rep. Steven LaTourette (R-Ohio) filed an amendment with the House Rules Committee late Thursday, seeking to “strip egregious pork projects from [the bailout bill] and save taxpayers nearly half a trillion dollars,” according to a release from the lawmaker.
At a press conference, LaTourette said he is among 23 Republicans who are pushing the amendment, including House Financial Services ranking member Spencer Bachus (Ala.). Twenty of the 23 voted against the bailout bill on Monday, LaTourette said.
Bachus made the case for the amendment at a Rules Committee hearing on Thursday. Democrats disputed the GOP “pork” claims and Financial Services Chairman Barney Frank (D-Mass.) noted that an adoption of the amendment would force the rescue bill back to the Senate for another vote.
At press time it was unclear if the House Rules Committee would allow amendments to the bailout legislation. Rep. Pete Hoekstra (R-Mich.), who voted against the bill on Monday and said he had returned to Washington a “soft yes,” disagreed with some of the Senate provisions inserted into the bill that he considered “pork.”
Hoekstra said he had spoken to Boehner earlier on Thursday and told him that the offending provisions needed to be removed.
And while Blunt said he believed the addition of the one-year fix to the AMT and billions in business tax breaks would be music to the ears of a great many Republicans, the top GOP vote-counter was not offering up any numbers.
Democrats were partially assuaged by the publicized vote-switching of some of their own members, including Reps. Emanuel Cleaver (D-Mo.) and Shelley Berkley (D-Nev.), but were still gun-shy on announcing their 140 yes votes were still all locked up.
Rep. James Clyburn (D-S.C.) said that a $1,000 credit for property taxes could attract some Congressional Black Caucus (CBC) members. The Democratic whip also said raising the limit on federal deposit insurance “may have satisfied one or two people,” and aides indicated that the Senate’s decision to include mental health parity may win over some votes in the CBC and Progressive Caucus.
Asked about her level of confidence in her own members, Pelosi said: “We’re looking to see if we still have the [140] votes, and right now they’re coming in pretty well.”
Clyburn started whipping Wednesday night by sending out a questionnaire on the Senate bill. As of press time, they still had 75 unanswered inquiries.
“We may lose people,” Hoyer said. “And I have informed the Republican leadership that that may be the case. Because, frankly, the things that were added on and the way they were added on essentially appeal to Republicans. “
Hoyer added that despite the importance of the bill, Democratic leaders weren’t prepared to turn the screws on their members who aren’t supportive.
Let me get this straight.
The shameless senators are sending over a pork laden bill, that not only includes the 700 Billion, but an additional 150 billion in Pork and some GOP house members, who voted no the first time are going to vote yes?
Throw the bums out.
Boehner, you stupid POS!!
I did a little arm twisting of my own today. I cut my credit card in half, called to inform them that they didn’t need to bill me any more, and called my congressman to tell him how I’m “freeing up some credit”.
Anything that Bawney Fphrank is against I am for!
Adopt theamendment and ram it back down the throats of those sell out senators!
No pork! This pig won't oink.
No bail out!
Let it die.
I intend on sending in a ‘imperfect’ tax return.
Send your congressman the bill thats what I did.
No F@CKING BAILOUT.
These now out in the open closet socialists are spending our moeny faster than a drunnken sailor on payday.
630 billion pumped out by the Fed hours before the first vote failed. Lots of billions for Fannie and Freddie. 25-30 billion for the automakers. 80 billion for AIG. 440 billion in a defense pork laden bill Saturday night.
These f@cks need to be voted out before we are all screwed. I don’t say it lightly, they are trying to thwart the will of the people they are supposed to serve. It’s a f@cking coup on the American people.
This might be the best news I've seen in a couple weeks.
Any Republican who votes for it after Monday ought to be dragged out of his office and horse whipped.
I raised my exemptions to make sure I owe them money.
As ridiculous as this may appear on its face, knowing our pubbies the way we have come to know them, this is very sadly true. We are being sold out not by dims, but by our own side. Sheesh
The Senators are laughing at all of us.
If this was the end of the world, they would be fighting for the basic financial rescue.
I dont think it will pass. regardless of the conventional wisdom, I think we are in for another surprise.
>> Hoyer is asking Republican leaders to round up votes to pass the rule
Tell him to attempt a rapid aerial seduction of a rolling perforated pastry.
[AJ shakes head profoundly disturbed trying to understand who is on which side here?]
This article suggests this bailout vote isn’t a done deal. Blue dog dems and conservative republicans are bucking at the way the Senate conducted themselves. We may prevent this junk from passing after all.
Fear works on sheep; the Gov't knows this quite well.
What did Bush say about all the pork the senate added to the bill.
My guess, not much if anything.
Kudos to Congressman Manzullo (who along with Congressman Roskam has the higest conservative rating of the Illinois delegation) for being blunt to Blunt and telling him like it is. We need more like him in Congress. Sure wish McClintock was in office during this vote.
Can't afford to have more "true conservatives" like Shadegg caving on this one.
I can't believe they want to pass a monster bill and leave the same people in charge who are the culprits of the failures of the system.
Note who votes for this abomination. Then vote against them in November. Teach these bastards a lesson. Next step should be to start secessions. We are watching the empire kill itself.
Tueasday morning, Dubya said " It doesn't matter what path a bill takes to become a law, ...what matters is that we get a law"
So apparently the method or cost doesn't matter..see we just need another law.
Bush is a failure and a total let-down. He should be impeached. It’s just that the Dims have the reasoning completely wrong.
I thought they succeeded the first time.
The other threat on the table I heard in the rules committee hearing is that the Senate adjourned so they cannot come back and consider changes and the Administration won't accept changes anyway. In effect, it is a take it or leave it deal.
Is that a threat, a dare, a promise, or one hell of an opportunity to walk away? Just because they are cowards doesn't mean they can't do what the people want and demand a better deal.
Then it took Sheila Jackson Lee to remind the House that this was a revenue bill originating in the Senate and they should protect their constitutional prerogatives and reject it. Strange bedfellows when we have to rely on Lee to read the constitution.
Whatever. If she is the one who saves my family $10,000, well, it is more than my republican "friends" have been doing.
I’m in the car business. We usually sell 180-210 used cars a month at the dealership, we sold only 124 units last month.
Those results were based on lower volume of visitors to the dealership because of the scare tactics of Bush and Paulson along with an assist from the democrats.
A large Chevy dealer went under but it wasn’t because of the credit problem. It was due to bad business practices by the dealer that GM finally pulled the plug on them and wouldn’t sell him any more cars.
I called Senator Cornyn’s office to complain about his vote and I asked him about the ratio of calls. The staffer said they are not releasing that information.
I paid off my credit cards last month....and got a mailbox full of begging letters complete with free checks for no interest till end '09 from the CC companies.....(both V and MC stock down heavy today).
The Blue Dog Coalition, a group of House Democrats that bills itself as fiscally conservative, split on Monday’s failed vote on the package. One of the Blue Dogs’ leaders said not to count on their support Friday, when the House is expected to hold another vote, because the changes would further deplete the U. S. Treasury.
“Harry Reid is making a huge mistake,” said Rep. Mike Ross of Arkansas, one of the group’s cochairmen, referring to the Senate majority leader. “We’re not going to be held hostage.” To sweeten the bailout bill, especially for some of the 133 Republicans who voted against it Monday, the Senate added an extension of expiring tax credits that are popular among environmentalists and businesses and added a “patch” to the alternative minimum tax that would keep the number of taxpayers subject to it — about 4 million — constant.
That has put pressure on the Blue Dogs, who hold the House “paygo” rule dear. The rule stipulates that any changes in taxes or spending be offset, so the final result has a neutral budget effect.
Although the group has no official position, Ross predicted some of the Blue Dogs would vote against the package unless the tax changes were offset. On Monday, 25 of the group’s 49 members voted for the bill.
“Harry Reid is dead wrong to attach other things to this bill,” Ross said. “This should be a stand-alone, up-or-down vote.” In a news conference Wednesday afternoon, Reid, a Nevadan, warned that quick passage of a rescue plan was urgent, in order to avoid further deterioration of the nation’s credit markets.
We gots too many cunswervatives goin wobbly on us these days.
The sad thing is that is a time when something should be done. But not this bill. While they waist all this time on the China bailout we are loosing precious time getting done what needs to be done.
Its a stick-up !!!
WE MUST RUN ON THE BANKS!
Bloomberg
November 20, 2007
Shareholders in the securities industry are having their worst year since 2002, losing $74 billion of their equity, but that won’t stop Wall Street from paying a record $38 billion in bonuses.
The money, split among about 186,000 workers at Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, Merrill Lynch, Lehman Brothers and Bear Stearns, equates to an average of $201,500 per person, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.
The five biggest U.S. securities firms paid $36 billion to employees last year.
The bigger bonus pool derives in part from a record $9 billion of fees for arranging acquisitions and $5 billion for underwriting initial public offerings and sales of junk bonds, the most lucrative securities, Bloomberg data show.
WE MUST RUN ON THE BANKS
These are the same banks that charge you 100 dollars in fees for a 5 dollar mistake in your checking!
The same banks that lie about a credit crisis:
the amount of all bank credit at all commercial banks, which is reported weekly. For the most recent week reported, the one that ended on September 9, this credit amounted to $9,406 billion, which is only slightly less than the all-time peak of $9,485 reached in the week that ended on March 26, 2008
THE SAME BANKS THAT WANT MAINSTREET TO BAILOUT THE ARAB STREET, THE CHINESE STREET THE RUSSIAN STREET AND EVERYOTHER STINKIN FOREIGN STREET IN THE WORLD!
the Fed announced $630 billion in new central bank credits Monday, >>>half of it to central banks abroad<<<. And oh, the FDIC guaranteed to Citigroup all losses beyond the first 13% on Wachovia’s mortgage book, which is around $300 billion.
HALF! OF IT TO CENTRAL BANKS A B R O A D!?!?!?
IF YOU DON’T RUN ON THE BANKS, THE BANKS AND D.C. WILL RUN OVER U.S.
Fear of losing money is the only language D.C. understands.
Boehner, Cantor and Shadegg are worse than dead weight.
does anyone know where there are some actual numbers on sub prime loans? i.e. how much money is out on them and who has them (actual people, speculators, real estate agents, builders/investors)?
Try as they might, you can't climb out until you find and reach a bottom.
NO idea....and if you ask somebody in the industry, they’ll tell you that there’s no way of knowing because of the way that the loans were converted into securities and then sold on Wall Street.
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