Black Senior's Response to Wright

[Lloyd Marcus]

I was shocked and saddened to hear my 80 year old black father say he thought Rev. Jeremiah Wright spoke the truth about America. My dad is a great man. He was one of the first blacks to break the color barrier in the Baltimore Fire Department where he suffered segregation and humiliating treatment. He won Firefighter of the Year two times. Married with four children, he worked full time and attended college. He is a doctor of theology. He authored a book and still pastors numerous churches. He truly believes in love and faith in God. My dad would never use Wright's hate filled rhetoric.

So how could my hero say he agreed with this nut case? It defies logic. Then it dawned on me. Logic, reason or truth did not enter into the equation. Dad's response to Wright was purely emotional. It is all about his deep hurt feelings.

I remembered dad telling me about an incident while serving in the Merchant Marines. Whites in Florida tried to hang him simply for getting off of the ship. His fellow white seamen rescued him.

Racial progress in 2008 America makes Wright's rant absurd. Dad's response to his remarks is in essence a racial persecution flashback; similar to a hippie having an LSD flashback or a vet suffering a war flashback. I suspect there are many black seniors, though loving and kind to all, still carry deep emotional scares from a long since by gone era.

So, while I am a proud black conservative Republican who loves his country and dad, I will give him a pass. I respectfully forgive my dad for being wrong about Wright.

Lloyd Marcus

[Lloyd Marcus]

I was shocked and saddened to hear my 80 year old black father say he thought Rev. Jeremiah Wright spoke the truth about America. My dad is a great man. He was one of the first blacks to break the color barrier in the Baltimore Fire Department where he suffered segregation and humiliating treatment. He won Firefighter of the Year two times. Married with four children, he worked full time and attended college. He is a doctor of theology. He authored a book and still pastors numerous churches. He truly believes in love and faith in God. My dad would never use Wright's hate filled rhetoric.

So how could my hero say he agreed with this nut case? It defies logic. Then it dawned on me. Logic, reason or truth did not enter into the equation. Dad's response to Wright was purely emotional. It is all about his deep hurt feelings.

I remembered dad telling me about an incident while serving in the Merchant Marines. Whites in Florida tried to hang him simply for getting off of the ship. His fellow white seamen rescued him.

Racial progress in 2008 America makes Wright's rant absurd. Dad's response to his remarks is in essence a racial persecution flashback; similar to a hippie having an LSD flashback or a vet suffering a war flashback. I suspect there are many black seniors, though loving and kind to all, still carry deep emotional scares from a long since by gone era.

So, while I am a proud black conservative Republican who loves his country and dad, I will give him a pass. I respectfully forgive my dad for being wrong about Wright.

Lloyd Marcus

[The_Media_never_lie]

Wow, interesting post.

You were fortunate to have such a good father, anyone can be wrong sometimes.

[onedoug]

Dad mistakes race for Judeo-Christian values. It’s a real shame.

[linn37]

Don't feel bad Lloyd its hard to forget abuse and thats what it is when you single someone out over their color and treat them cruelly.

[RockinRight]

Lloyd, I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. And it’s not just blacks, but most people who support liberals, regretfully, do the same thing.

I’m sure your Dad is a fine man and it’s obvious that he’s been a great father to you - so you did the right thing to forgive him.

Let’s hope though, that the younger generations can “wake up” before it’s too late.

[Billthedrill]

Bless you, Lloyd. Lots of water under that bridge. Lots of healing yet to do. BTT.

[ckilmer]

man that age is long gone.

[GovernmentShrinker]

Your Dad has a good excuse. Few of the members of Wright’s church do, and especially not Obama. Tell your Dad thanks for fighting a hard fight that he shouldn’t have to fight. It’s because of people like him that the nation changed, and rendered Wright’s hate-filled rants just a pack of lies.

[loreldan]

I think it's more of a generational thing. My grandfather (white) is 70 something years old and he believes in different weird conspiracies. He's also a very spiritual, hardworking, and a great man. I wonder if your father has always believed this or if senility is a partial cause.

[SatinDoll]

My nephew’s other aunt was, as a young teenager, serially raped, beaten, and left for dead by a gang of black men in Oklahoma many years ago. To this day she is not trusting of black folk.

An elderly friend of my father’s was a POW of the Japanese during WWII. A merchant marine who was caught on the China Sea the day after Pearl Harbor, he was severely abused in Korea for the duration of the war until liberated. Not surprisingly, he detests all Asians.

Our expectations and attitudes are often cast by our life experiences. It takes exceptional people to realize that it is individuals, not an entire race or ethnic group, who commit crimes and vicious acts. You sound like that kind of exceptional person, Lloyd.

[an amused spectator]

Fascinating post. Your father sounds like a great guy, and someone who could tell some great stories.

The current presidential campaign is shining light into places we normally avoid talking about. Yhere's a lot going on at the personal level in the camps of all three candidates.

[PGalt]

We can all learn from our fathers and those who have come before us, Lloyd. Your father is a great teacher because he created a son who is a great learner. Thanks for teaching us, Lloyd, how to be a great son.

[chopperman]

Wright, Farakan, Jackson and Sharpton have set race relations back fifty years.

[Steve Van Doorn]

I don’t see anything to forgive here. He was brain washed years ago, no reason to expect him too change now.

More interesting question to me is:
What does your father think of you being a conservative republican or does he know?

personally if he doesn't know at this point I wouldn't tell him.

[berdie]

Absolutely. How can they maintain their power if things progress.

It’s still not perfect..but things are progressing..if they are allowed to.

[Tammy8]

I won’t say I can understand your father’s feelings because I have never been in his shoes. I will say that I am old enough to have seen people act very ugly out of racism, and can only imagine what that does to you when you are the target.

I know there is still racism in this country and likely there will always be. I do know it is not tolerated like it was when I was a child and for that I am greatful. I feel terrible that your father went through what he did, and I won’t question his feelings about Wright- he surely earned his right to an opinion. I hope at some point he realizes that racism is born of ignorance, and I believe most Americans are not racist. I hope he will also realize that people like Wright do not have the answers to these issues.

I admire your father for what he was able to achieve, and I know he struggled greatly in order to do so. I’m glad you are giving your father a pass- enjoy your time with him and I think you are wise to not let this come between you.

[Tammy8]

I do believe you are right about that.

[Rembrandt]

Virtually all of the other ethnic minorities that have come to the U.S. can share stories of persecution and the shame of being treated as someone who didn’t belong.

All but the African Americans have overcome those issues and have done pretty darn well in the U.S.

Blacks got stuck in LBJ’s and the Dimocratz’ poverty trap and now feel this massive sense of entitlement. Until they make a clean break with that thought pattern, they’ll never make any meaningful progress.

[Windflier]

Lloyd, you could just as well be talking about the difference between myself and my 78 year old black father. In my case, dad is a retired Army Lt. Col. who did a couple of tours in Vietnam as a Green Beret.

Back in those days, he voted Republican, but some years after retirement, his liberal wife finally turned him to the dark side. I chalk it up to dad not being all that politically savvy, due to a lifetime of watching the alphabet MSM news.

Dad entered the military just as it was being desegregated. That change in policy made it possible for him to advance in his career, but it was never easy for him. Still, he was able to set aside his own hurt and find real kinship with his military brothers, and a deep love of country. This is what sustained him, and gave him the inner fortitude to give his very best to his country.

Unlike your dad, I doubt that my father agrees with Jeremiah Wright, but at the same time Wright stirs a deep and terrible hurt within him. My dad just responds to it differently than your dad does, apparently. In his case, he simply doesn’t speak on it.

Like you, I’m a staunch conservative and very much the odd man out in my liberal family. In time, I hope to see many more like us in the black community.

[Coldwater Creek]

May your tribe increase!!!!!!!

[Windflier]

May your tribe increase!!!

Heh, my tribe is up to four little conservatives-in-training, currently ::smile::

[Jewels1091]

My 89 year old uncle was in WWII for 3 years, marched across Europe and into Berlin. To this day he hates Asians and isn’t very fond of Germans. He was on the front lines so long and saw so much human destruction that he went blind for about 6 weeks...his brain just said I’ve seen enough. As soon as his sight came back, he was back on the front lines. As I can understand why my uncle has these feelings from what he went through, I can understand your dad’s feelings. But, he did raise a fine son!

[Marie2]

about believing in different, weird conspiracies. . .

a caller to a talk show (Lou whatshisname? I don’t like him but he has a slot on our conservative talk station now) mentioned the syphilis experiments done on black men back in the 1940s -

which gave me pause. I thought anyone who might consider that the government would deliberately infect black men with AIDS had to be crazy. But this caller said her own grandfather was deliberately infected with syphilis (he was in the group that got treated, so he survived it). So I can understand, honestly, why some might find the AIDS claim believable. If they’d done that to my grandpa, I might find it believable.

We reap what we sow.

[Prole]

"I was shocked and saddened to hear my 80 year old black father say he thought Rev. Jeremiah Wright spoke the truth about America. My dad is a great man."

No.

No, No, NO!!!

A person maintains neither rational thought nor intellectual capabilities if he agrees with a man as vile as Wright.

Who uses the Altar of God to shout blasphemy?

Who uses the Altar of God to mimic sexual motions while shouting "Riding Dirty?"

Who salutes Malcolm X and Louis Farrakhan?

Who refers to mainsteam America as "KKKUSA?"

Wright and those who agree with him are not only fools, but they are scum of the lowest caliber.

Before they die, they will have effectively set animosity between blacks and other races to an entirely new level.

And all this venomous hatred is spewed in exchange for a couple of lousy book deals, a few stacks of cash and a cheap house???

Disgusting losers, all.

[Binghamton_native]

You do realize that the US government did NOT infect any blacks with syphillis in the Tuskeegee Experiment. The experiment was a study where a control group was not treated but instead was given placebos. Go here to check it out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_experiment

It is important that we be straight on this as this experiment, as despicable as it was, was not equal to inventing the AIDS virus to inject into black men. The Reverend Wright is not only wrong, he is a liar when he makes such statements.

[El Gran Salseron]

They didn’t deliberately infect anyone. They took as volunteers, blacks who already had the dreaded disease, as test cases.

[El Gran Salseron]

I was raised by a prejudiced, bigoted father who would make Archie Bunker look like a flaming liberal.

I was younger than 5 years old. My dad and his friends used to congregate aroung his garage to shoot the bull. One day a black man came along, stopped and had to ask for permission to “speak to the white man.” He was given “permission”. He then looked at my dad and said, “Your shirt is on fire”, which it was from a cigarette.

As young as I was, I felt sorry for the black guy because he had to ask for permission to speak.

When I entered the military I quickly learned. I now treat all people I meet with dignity and respect until they show to me that they deserve neither.

However, just from that experience described above, I can understand the hurt that stays with one for a lifetime because it still hurts me when I think about it. Because hurt does last a lifetime then you should hold no ill will toward your father. He’s a good man and raised a good son.

[Marie2]

No, I didn’t realize that. I was led to believe that healthy black men were deliberately infected with syphilis, and that half were treated and half given a placebo (eventually dying horrible deaths).

[21twelve]

“I was raised by a prejudiced, bigoted father who would make Archie Bunker look like a flaming liberal.”

The times are changing with every generation. My folks were prejudiced to a point I know, but never let on too much. And growing up in a lilly-white community, I didn’t have to really think about the whole race thing, but I know that I am also prejudiced to a (lesser) degree.

My kids are growing up in a very racially diverse grade school and it is great to see how race is not even an issue. And I try to be careful about immediatly saying stuff like “This Johnny? Is he the black kid?” but “Johnny - is he the kid you sit with on the bus?” Some might think I’m being PC. I’m just trying to get past my habit of thinking of a kid’s skin-color as the first thing I think of - but instead what place that kid holds in my children’s lives.

With all the news with Obama and his preacher though even my kids are picking up on it, and I think trying to have to figure out the whole race issue. Hopefully they can just shrug it off and say “what the heck are those old folks talking about - lets go play”.

[Coldwater Creek]

Good deal!

[bad company]

Dad's response to Wright was purely emotional. It is all about his deep hurt feelings.

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. At 80 years old your father lived half of his life in a shameful era of this country. One minor misstep on your fathers part and he could pay with his job, freedom or even his life. Biggots, being the cowards they are were difficult to distinguish from other whites, your father had no idea where the danger could come from so whites in general had to suffice. Even though not all whites were like that, not many stood up and disagreed with the status quo.

Your fathers response isn't emotional. It's a quite rational response, and it goes far beyond hurt feelings.

Your father needs no forgiveness. Demagogues like wright that fan the flames and continue to rub salt in the wound to shake down the flock in order to retire in million dollar mansions are the ones that should be seeking forgiveness.

Your father has a right to his anger. He just doesn't need it anymore.

[bad company]

I was younger than 5 years old. My dad and his friends used to congregate aroung his garage to shoot the bull. One day a black man came along, stopped and had to ask for permission to “speak to the white man.” He was given “permission”. He then looked at my dad and said, “Your shirt is on fire”, which it was from a cigarette.

I lived a few of my early years in the segregated south. I was raised a proper gentleman. I showed my elders respect by always addressing them as Mr. Mrs. or Miss. For reasons I don't recall I was often left in the care of a black lady whose first name I don't recall. I think it was Esther so that's what I'll go with. I had some understanding of the segregation thing. the problem was that when I was in the care of Esther, I was instructed to call her "Mizz Esther", her first name. I knew that it had something to do with the color of her skin, but in my heart of hearts I knew it was wrong. Now I loved Esther. She was a neat lady. She taught me my ABC's. It bothered me to no end that I was addressing this wonderful lady, for whom I had so much love and respect, by her first name. Being more than a bit precocious, I figured out that she was married and her last name was Johnson, so I insisted on calling her Mrs.Johnson.

Fast forward to today. I have an older black co-worker Named Edna. She tells everyone to call her Mizz Edna. I still can't do it. She is my equal at work so I just call her Edna. Funny how things like that stick with you.

[DoughtyOne]

Lloyd, there are some things that Wright addresses that I can accept. There are other things that he says that I cannot accept.

Where he addresses the issues your dad had to face, I have no problem with it. There were things that took place in our nation that mortify me. That being said, there comes a time when we have to move on. I realize that’s easy for me to say, but it is true.

You seem to have moved on. I’m sure you look at me and I look at you in the same way. You’re a human being and being a Conservative, I respect you and would be happy to have you as a friend, a neighbor or a co-worker. I don’t care what color you are, as long as you conduct yourself as a good citizen, you have my full support in anything that you elect to do, as if you needed it, but you know what I mean.

Now, while I do agree with Wrights comments about racism in the past and how bad it was, I cannot sign on to him continuing to race bait today. I agree with him that what took place in the past was wrong, that racism is wrong today, but by not forgiving whites, he is being somewhat of a racist himself.

I didn’t participate in racism. I was raised on a farm a couple of miles from George Washington Carvers birthplace, and toured the place a number of times as a kid. What happened to him both repulsed me, and impressed me, in that he overcame. My grandparents raised me to respect persons of every race, color, creed, or religion. They were born around the turn of the century, so I know there were good non-racist whites back in the day. Some folks were obviously racist. Many white folks were not.

Clear back to the underground railroad, some whites were helping blacks.

As for the United States being the same as Al Qaeda or other terrorists or terrorist states, I cannot sign on to Wrights rhetoric. And it really saddens me for anyone to be able to overlook this aspect of his preaching. That sort of thing is dead wrong. It is not just anti-American, but it serves to sell short what these terrorists are all about, killing innocent people on a whim.

Does Wright honestly think we do that? If so, the man is mental. And if other people believe we do that, I sadly have to think they aren’t playing with a full deck either.

I don’t say this to put down your dad at all. I just say it because I would say it about any white, asian, or any other ethic person who would buy into this.

I appreciate your comments. Hope you understand where I am coming from. Hope your dad is doing well. I am truly sorry for what he had to face in his life. Thankfully we’re mostly beyond that these days.

[Jim Noble]

I was led to believe that healthy black men were deliberately infected with syphilis, and that half were treated and half given a placebo (eventually dying horrible deaths).

Yes, even Mark Levin said this on his radio show of 5/5/08, but it's not true.

In 1932, the US Public Health Service started an important natural history study of late syphilis among sharecroppers in Alabama. Then, as now, the rates of STDs and particularly syphilis were very high among rural blacks in the American South.

The "treatment" for syphilis in 1932 was injectable arsphenamine (an organic salt of arsenic), and it was not clear whether or not the treatment was worse than the disease.

As with most PHS studies or grants, the effort also directed funds to places desired by the administration of the day, in this case rural clinics and black doctors, and thus accomplished a laudable secondary purpose.

As of WW II, the study was generating important, previously unknown data, about late complications of chronic syphilis infection and rates of progression in affected individuals.

The problem came after the introduction of penicillin into civilian life in 1946.

Penicillin cured syphilis, in all of its stages, with minimal risk of side effects or complications.

All of the men in the study should have been offered penicillin as soon as this became clear, certainly by 1950.

But, like any government program, there were many people being supported by study funds, and nobody accountable.

So the study continued, men got old and died, and nobody was treated until 1972.

How much racism had to do with Part I is debatable. Blacks in Alabama, in 1932, were where the syphilis was (rural blacks in the South today have extremely high rates of HIV/AIDS). Giving the affected men arsenic was not clearly what to do, in a disease which persisted for life with an unknown natural history. The funds, in the beginning, supported struggling black physicians and clinics, and this had something to do with the way the Roosevelt administration designed the study.

It was wrong - clearly, unequivocally wrong - not to treat the men when treatment was available. But that was after the study had been running for 18 years, and such lapses were common in medical research studies of the time which did not involve blacks.

So, in summary, nobody was deliberately infected, the enrollment of blacks in the beginning was incidental to the study design, and it's unclear how much racism, as opposed to poor research ethics, had to do with the 1950-1972 phase of the study.

[familyop]

Most members of my extended family were decided, intentional racists against black people in general, as were most of their friends and neighbors. Some of them have moved away from racism, to various extents, in time.

Of course you forgive your father for that. It takes generations of time and effort. Getting away from racism is one of the few good things that a more honest few of us in our spoiled rotten generation are trying to do.

[SMARTY]

“Racial progress in 2008 America makes Wright's rant absurd.”

That's true. It should be understood that if the facts are on your side, you can be as bombastic, outrageous, dramatic and raw as you want... in fact, it is parasitically a requirement, if you are not satisfied with things. HOWEVER, if you are making things up and playing fast and loose with the facts... best to be quiet and keep your opinions strictly within the bounds of civility.

[Sci Fi Guy]

My (white) Dad is a good guy. Raised me to think every form of racism is evil. But now that he’s getting up in the years too. He’s starting to say somethings that are a little off too. I think that it’s just age.