Posted on 05/19/2008 8:56:04 AM PDT by Smogger
LONG BEACH, Calif. -- Witnesses and police gave conflicting accounts of the fatal shooting of a terminally ill, mentally disabled man by Long Beach police over the weekend, and the shooting remained under investigation Monday.
Roketi Su'e, 46, was killed at about 7 p.m. Saturday in a cul-de-sac in the 3400 block of 67th Way in North Long Beach as he was walking home from a birthday party. Police said he fought with officers, but witnesses said he was shot as he lay unarmed on the sidewalk.
"He had no shirt on. He didn't have a weapon. He never carried a weapon," Su'e's niece, Lagilelei Saolotoga, 36, told the Los Angeles Times.
She said she did not see the shooting but ran to her uncle when she heard gunshots.
Family members said Su'e was terminally ill with lung cancer and had schizophrenia, but was nonviolent and like a child.
An angry crowd of about 40 people formed following the shooting in the largely Samoan community, and police called for backup. No one else was injured.
Police were originally called about a man behaving erratically, said Nancy Pratt of the Long Beach Police Department.
When two officers arrived, he charged at them and appeared unfazed by blows from police batons and a stun gun, causing officers to think he was under the influence of drugs or alcohol, she said.
Pratt told The Times Su'e grabbed one of the officer's batons and punched him in the face, causing them to fall to the ground. The other officer, "fearing for his partner's safety as well as his own," fired at Su'e, she said.
Witnesses and family members gave differing accounts.
"Police asked him to get down," Su'e's nephew, Uli Toomalatai, said. "He didn't listen (because he was) mentally ill, and they Tasered him. He went down, and after that they started kicking him."
Other witnesses told The Times that Su'e did not fight with the officers, but that when they got out of their squad car they hit his leg with their batons, Tasered him until he was on his stomach, and then one of the officers shot him up to six times in the back.
"As soon as the (police) car comes, the door is already half-way open and the man jumps out with his billy club. It was like they were already ready to come out and attack him and they didn't even know who he was," Chrystal Pagota, 23, one of those whose birthday was being celebrated, told the newspaper.
She said she saw one of the officers shot Su'e as he lay on the sidewalk.
Those who saw the shooting included about a dozen children who had been at the party, the neighbors said.
Tomicka Rollerson, 30, who hosted the party, told The Times she is a nurse, but that police would not let her help Su'e. Instead, she said an officer pointed a gun at her and she was later handcuffed and put in the backseat of a police car for about 20 minutes.
Su'e was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer and schizophrenia about two years ago and had returned to Long Beach from Texas after his wife died and was living with his sister, his nephew, La-auli To-omalatai, 37, of Arcadia, told The Times.
"He said, 'I don't want chemo. I just want to spend my last days with you,'" To-omalatai said.
Su'e sometimes had "bad days," when he would yell, and his family sometimes called police to take him overnight, To-omalatai told the newspaper.
"When the police showed up, he would go. He didn't resist," he said.
He said the family is considering legal action.
Su'e often played guitar at the First Samoan Christian Church in Long Beach, where To-omalatai's father is the pastor, he said.
Saolotoga told The Times that Su'e sometimes acted like a "yo-yo" -- yelling but then becoming happy again, with a childlike perspective on the world.
Neighborhood children told the newspaper he was playing with them minutes before the shooting.
"He was over there, dancing with us kids," said Allyze Pagota, 10.
Jamal Williams, 8, held a basketball he said Su'e gave him at the party before leaving to walk home.
He and Pagota said they both saw one of the two officers shoot Su'e.
This sounds a tad suspicious but you never know. Where is the ever present video cameras that usually pop up at these events? We are supposed to believe that two cops simply shot someone out of hand for no reason? I am all for stopping swat team raids and no knock warrants but this sounds like some witnesses are playing the race card to me.
His family is considering legal action because of Su'e's death, To-omalatai said, but they are not angry with police. "If there's some sort of training police can receive, that is all we want to be done," he said.
Two completely different stories - so my guess - someone is not telling the truth!!! /duh
Where the truth is is the big question. Either the guy was fighting police, or he wasn’t. If he was, then the police were justified. If he was truly just “laying there” and was shot (which I am quite suspicious of), then something is terribly wrong.
In Austin last year a female police officer shot an unarmed 18 yr old 5’3” suspect in the back as he lied down on the pavement because “she feared for her partner’s life.”
These weak women officers are a menace because when they are afraid their only defense or means of protection is a bullet.
I no longer dismiss witness reports, as police are out of hand way too much for a while now. And I have experienced it firsthand and video keeps popping up on WAY TOO MANY other events just like this one.
Cops no longer get my immediate support. I’ll wait and see.
I live in LB. Not the first questionable police shooting.
One day people who aren't minorities will realize that there are only two races when it comes to these types of incidents: Cop and Non-cop.
Furthermore, one day people will realize that letting cops get away with murder, because the people that they killed don't look like you only results in cops that have little fear of punishment for shooting anyone.
Many of the cops in these incidents are minorities themselves. The victim is Somoan, and the witness at the link is black btw.
Hell, fastest way to bring the situation “under control” is shoot the guy.
I hear these cops say: “I want to come home safe to my family.”
Well, hell, I do too. Having to go out there where there are hundreds of over-trained hyped-up cops diminishes that probability.
Well. The cops claim that their life was in danger, but the didn’t call for back up until after they had already shot the guy and an angry mob descended upon them. What sort of sense does that make?
Cop sense
the guy was violent and was causing a public safety problem before officers were called and arrived at the scene
he had been diagnosed as schizophrenic
he was likely under the influence of alcohol or drugs or both
police had previously been called to this address to subdue him and brought him to jail or a mental health facility on other occasions
he displayed suicidal tendencies
he took a baton away from an officer
he punched a police officer in the face
he couldn't be subdued by a taser
he resisted arrest and fought with officers
a crowd formed, that made the officers fear for their safety, and they called for back up
This much (above) is known. More is likely to come out.
Let's not jump to conclusions on this thread based on a few selected witnesses and news reports. None of us were there and casting blame on the police officer who shot him is wrong at this stage of the situation. The officers are owed deference in terms of their perspectives on what occurred and those views haven't yet been published. For me, I'll give the benefit of the doubt to police "unless and until" rather than immediately casting blame in their direction on a case like this.
And that observation is based on what?
So can you tell us the racial profile of each of the officers in this instance or are you making a broad generalization that the cops were all white because the guy shot was a minority???
Consider that the officers were (Probably) sober, being on duty while the witnesses were (Probably) not, being at a party. Samoans are notoriously belligerent as well, even without alcohol.
Uh.. Behaving erratically isn't the same as behaving violently. And witnesses and police differ as to what actually happened. The only facts of which anyone is certain is that a man was shot to death.
Nope. As I stated earlier the only racial issue is cop and non-cop. One day people will wake up and realize that.
So, now every police shooting in LB is "questionable"?
Please enlighten us as to the other "questionable police shooting(s)" with dates and circumstances. I'm sure you won't list this case (below) that occurred a little over a year ago:
An illegal immigrant who had been deported from the United States several times but returned each time and now was being sought for wounding two police officers in Long Beach, Calif., has died in a shooting with officers who tracked him to a taco stand in Santa Ana, authorities have confirmed.
Santa Ana Police Chief Paul Walters said Oscar Gabriel Gallegos, wanted for the shooting of Long Beach officers Abram Yap and Roy Wade Jr. as they sat in their squad car Dec. 22, died while trying to shoot three of his officers with a .40-caliber Glock equipped with a laser sight. Walters told the Orange County Register that Gallegos carried two fully loaded magazines in his pocket during the confrontation.
"He was either going to kill the officers or be killed," Walters said. "Fortunately, the right person got killed."
The Long Beach officers, who had stopped Gallegos for running a red light, are recovering from their injuries in the hospital, officials said.
Is there ever any justification for a cop killing an unarmed man? I would think if an unarmed man is a threat, poilice would be trained to wound him. A bullet in the leg usually makes anyone more manageable.
Why do you have such a problem with me saying that there have been questionable police shootings in Long Beach? Are you suggesting that police shootings are justified 100% of the time? That’s scary.
I never said that “every police shooting” (your words) questionable. Many are justified. The one you list is an example. I remember the case well, although it was the Santa Ana police that found him and blew his punk ass away.
It is dangerous to automatically side with the police prior to investigation. They are mistake prone humans.
I don't and didn't in this case. Since you put forward that it wasn't the first questionable police shooting. I asked you to give examples. Besides you, there are others on this thread are ready to condemn the police in this instance by calling it an "unbelievable lack of discipline" and bringing up unrelated incidents from elsewhere to suggest the cops are out of control and killing innocents here and there. Prove your assertion in LB or not. I'm waiting.
Funny how this reads. Couldn't the article cite just ONE single person who saw all this happen instead of compiling the events via multiple witnesses?
In the first place, the guy wasn’t unarmed, he had a police baton. Second, a shooting is justified if the guy has the present ability to kill or seriously injure you and is in the process of trying to do it, doesn’t matter whether he’s armed or not. Third, you don’t shoot to wound because you can’t guarantee you’ll hit what you’re aiming for and even if you do, the shot may not have the consequence you intended. A shot of the leg can severe an artery, causing the guy to bleed to death. You don’t shoot unless there’s an active attempt to kill or injure you, and then you shoot to kill.
Of interest about this KNBC story is that half the statements that they’re quoting are from non-witnesses who were just told something by someone. I wouldn’t try to make a call one way or the other on this one until all the actual witnesses have weighed in.
“It’s going to be a long hot summer.”
We sure hope so. Riots help ratings.
Uh, yourself. Do research before making a fool of yourself.
quote: "Police responded to multiple calls regarding a man behaving "violently and erratic" in the 3400 block of East 67th Street, according to the published police report " //unquote
“Roid rage?”
I had hemorrhoids once, it didn’t make me want to kill anyone.
Yes, there are multiple examples of such a justification. A cop was murdered five miles from where I sit a few years ago, by a naked (totally unarmed) deranged and drugged up guy, in the middle of a busy street, at 10 in the AM. The perp fought the officer, took his weapon and killed him with it. Should the cop have shot and killed him before he got his gun taken? In retrospect: yes.
Police officers aren't trained to wound when faced with a life or death situation -- and, no, I'm not saying that was the case in this instance in Long Beach. When they fire they shoot to kill, and are not trained to shoot to wound in the leg or other appendage. And every time a weapon is drawn it can mean life of death. Tough responsibility to assume when being sworn in as an officer, eh?
The fact that the first three bullets should have done the job. The last three bullets were a waste of good ammo.
We moved here to Riverside County from North Long Beach 21 years ago. The area was going to “H” at the time. Our friends from the area, and still live in the area have kept us informed about the progress in NLB. It hasn’t. We are told of numerous random shootings in the Jordan area we once lived. Robberies and chaos seems to be the order of the day according to those longtime friends.
Our disgust with Long Beach was accumulative lack of response by the Police to the ever present drug, and drug associated activities in the neighborhood.
The Police weren’t there to protect and to serve for whatever reason.
We sold the place and moved out here to the country where we don’t expect to be bothered in the way we were in Long Beach.
We had to commute 155 miles a day round trip to our jobs in the harbor area the next ten years. Well worth it to be out of Long Beach.
Twenty-one years later we are still quite happy we moved.
I only said it was questionable, not wrong. I wasn’t there. I am always concerned when the police shoot someone who is unarmed.
Marcella Byrd was a 57 year-old schizophrenic woman who was fatally shot by LB police. She was armed with a kitchen knife. The shooting is questionable. Police are now armed with tasers for these situations.
I do not envy the tough task facing police. They have to quickly discern threat levels and act accordingly. This happens very fast. I do not condemn them when they make a mistake.
As freedom loving individualists, we should maintain a healty suspiscion of authorities. We don’t want to end up in a fascist/totalitarian regime.
The Jordan area is sketchy. My wife went to Jordan in the 70’s. Wasn’t quite as bad then, though it was declining.
I moved to CA from TX 10 years ago. We now live in East LB, near the college. It is nice in our neighborhood.
We have considered moving back to TX. One day at a time.
While tragic and unfortunate, I wouldn't call Marcella Byrd's case "questionable." [your term]
Below is an excerpt from the DA's report, which exonerated the officers -- The officers, by the way, had no way of knowing this woman's mental situation and diagnosis.
The "less lethal" rounds did not carry their intended effect. Byrd seemed "unfazed" instead of yielding, she turned toward [the Sgt], standing a short distance away, and raised her right arm pointing the knife at him. Had she been successful in either throwing the knife at the officers, or attacking them with it, serious if not fatal injuries could have resulted. A reasonable person faced with the same set of events would have felt imminent danger and recognized the necessity for the use of deadly force. The shots fired by [three officers, not the Sgt.] were in lawful exercise of the right of self-defense and in defense of [the Sgt.]
Having concluded that the [three officers who fired] acted in lawful self-defense and in defense of another when they shot Marcella Byrd, we are closing our file and will take no further action in this matter.
“We now live in East LB, near the college. It is nice in our neighborhood.”
I know the area you live. I was raised in E. Long Beach in the Belmont Heights District. I was the relief shift cook at Denny’s #3 up near you on PCH and 7th St. for a year and a half in the early sixties. Only stayed on that job as I had the hots for one of the waitresses at the time. Then went into the Military. Siiiiiiiiiiigh...those were the days when Long Beach was truly a wonderful place to live.
Many good memories.
Shoot to wound = shoot to get sued.
It happened a couple years ago in a nearby town called Chino. An airman home on leave was shot by I believe a SB Co. sheriff. He was unarmed and the video tape even shows him just sitting there on the ground. The airman was Chicano and the deputy sheriff was black, so none of the professional race-baiters had time to come out and protest this one.
Reminds me. I just did my re-qual today. Scored 250 out of 250 with both the .38 and the 9mm. Not bad, if I do say so myself.
Oh well sh!t it was in the police report so it must be true.
The victim went to my church, and it WAS A very big deal here, as you should well know if you live in the Pomona Valley. Yeah, and that cop skated too. Beacuse it’s not about the race of the cops or the victim. Cops always walk after shooting unarmed suspects. Race has nothing to do with it. It’s a red-herring.
These are my local police. In our more upscale ‘hood to the south, these cops are absolutely wonderful, maybe out of gratitude that our kids wave at them and we are always happy to see them patrolling. They will get to our doors in 2 minutes flat if we need them.
But when they have to go into the drug and gang infested neighborhoods around us, they have a harder time. I’ll reserve my judgment in this case until we have more evidence. The witnesses MAY belong to a group that hates cops and thus may not be the best source of truth.
The cops’ hands are tied and there is constant fear of an incident like this, which might well end up with a handwringing HUGE taxpayer settlement. I do not think police are unthinkingly “going off” on citizens, but each case needs to be taken on its own.
When three officers feel they have to resort to lethal action versus an old lady with a knife, I may have a few questions about it, such as, “why didn’t they consider shooting her in the leg?” Hardly cut-n-dry.
Like I said, questionable. Not necessarily wrong. Same with the shooting this weekend. I’m not a cop, and I wasn’t there.
Questionable is an appropriate term here. It is dangerous to assume that the police are ALWAYS right.
Wow! Nice shooting.
Glad to have you out there on the streets.
I also live nearby East Division. They are generally nice folks.
You qual on a 300 scale?
Last was 286 here.
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