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Love on Girls’ Side of the Saudi Divide
The NY Times ^ | May 13, 2008 | KATHERINE ZOEPF

Posted on 05/13/2008 1:58:32 PM PDT by forkinsocket

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia — The dance party in Atheer Jassem al-Othman’s living room was in full swing. The guests — about two dozen girls in their late teens — had arrived, and Ms. Othman and her mother were passing around cups of sweet tea and dishes of dates.

About half the girls were swaying and gyrating, without the slightest self-consciousness, among overstuffed sofas, heavy draperies, tables larded with figurines and ornately-covered tissue boxes. Their head-to-toe abayas, balled up and tossed onto chairs, looked like black cloth puddles.

Suddenly, the music stopped, and an 18-year-old named Alia tottered forward.

“Girls? I have something to tell you,” Alia faltered, appearing to sway slightly on her high heels. She paused anxiously, and the next words came out in a rush. “I’ve gotten engaged!” There was a chorus of shrieks at the surprise announcement and Alia burst into tears, as did several of the other girls.

Ms. Othman’s mother smiled knowingly and left the room, leaving the girls to their moment of emotion. The group has been friends since they were of middle-school age, and Alia would be the first of them to marry.

A cellphone picture of Alia’s fiancé — a 25-year-old military man named Badr — was passed around, and the girls began pestering Alia for the details of her showfa. A showfa — literally, a “viewing” — usually occurs on the day that a Saudi girl is engaged.

A girl’s suitor, when he comes to ask her father for her hand in marriage, has the right to see her dressed without her abaya.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: islam; love; saudiarabia; women
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1 posted on 05/13/2008 1:58:32 PM PDT by forkinsocket
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To: forkinsocket

How special.


2 posted on 05/13/2008 2:02:09 PM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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To: forkinsocket

How can girls love a man they barely know and are barely allowed to get to know?


3 posted on 05/13/2008 2:04:40 PM PDT by Cecily
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To: forkinsocket
A girl’s suitor, when he comes to ask her father for her hand in marriage, has the right to see her dressed without her abaya...

I wonder if he has the right to back out if he doesn't like what he sees.

4 posted on 05/13/2008 2:06:53 PM PDT by Flashlight
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To: Cecily

Must be OK, the NYTs likes it.


5 posted on 05/13/2008 2:07:26 PM PDT by kjo
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To: Alia

ping


6 posted on 05/13/2008 2:09:13 PM PDT by BelegStrongbow (what part of 'mias gunaikos andra' do Episcopalians not understand?)
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To: Cecily
“How can girls love a man they barely know and are barely allowed to get to know?”

Philosophically agree. However, there was a time that the phrase “molder bride” was common here in the U.S. And, I don't have any proof but I bet the divorce rate was low (I know, it was a long walk back to civilization)...

7 posted on 05/13/2008 2:15:02 PM PDT by snoringbear ('Just so to get the terminology correct; it goes like this; the federal government is the Pimp, the)
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To: kjo

And American so-called feminists have nothing to say.


8 posted on 05/13/2008 2:15:14 PM PDT by onedoug
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To: kjo

The NYT let one of the girls get away with the Fraudi Arabia/Regency England comparison too. Absurd. Elizabeth Bennett and Mr. Darcy got to court openly and dance together. Lizzie could show her face, wear form-fitting clothes, ride horses, drive her own carriage, flirt with men, and dance with men, all without fear of being “honor” killed, jailed, lashed, or losing her head. Georgian England in the 18th and early 19th centuries was light years ahead of Fraudi Arabia with respect to the treatment of women.


9 posted on 05/13/2008 2:26:48 PM PDT by Cecily
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To: Flashlight
I wonder if he has the right to back out if he doesn't like what he sees. ?

No, but under Sharia law, he has the right to cut her throat for the slightest offense, real or imagined.

10 posted on 05/13/2008 2:27:07 PM PDT by Vigilanteman ((Are there any men left in Washington? Or are there only cowards? Ahmad Shah Massoud))
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To: Flashlight

If he marries, he only needs to repeat three times “I divorce you” and the marriage is over. So I suspect he can back out pre-engagement even more easily.

There was an article recently about whether the thrice-stated divorce was effective when given by text message.

Did somebody tell Paul McCartney about all this?


11 posted on 05/13/2008 2:41:50 PM PDT by bajabaja
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To: Cecily

By Georgian times, England had had 2 queens rule their nation (maybe more, but Elizabeth and Mary for certain). By that measure alone, women had far more rights than they do in Saudi Arabia today.


12 posted on 05/13/2008 2:57:32 PM PDT by tbw2 ("Sirat: Through the Fires of Hell" by Tamara Wilhite - on amazon.com)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: forkinsocket

Wait until she gets the the Ceremonial Rape on her wedding night.

And allah help her, if she can’t “prove” her virginity with the ceremonial display of bloody bed sheets.


14 posted on 05/13/2008 3:10:44 PM PDT by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: forkinsocket

I wonder if Alia was a victim of ritual genital mutilation, common in Mooselimb society?

She sounds a little too happy, maybe the local midwife with the rusty knife overlooked her?


15 posted on 05/13/2008 3:16:12 PM PDT by mkjessup (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American history.)
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To: snoringbear; Cecily
The Saudis have a divorce rate that's right off the wall. That way you can combine polygamy and still make everybody happy.

It's a cultural value with them ~ they've always used marriage as their version of Social Security.

16 posted on 05/13/2008 3:39:52 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: forkinsocket
A girl’s suitor, when he comes to ask her father for her hand in marriage, has the right to see her dressed without her abaya.

Deal or no deal

17 posted on 05/13/2008 4:31:45 PM PDT by usurper (Spelling or grammatical errors in this post can be attributed to the LA City School System)
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To: muawiyah
““molder bride”” Wow, this is one of the dumber misspellings I have made; correction would be “mail-order bride”. Wonder what a “molder bride” would look like...

Concerning your comment about Saudis-no argument here; the hypocrisy of these people is almost endless. In addition to their high divorce rate, they love to go to Europe and party hardy with lots of drinking and carrousing. They seem to highly favor our western blond “prom queens”...

18 posted on 05/14/2008 6:16:30 AM PDT by snoringbear ('Just so to get the terminology correct; it goes like this; the federal government is the Pimp, the)
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To: snoringbear

I simply ignored “molder bride” ~ entirely too esoteric for me to have ever had anything to do with that concept being the middle of the road guy I am.


19 posted on 05/14/2008 11:58:37 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: forkinsocket
When I lived in Saudi I saw the strangest story in the Arab News. In Jeddah a man was in trouble for marrying off the wrong daughter. It seems that the Saudi suitor was introduced to his young bride, but after the wedding he found out that it was her older sister he ended up marrying. The bait and switch appeared intentional on his father in law's part. Talk about grab bags.

We never got a follow up as to how the story ended. Seems like the Saudi press hoped the original story would fall down a memory hole which it did.

I guess Saudi marriage is like Forrest Gump’s box of chocolates statement.

20 posted on 05/14/2008 12:12:31 PM PDT by Hillarys Gate Cult (The man who said "there's no such thing as a stupid question" has never talked to Helen Thomas.)
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