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John R. Lott, Jr.: Handgun bans don't cut crime
National Post ^ | June 25, 2008 | John R. Lott, Jr.

Posted on 06/25/2008 3:02:54 PM PDT by neverdem

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To: Eaker
well until i get other than anecdotal evidence you'll just have to take my 2nd-hand tales. but i will say that i received a masters degree in criminal justice and took classes with one of the most respected experts on all-things-firearms in the country.

this professor was fair and accurate and cut through all the BS and got down to the real facts about guns. he is apolitical when it comes to this topic.

he held up lott's work and told us to read it but warned us that none of his numbers could be replicated. lott basically pulled it out of thin air. but that fact does not necessarily dismiss his findings. it is true that those cities with the strictest gun laws also have the highest levels of gun violence.

but lott is a hired gun (pun intended). look at his list of colleges. and he just leaves after 3 years so he doesn't go up for tenure. yale, chicago, maryland, etc... his salary always paid by some foundation.

21 posted on 06/25/2008 5:33:59 PM PDT by thefactor (the innocent shall not suffer nor the guilty go free...)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy; DieHard the Hunter
If they were patient, just a few martial artists could cleanse a large area of its worst offenders, with the authorities none the wiser. And if trained in another country, there would be nothing about them to even draw suspicion.

An undercover, renegade Guardian Angel squad?

I like it!

;-)

22 posted on 06/25/2008 5:44:27 PM PDT by Grizzled Bear ("Does not play well with others.")
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To: fanfan
Thanks for the ping. If I can quote the Late Mayor Young right, as he said on CBC during an interview, I'll be dammed if I'll take guns away from Detroiters, while the KKK are in the woods up North.
23 posted on 06/25/2008 5:54:25 PM PDT by Springman (Why is ? coming up, when I use ')
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To: thefactor

IOWs you’re spreading (or starting) an unsourced rumor.


24 posted on 06/25/2008 9:13:37 PM PDT by TigersEye (Berlin 1936. Olympics for murdering regimes. Beijing 2008.)
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To: TigersEye

you can call it whatever you wish. i feel no need to justify it. i am just extending my well-informed opinion. not blindly excepting lott’s data as gospel. that’s what this forum is for. i’ve been around long enough to know that this is ok.


25 posted on 06/26/2008 2:43:05 AM PDT by thefactor (the innocent shall not suffer nor the guilty go free...)
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To: thefactor
“all the data for his seminal work were proven to be pretty much made up. that is why he gave his data away to anyone who asked for it. he knew no one else would be able to replicate the numbers.”

That is a pretty serious accusation. The worst that I have seen from the academic studies is that they show no change when states enact concealed carry laws.

The fact that Lott releases his data shows integrity, not the lack of it. Releasing data is what allows other people to replicate your work.

26 posted on 06/26/2008 5:04:18 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: thefactor

Lott gained considerable credibility with me in 1996. A couple of years previously he had released his classic study that showed that when states enacted concealed carry legislation, violent crime against people declined while property crime went up.

As I recall, he predicted that the murder rate would drop about 5% in the first year after enactment.

Arizona enacted a CCW law, and the murder rate dropped about 5% the next year!

It is rare that a scientist can make a prediction on a “social” issue such as this, and have it hold up.

I was impressed.


27 posted on 06/26/2008 5:10:07 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: thefactor
“he's a serial professor who spends 3 years at different prestigious universities and his salary is paid for by pro-gun groups.

this is all common knowledge throughout academia. but he publishes and he's free so schools love him.”


This sounds so similar to the “Global Warming” or “Climate Change” “deniers” treatment. Academia has lost a great deal of credibility with me. The political “spin” seems so much more important than the truth.

A person does not publish his data to be discredited. People withhold data to prevent being discredited, such as a number of the supporters of man made global warming. The Olin foundation at the University of Chicago is hardly a "pro-gun group". This is the same tar the supporters of "climate change" use. Don't try to disprove the facts, attack the funding source!

28 posted on 06/26/2008 5:46:01 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: thefactor

Sure, it’s OK. I’m just calling it what it is. An unfounded rumor.


29 posted on 06/26/2008 9:42:16 AM PDT by TigersEye (Berlin 1936. Olympics for murdering regimes. Beijing 2008.)
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To: thefactor

So where did you get this degree in Criminal Justice and who was your teacher? If you have evidence that my salary is “always paid by some foundation,” please provide it. Thank you.


30 posted on 06/26/2008 8:36:34 PM PDT by JohnRLott
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To: thefactor

So where did you get this degree in Criminal Justice and who was your teacher? If you have evidence that my salary is “always paid by some foundation,” please provide it. Thank you.


31 posted on 06/26/2008 8:36:34 PM PDT by JohnRLott
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To: JohnRLott

did the olin foundation pay your salary at the univeristy of chicago?


32 posted on 06/27/2008 6:39:52 AM PDT by thefactor (the innocent shall not suffer nor the guilty go free...)
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To: JohnRLott
Thanks so much for popping in on to deal with this issue yet again.

You must really tire of the libelous lies being told about you, sir.

I for one shall be eternally grateful to you for the yoemans work you've done on this subject.

We'll see if this poster can produce a shred of evidence to back up his assertions.

My best to you, sir.

Celebrate Heller!

L

33 posted on 06/27/2008 6:45:25 AM PDT by Lurker (Islam is an insane death cult. Any other aspects are PR, to get them within throat-cutting range.)
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bump


34 posted on 06/27/2008 8:41:08 AM PDT by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: JohnRLott

Thank you sir, for participating in Freerepubic. Your presence adds a great deal to our discussions.


35 posted on 06/29/2008 5:51:10 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: neverdem

Exactly Right!

They create more victims!


36 posted on 06/29/2008 5:53:36 PM PDT by Randy Larsen (Arrogance IS my virtue!)
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To: thefactor; JohnRLott

“well until i get other than anecdotal evidence you’ll just have to take my 2nd-hand tales. but i will say that i received a masters degree in criminal justice and took classes with one of the most respected experts on all-things-firearms in the country.

this professor was fair and accurate and cut through all the BS and got down to the real facts about guns. he is apolitical when it comes to this topic.”

Somehow, while getting your master’s degree, you must have avoided any courses in basic English or grammar.

I got my MBA from Pepperdine. We were taught to never try to bs our readers with unnamed sources like your so called professor and where he taught. Anyone with the poor English shown in your reply would never be allowed in any real master degree program. My 9 year old grand daughter has a better command of English than you do.

So what was the name of this professor and at what university did he make those statements about Dr Lott?


37 posted on 07/27/2008 8:47:48 AM PDT by Grampa Dave (Obama gets the special-ed treatment as our untouchable affirmative action candidate)
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