Norman M. Murburg
Posted on 09/17/2008 9:41:54 AM PDT by Rebelbase
FORT BRAGG (AP) — The Army says a Special Forces trainee found dead this summer during a land navigation exercise in North Carolina was bitten by a poisonous water moccasin, also known as a cottonmouth.
The military said Wednesday the autopsy of 20-year-old Pfc. Norman M. Murburg of Dade City, Fla., ruled out heat or dehydration as a cause of death. Murburg was bitten multiple times while training at the Hoffman training area near Fort Bragg's Camp Mackall.
Soldiers began searching for Murburg when he didn't return from the exercise. His body was found June 10. Authorities met with Murburg's family to explain the autopsy results.
Maj. Gen. Thomas Csrnko, who commands the U.S. Army John F. Kennedy Special Warfare Center, said the death reinforces the dangerous training for Green Beret candidates.
What a terrible way to die. Prayers for his family.
It took 4 months to determine the cause of death?
Horrible! Poor young man.
A water skiing buddy of mine wiped out in a nest of these critters. After pulling him out of the reeds he died in the boat heading back to shore. Never had a chance.
Cottonmouths are dangerous and will strike multiple times when threatened.
Prayers for the family and the other solders training in these dangerous conditions.
These snakes can and will bite anything, dead or alive ~.
They are not particularly aggressive, but you can run into them in the darndest places.
How very sad. Prayers for his family and friends. Thanks to the soldier for giving his life for the people of the USA.
Norman M. Murburg
I am so sorry to hear this. It’s the reptilian equivalent of being attacked by a tiger. They are aggressive biters that will pursue anything they consider to be a threat or prey, and they are capable of attacking multiple times...
Prayers for this young man’s family - may they be comforted knowing that his sacrifice for his country was not forgotten.
I have very few creatures I will shoot on site - but the cottonmouth (water moccasin) in one of those. However, not all water snakes are water moccasins, so I’ve gone to great lengths to learn to ID them properly. I also have tried to leave turtles and other snakes in my ponds to help control the water moccasin population naturally.
In high school...we had a local kid...around 16....who was water skiing and ran into a nest of them...he was dead within ten minutes. In Bama....I’ll bet five or six guys die each year from incidents like that. They don’t collect data like that because it’d scare folks too much.
“They are not particularly aggressive, but you can run into them in the darndest places.”
Have you ever encountered one? Ive been attacked in my canoe more than once. I assure you I was doing nothing to provoke them other than passing through the area. They are quite aggressive and easy to trigger.
Hoffman is where the land navigation and (sometimes) the “events” for SF Selection take place..as well as large portions of the SF “Q” course...humped those sandy hills mucho...more than once was “busting a draw” only to realize that if i got hurt they’d find my body 6 months later if my family was lucky....
I suspect it took four months because one would expect an SF trainee to know how to self treat a snakebite and especially that once bitten, to either immediately kill the snake or, get away from it because the snake will continue to strike.
Other questions would be was there any evidence the soldier attempted self treatment?
Was there any evidence the soldier attemted to seek outside help?
Was there any evidence the soldier was not alone?
Agree. They do not run away like most snakes they stand their ground. Just like a snapping turtle. But, they are not usually deadly. Unusual. They are everywhere in the South. Espically around water. I killed 5 this year 20 feet from my front door. So not tell Moureen Dowd as she would call me a red-neck woman.
I’m from Mississippi, you get stoked by a nest of them and you’re done for.
I’ve see nests of em look like Medusa’s head
modeled after my ex-wife
I doubt they were out actively hunting down canoes!~
I have twice seen cottonmouths attack completely unprovoked. The first time, my brother was just about to step out of a boat when one came within a split second of getting him. Our cousin saw the snake and hit him with an oar just as he was striking. I can still see that white mouth wide open as he was about to hit.
The second time was this year. I saw one in my yard, went back in and got a pistol and to my surprise when I got within about 10 feet of him he turned and came for me. I had rat shot in the pistol and hit him. I had to shoot him again with a solid to finish him off.
They are aggressive as all get out.
A cottonmouth is one of the few things I will actually RUN away from as fast as I can.......
Where did that happen?
I can relate to this.
I got bit by a cottonmouth in 1959. We lived out in the boonies in Annapolis, Maryland and one morning one had come up through the septic system and was in the toilet. Since I was a kid and dumber than a rock, I tried to fish the snake out. It bit me and I then got to find out about anti-venom shots, tetanus immunizations, and several other things that were unpleasant.
I was really sick for about a week.
I've had this bastards chase me out of the water. If a mother moccasin has a nest of babies nearby watch out! We used to go around the beaches and hack them with machetes around the lake I grew up on. They eventually retreated to the south side of the lake where there were no houses.
My neighbors back in TX always advised to keep well away from creeks in our area, and that these were agressive
dangerous beasts unlike the copperheads.
Condolences on the loss of a brave man.
I guess another question investigators might have had concerned the location of the bites. Were the bites in unusual locations for snake bites?
My dear grandson, just out of a 15 monther in Afghanistan (second Vanity Fair Article in this issue (Oct) by Sebastian Junger on them - BATTLE CO., is headed for that training in Nov.
It puzzles me why they are still going through the jungle warfare training of the Vietnam era - when we are fighting in deserts and mountains?
To me, it's an unnecessary risk...not to mention training for the wrong kind of terrain...
An old girlfriend was walking down a lakeside road in southern Virginia when she saw a cottonmouth slide out across the street in front of her about 20 yards away. She stopped and waited but the snake stopped when she did. After a minute or two, she slowly started walking to the farside of the road and the snake moved across to the same side. She stopped and then started walking back toward the side the snake came from. The snake reversed course and started coming toward her. She backed up and was pondering her next move when over the hill came a nice big Chevy 4x4 truck driven by a local teenager. The truck pulled up and slammed on the brakes right over top of the snake grinding it into the pavement. He then backed up again and rested his back wheels on the snake and peeled out leaving a burning rubber-encrusted carcass.
He then pulled up to my girl friend, tipped his John Deere hat and said, “There, he won’t be giving you any more problems. Have a nice day!”
True story.
Prayers indeed for this brave young man and the family he leaves behind. A tragic and horrible way to die.
Which begs the question: why would we want to keep such a species of snake alive?
I say put a bounty on each cottonmouth head, and wipe the bastards out once and for all.
Plenty of other water snakes to take their place.
I doubt you have ever encountered one in the wild. They are quite aggressive. If you want to stick to your Penguins can tap dance utopian’s belief that these snakes aren’t aggressive then go right ahead.
I grew up in rattlesnake/copperhead country ~ you could encounter as many as 4 kinds of rattlers, several subspecies of copperheads (differentiated only by highly educated herpitologists), and, if you got down to Posey County, you could encounter a cottonmouth every now and then.
Best way to deal with poisonous snakes is to STAY AWAY. Find out what habitat they like locally, and don't go there.
In India highly poisonous snakes inhabit and love essentially the same habitat as human beings Besides, they are bigger! This leads to a higher number of snakebite deaths than here. However, my friends from India say they are taught the same lessons I learned ~ stay out of their habitat PLUS don't let your neighborhood get overrun with rats and mice or you will attract a big snake!
I grew up in rattlesnake/copperhead country ~ you could encounter as many as 4 kinds of rattlers, several subspecies of copperheads (differentiated only by highly educated herpitologists), and, if you got down to Posey County, you could encounter a cottonmouth every now and then.
Best way to deal with poisonous snakes is to STAY AWAY. Find out what habitat they like locally, and don't go there.
In India highly poisonous snakes inhabit and love essentially the same habitat as human beings Besides, they are bigger! This leads to a higher number of snakebite deaths than here. However, my friends from India say they are taught the same lessons I learned ~ stay out of their habitat PLUS don't let your neighborhood get overrun with rats and mice or you will attract a big snake!
I remember back in the late 50’s or maybe 60’s an Army Ranger training at Eglin AFB was bitten by a coral snake. They literally had a jet fighter fly in anti-venom from New Orleans. The guy survived.
I was fishing with my brother in law and he poked one with a fishing rod. It chased him for 10 minutes until I finally shot it. It's the only time I've ever seen a snake chase someone.
I wonder if these reports of a skier getting into a “nest” are described that way because of the responders (or the victim) seeing numerous bite marks all over the victim. I did not know that cottonmouths would bite repeatedly - and would also have assumed multiple snakes.
I’m wary of rattlesnakes but not really afraid. I might need to start being afraid of cottonmouths!
I so hate cottonmouths. It’s one snake you can smell when its close. Kill everyone of them I see.
I’ve encountered them a few times, but only on land and found them to be rather timid there. Was within about 18 inches of one this past summer before I realized what was going on. It stayed perfectly still as I backed up and slithered off quite fast as soon as I turned my eyes from it.
SF train for ALL conflicts, not just the headline grabbing ones. Had a compatriot just complete SF Q course and is sporting the Green Beret now. He was violently ill for almost three weeks because of e-coli poisoning and still had events to complete. He managed to complete it while losing about 30 pounds.
The nest you describe is most likely a bunch of males swarming over one female. Cotton Mouth Gangbang.
“one morning one had come up through the septic system and was in the toilet.”
Not a pretty thought.
Prayers for the family of this serviceman.
The biggest problem with that snake is when a snake dealer lets one of 'em loose in the neighborhood. First folks to move to a motel for the night while the cops, et al, hunt for the snake are the Africans and the Indians.
They know.
Compared to a copperhead dozing under leaves in late Fall in Southern Indiana, a cottonmouth is probably quite aggressive.
Hmm ~ and how fast was that snake “chasing”?
I thought you still had to be Spec 4 or higher just to attend Q course. Did that change?
Please forgive my ignorance.
Can you tell me the type of water your friend got caught in?
For instance ,clear lake, murky lake, sort of swampy or what?
I am constantly in the water and would care to avoid these critters.
Sorry for the soldier heros death,
Prayers for him and his family.
I’ve killed several of these over the past few years in my yard in Tampa. Usually a steel rake does the job. Last year, my dog killed one (almost, I finished it off). Not sure how he did it, but RikiTikiTavi comes to mind, only in the shape of a 95lb. Belgian Malinois.
I believe the young man was in SF selection - which means he hadn’t entered training yet. Land nav is done at night and by themselves...he was probably far from any help.
My son has been through SF selection.
Yes - they take PFC soldiers into selection. They enter the army through MOS 18x - Ft. Benning basic, Airborne and then to Ft. Bragg for Selection prep and then Selection. The x in 18 is replaced by the MOS they select once they get through selection and other training they have to go through. Both of my sons entered the army with an 18x contract.
“I remember back in the late 50’s or maybe 60’s an Army Ranger training at Eglin AFB was bitten by a coral snake.”
In basic at Ft.Polk the instruction for most snake bites, the Rattler, the Cottonmouth, and the Copperhead was to summon a drill Sargent immediately in an effort to save our life, they also instructed us that if we were bit by a Coral snake, to just sit down, light a cigarette and die.
Prayers for this young soldier's family...
“They are not particularly aggressive, but you can run into them in the darndest places.”
I’ve had them try to crawl in the boat with me. I had one crawl out on the bank next to me when I was night fishing. When I turned my light on it was looking at me with a bream in it’s mouth. It was a Jerry Clower moment that caused me to ruin a good fishing rod.
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