Posted on 06/19/2008 8:39:17 AM PDT by JRochelle
A grand jury is scheduled to meet in Eldorado, Texas, next week and could begin considering evidence from the raid on the Fundamentalist LDS Church's YFZ Ranch. The Eldorado Success newspaper reported Wednesday that the Schleicher County grand jury is expected to begin considering the first criminal cases that could come from the April 3 raid.
The Texas Attorney General's Office declined to comment on any proceedings.
"In Texas, grand jury proceedings are secret proceedings by law," attorney general's spokesman Jerry Strickland said in an e-mail Wednesday to the Deseret News. "We can not and will not comment on such issues."
The grand jury last met on June 2, when 18 indictments were handed down — none of them related to the YFZ Ranch. The attorney general's office has been appointed as a special prosecutor to handle any criminal cases coming out of the raid. Texas authorities seized approximately 1,000 boxes of evidence during their raid on the YFZ Ranch.
Recently, the Utah Department of Health was asked to provide birth certificates of specific people within the FLDS Church. The request was made by Gary Engels, a special investigator for the Mohave County, Ariz., Attorney's Office, which has prosecuted FLDS members in the past for underage marriages and has a case pending against sect leader Warren Jeffs.
"He had a spreadsheet of names of couples, presumably from the Texas community, I believe," said Jeff Duncan, the director of Utah's Office of Vital Records and Statistics. Duncan told the Deseret News that no children's birth certificates were requested.
"In every instance, it was a couple," he said.
Polygamists/Pervs Alert Ping!
Have you seen this little tidbit?
“As the Texas investigation unfolded, Duncan said the Vital Statistics office in St. George received several requests to issue delayed birth certificates for children born more than a year ago. The requests, forwarded to Salt Lake City, were refused because information provided to document the births and the child’s parents was insufficient, he said.”
http://www.sltrib.com/Polygamy/ci_9625046
I guess the child molesters are in CYA mode now.
Get ‘em Texas with all you got!
Amazing. Are these people having home births?
I have no problem with home births but if a midwife was present I would think she would have info on how to get birth certificates! Thats kind of important.
Are they considering charges against FLDS, the state and local government, or both?
According to witnesses, women (and little GIRLS, of course) are forced to have their babies at home without any painkillers, and if they scream they get punished.
I doubt its what you are wishing for!
I doubt you know what I wish. I want to see the guilty on both sides punished. So far, the guilty on both sides have not faced the punishments already meted out.
The only ones that should be in front of a grand jury are the Nazis at Texas CPS. I'd put them all in orange jumpsuits for what they did and then send them to re-education camps.
Little girls being forced to “marry” drooling old men IS “sex slavery”.
I bet you’re one of those “men” who populate FR who think women have no right to their OWN husband, and don’t have a right not to be beaten and abused, and think women shouldn’t be voting.
Wait...women can vote?
Who authorized that?
Could, might, should? Wishful thinking. I remember the utter giddyness when the last grand jury handed out 11 indictments, far higher than the usual. Of course, amidst the media and cabal hysteria nobody checked or verified if those 11 indictments were in fact flds related. Once it was discovered that NONE were flds related, I laughed at the twisting and the disappointment of those living their lives hoping that little girls were raped so they can be vindicated in their love of all things government and all thing anti-Mormon.
It occurs to me that by delaying the birth certificate for a year or more would allow the FLDS to pass the child born to a minor as being born to an older sister wife.
Perhaps the state should require DNA matching of the child and alleged bio parents before issuing a delayed certificate.
“I remember the utter giddyness when the last grand jury handed out 11 indictments, “
IIRC, it was 18 indictments.
“So far, the guilty on both sides have not faced the punishments already meted out.”
So far, no perpetrator has faced a trial, little lone found guilty.
We will have to wait and see what comes out of this Grand Jury hearing.
Maybe the average was 11 and the huge number of 18 sent some here into hypocritical glee.
But the punishment has all been placed upon the mothers and the children.
What punishment?
Yeah, I am sure some think having your children ripped from you, separated across the state isn’t punishment,,, if you aren’t from the right social class or religion. I see.
Yep the Grand Jury meets every so often as scheduled, nothing new about that. And they could be reviewing many different potential felonies. I guess now each scheduled meeting will have the speculators our guessing what is being reviewed in the proceedings.
I don't know normal meeting cycle for that counties grand jury, maybe a couple of times a month? Let them schedule a couple of days in a row and the frenzy will really escalate.
You believe in leprechauns and you think FReepers are gullible?!
To ‘look’ at the issue, in just the terms you stated, requires one to close their mind to all of the history, and investigation, all of the statements of ex-members, and...
to have no concern for the Constitutional rights of those FLDS men whose children and wives were ‘ripped’ from them, along with their property and money, and whisked away to Eldorado Texas.
I wish the FLDS women and children had not gone through being separated, but they are also being returned.
Maybe the CPS did overreact, but the system of Justice has corrected their error.
Now, as more and more of the evidence is nearing the end of the analysis phase, the Grand Jury will decide what charges are to come out of this.
Usually it is the case that a victim of government abuse is limited by the amount of money they can spend on lawyers, or the ‘high’ visibility of the case.
In this case, the FLDS members have it all. State supplied lawyers, FLDS lawyers, a fund to draw on of over $100 million, and a high profile case.
Maybe now, justice can be done for all involved. No matter who ends up being charged.
Taking away the children from their mothers.
I can tell you find the state the victim in all this, but don’t shed any tears okay. It is hilarious to watch you justify the state’s eggregious actions with, as I will paraphrase “it is okay cause they are home now” bullcrap. You don’t think any damage was inflicted while children were held in captivity within the state temporary foster system. Oh, and “the lucky FLDS people have so much money so it doesn’t matter”, “they have it all”. Again to paraphrase your logic. You never cease to amaze me with the tortured way of thinking. Entertainment at its finest from another dimension of critical thinking.
Well hang your hat on the “indictments” sure to come. I remember some clown from another website proclaiming Karl Rove was going to be indicted in 24 hours, 3 or 4 years ago. Keep hope alive!
Then there's the question of the integrity of the driver's licenses and so forth some of these people presented as ID ~ certainly a claim of date of birth should be readily backed up by the state eh?
You'all are goin' down, ya hear? Down!!!
I've read all the writings of Joseph Smith and not once did he advance the idea that the color "red" should be prohibited, or that children should be denied toys.
I think you are seriously mistaken to persist in your erroneous belief that these people have anything at all to do with Mormonism.
I think you know exactly the group I am talking about that you kindly posited distance from in another thread just today. The anti-Mormon brigade that has used this non-affiliated case to stamp another notch in their years of efforts here. I don’t make that correlation to Mormons, that is the cabal’s effort. Thankfully, I don’t see the little (f)LDS label being thrown out all the time anymore. Except when you brought it up.
But you knew all that anyway...
Can you cite for me either the Utah or Texas Statute which makes failing to report a birth a crime?
Thanks.
L
Now, should it be a crime? What do you think.
You can keep pretending that today's F(lds) has something to do with Mormon tradition, but you would be wrong to do so.
How many of these children were taken away from their real mothers and fathers from Utah, and Bountiful, B.C., by Warren Jeffs?
As far as the CPS taking children away from their mothers, that is a matter of state law, and done whenever CPS investigates and has sufficient reason to believe there is a danger to the children.
In this case, the ‘parents’, for whatever reason, decided to lie about their names, and ages, and were just as responsible for causing their children to be taken so as to positively identify each child.
And the CPS allowed the mothers of infants to go ‘with’ their children, which is usually not allowed.
Nope.
L
Should she be allowed to force her parents to divulge the information (under penalty of perjury) in order to obtain rights to own income?
You can pretty much sue anyone for anything these days....
Should she be allowed to force her parents
Define 'force'.
How about your hypothetical kid hires a financial advisor to handle his or her money.
Problem solved. No state issued birth certificate needed.
L
I never made that assertion and you know that. The group that spends most of its time in the religion forum does a good job of that. Are you having a difficult time comprehending or just being particularly obtuse on purpose. I guess that behavior goes with the “good” Christian behavior on display here day after day. Reality is something concocted in a basement beset of tools. Not the sharpest ones either, yet they find their echo efforts and witty cleverness quite self congratulatory. Pat yourself on the back. Woohoo.
Now, keep waiting for those indictments. Only 24 hours away! lol.
So, basically, the state presumed them guilty without a trial and took the children away from the mothers who were not even accused. What part of this is correct under your interpretation of the Constitution?
Warren Jeffs was taking this bunch back to 9th Century Scandinavian standards for pete's sake.
"Force" can be anything you wish. Presumably she could avail herself of the services of the Mob and disgourge the information much faster than simply going to the court.
I assumed "force" was pursuant to a court order and her parents would jump at the judge's order, didn't you?
Who cares as long as they follow the laws of this country? I reckon the Amish live in a century long gone by.
The ‘state’ received complaints the children were being abused. The ‘state’ created the CPS and the statutes that are used in following the law, and performing investigations, and allow for taking the children away from their parents.
>>”...I laughed at the twisting and the disappointment of those living their lives hoping that little girls were raped so they can be vindicated in their love of all things government and all thing anti-Mormon.”<<
Perfect diagnosis, doc, just perfect!
How pathetic. I never said a SINGLE thing you allege in your disgusting diatribe.
“Mrs Nazi Fascist pig”
That was uncalled for.
You must understand what is most important to these folks. Not the war, not the election, not gas prices, not the economy, not our manufacturing infrastructure, not illegal immigration, not the possibility of a Obama presidency, etc, etc. No, the most important thing to human existence is to rid the world and convert people from the evils of Mormonism. The constitution is a mere rag infringing upon those religious purity goals.
“Sorry to tell ya that anything that was “found” during and after the raid by law enforcement can’t be used against them.”
And the fact that this is just what the article is about, that the Grand Jury is going to consider the ‘evidence’ that was found during the raid, seems to be in complete contradiction to your statement.
I don’t know how much evidence will be included or ruled tainted by the courts - the issue is complicated by the multiple raids, and the multiple warrants, at least one of which is from a US Court, not TX.
But none of that will stop a prosecuter from presenting the evidence, legal or not, to a grand jury.
Any challenges will come after indictment.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.