Posted on 11/07/2007 4:43:26 AM PST by fkabuckeyesrule
The gospel message that links God with dollars has been called to judgment before a powerful U.S. senator.
Sen. Charles Grassley (R-Iowa) sent letters requesting detailed financial documents to two metro Atlanta preachers and four other ministries nationwide whose leaders are known for opulent, or as the ministers would say, blessed, lifestyles.
Grassley is the ranking member of the Senate Finance Committee and has developed a reputation for demanding financial transparency from non-profits.
He wants to know how much Bishop Eddie Long of New Birth Missionary Baptist Church in Lithonia and the Rev. Creflo and Taffi Dollar of World Changers Church International in College Park make, how their church-issued credit cards are managed and how many cars, planes and foreign bank accounts they own. He has asked for information on the ministries' boards, business relationships and associated organizations.
"I'm following up on complaints from the public and news coverage regarding certain practices at six ministries," Grassley said in a press release.
The other ministers are the Rev. Benny Hinn, based in Grapevine, Texas; David and Joyce Meyer, Fenton, Mo.; Kenneth and Gloria Copeland, Newark, Texas, and Randy and Paula White, Tampa, Fla. All are well known in the evangelical religious broadcasting world. They are also known for preaching that financial blessings are part of Christian life.
"The allegations involve governing boards that aren't independent and allow generous salaries and housing allowance and amenities such as private jets and Rolls Royces," Grassley said.
"I don't want to conclude that there's a problem, but I have an obligation to donors and the taxpayers to find out more. People who donated should have their money spent as intended and in adherence with the tax code."
A spokesman for Long said that he intends to comply fully with Grassley's request.
Dollar said in a written response that Grassley is setting a precedent that would allow the Senate to pry into donations from any church or church school.
"Because of this fact, we feel it is prudent to consult well-respected legal professors and scholars to see what their thoughts are," the statement said in part.
"The questions are much bigger than World Changers as it could affect the privacy of every community church in America."
Dollar said his life and ministry have always been an open book.
Not so, said Rod Pitzer, who helps run Ministrywatch.com.
The 7-year-old group finds and asks for information on ministries and grades them on openness so that donors can decide where to give their money.
Many nonprofits have to file Form 990s with the Internal Revenue Service that detail salaries and expenses. Those forms are public documents, but religious ministries are exempt from filing them.
Pitzer said because of that, he depends on churches to voluntarily provide information. He has requested documentation from Dollar's church, such as audited statements or yearly reports. He has never received anything from them, he said.
Because of its lack of transparency, Ministrywatch.com grades World Changers an F.
"He's one of the few organizations that have an F, among about 500 that we are currently grading," Pitzer said.
Pitzer has not dealt with Long's ministry.
None of the six organizations that got Grassley's letters belong to the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability.
It is a voluntary organization of more than 2,000 members that sets professional standards for ministries.
Ken Behr, its president, was an executive with Ford for 24 years. He called the letter from Grassley unprecedented.
"If they were [ECFA members], this probably wouldn't have happened," Behr said.
The agency requires its members to have independent boards that do not include family members, but do adhere to high accounting standards and justify expenses.
"When a person using a credit card turns in a receipt, they have to justify that charges were ministry purposes, not for a family vacation to Hawaii," he said.
Jill Kozeny, a Grassley spokeswoman, said the senators chose the six ministries because of reports from third parties, whistle-blowers and the press.
In 2005 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution ran a story that looked into Long's founding of a charity that paid the minister more than $3 million over a 3-year period, bought him a $1.4 million house and paid for the use of a $350,000 Bentley car.
Grassley's letter to the Dollars mentions information that Dollar tried to raise $1 million from other minister to give to Kenneth and Gloria Copeland for a celebration of their 40th year of ministry and that Dollar's ministries gave more than $500,000 to them.
Kozeny said, "Some of the accounts were of particular concern about lack of transparency, about how [the ministries] spend millions while you have it all exempted from federal taxes."
I think many of these "prosperity preachers" are tacky, but so are almost all your nouveau riche who acquired their wealth in perfectly legal fashion. How the CEO spends his salary is entirely up to him, unless his Board of Directors or the stockholders decide it's fishy. And if it's a sole proprietorship or closely held corporation, it's nobody's business but his own, unless he's cheating the IRS (and the tax man can deal with that without the intervention of the state legislature).
What's to stop the government from investigating any church, once they set this precedent?
This looks like an attempt on the part of the legislature to get its hands on those tax-exempt church dollars. It's SOP to target the unpopular first, makes it easier to get the rest of them later.
I’m trying to figure out why the lifestyles of the rich and shameless behind the pulpit are any business of the even more rich and shameless hypocrites in Congress. Maybe they are looking for trade secrets.
2 Peter 2
1But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
3And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.
Exactly --
Just what I was thinking. A Senator implying that others' wealth is illegitimate? Go get an honest job yourself, Senator!
My church home has turned from being a very small outfit meeting in someone's living room to a large church. They hand out an annual financial statement summarized on four or five pages; if you want more detail about salaries and other expenses, you have only to ask. They figure that parishioners have a right to know that their tithes are being spent on God's work and not on cars and boats. If your church isn't that forthcoming, maybe you might ask them why, and consider finding another church.
My church puts annual financial statements in the bulletin, and holds an open meeting of the Finance Council so that people have the opportunity to discuss it.
When I went from being a Presbyterian to being a Methodist, I was shocked at the amount of secrecy in the church. Presbyterians put everything in clear view.
The Lutherans are so secretive, a friend left his Lutheran church because he saw financial shennanigans. The committee basically told him to shut up or leave. Nothing illegal just using money the wrong way.
The church I grew up in and the one I belong to now are open books to their members and always have been. If the state of fed wants to see what we are up to, no problem. If it were any other way, I wouldn't be a member.
I know why, and I am gone. You can’t run a church like a business. Heck, even business’s have financial disclosure.
***This looks like an attempt on the part of the legislature to get its hands on those tax-exempt church dollars. It’s SOP to target the unpopular first, makes it easier to get the rest of them later.***
I’m glad you said that. My thoughts exactly.
My ‘megachurch’ outside Atlanta prints financial information in every Sunday’s bulletin. As transparent as they come.
If I didn’t know how my church was spending my money it would no longer be “my” church.
Just curious...was there some theological reason, or did you just happen to find a Methodist church you liked better than your current Presbyterian church?
A: Never.
Presbyterians don’t have summer Sunday School. It was either Methodist or Baptist. I liked the Methodists better.
Please tell me I'm not the only person who finds something wrong, maybe even humorous, in that phrase.
And if it's a sole proprietorship or closely held corporation, it's nobody's business but his own, unless he's cheating the IRS (and the tax man can deal with that without the intervention of the state legislature).
It's nobody's business but his own until he claims tax-exempt status. There have to be some kind of standards and oversight for tax-exempt church status, or otherwise small businesses will start disappearing, replaced by used-car ministries and real estate ministries.
unless he's cheating the IRS (and the tax man can deal with that without the intervention of the state legislature).
Who said anything about state legislatures? This investigation is being launched by Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, of the United States Senate. Congress oversees all federal agencies, including the IRS.
What's to stop the government from investigating any church, once they set this precedent?
What's to stop the government from investigating any business, or any citizen? The courts, public backlash, and so on. You aren't immune from every rule by the simple act of calling yourself a church.
I think that the level of financial disclosure varies among different congregations, rather than being correllated particularly with denominations.
I think that you are right!
Bishop Eddie Long of New Birth Missionary Baptist Church
Rev. Creflo and Taffi Dollar of World Changers Church International
Rev. Benny Hinn
David and Joyce Meyer
Kenneth and Gloria Copeland
Randy and Paula White
None of the six organizations that got Grassley's letters belong to the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability....Ken Behr...called the letter from Grassley unprecedented.
Ping to read later
There should be no problem having churches that solicit funds across state lines to produce financial statements. Organizations such as the catholics charities that are using tax exempt monies to violate law, such as building day labor centers for illegals, should lose their tax exempt status. As should any Church that is a get rich scam for the so called Reverend and his/or her cronies.
I have mixed feelings on this. On the one hand, if fools and their dollars wished to be separated, why should any one stand in their way. And that is probably the constitutional approach.
On the other hand, public regulation of the airways is well established, and that might be a way to require transparency from the scam artists.
Some of both. Some denominations have more central control, so the diocese, or the presbytery, or the synod, can set standards. Others have a less-hierarchial structure, with all the essential control lying at the individual church level.
Of course, denominations aren't enforceable trademarks, so I could start a church tomorrow, and there's nothing to stop me from calling it Baptist or Presbyterian or Catholic or Methodist, even if I have no affiliation with any established group. If I claimed affiliation with the Southern Baptist Convention, the Presbyterian Church-USA, the Roman Catholic Church or the United Methodist Conference, their lawyers would bring the hammer down.
Not sure what you were getting at with the boldface, but the linked article is from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. So it’s natural that they would focus on the local angle.
Oh, what the heck. I’ll risk offending folks. To me, “prosperity theology” is a transparent con — these pastors are selling spiritual lottery tickets. Back in the day, Robert Tilton used to call it “seed faith,” but I guess “prosperity theology” is more catchy.
They have to be seen “livin’ large,” because living otherwise would put the lie to their whole message; they have to be a beacon of what their followers could achieve, if they just sign the check. A lot of these folks, if they hadn’t found their niche in preaching, would be selling Amway.
JMHO, of course.
seems like more anti southern bigotry from yankeeland. Go investigate GREENPEACE, ACLU, MOVEON.ORG and leave the Christians alone.
If they are a 501c non profit, then they are open to scrutiny by the government. I would not want to be in some of those "preachers" shoes being judged by my God. Is God going to say. Good work, my faithful servant?
We have an online ministry, we sell books and post teachings of Bible scholars. We have not filed to be a 501C, because money is not what it is about with us. We have a verse of the day on Google, with links to our site, we have had over 5 million hits on it, very few give money, but many are blessed. www.Believer.com
Bellevue?
Where’s Joel Osteen?
Can't have a creche in a public place - "Separation of church and state" = but - ummm, yeah, ho- kay
Yep!
You’re right! It’s a very slippery slope they’re on.
Now it’s the “Prosprity Preachers”. Tomorrow it could be the immensely wealthy Episcopal Church.
Wait. Maybe those Heritics should be investigated. I think the wealth of that Church was the reason it was targeted for takeover by the Left. They are living on the Church’s “seed money” because donations have plummeted.
Good points.
Who's saying that?
Government property is not synonymous with a public place. I am not aware of any credible effort to prohibit creches from church lawns.
“Good luck Senator! My mega church in Memphis doesn’t give out financial information, even to the members!”
Ad you’re OK with that? I’d find another church.
Sorry, should have read the whole thread.
Straight from a politicians mouth! I don't know whether to laugh or cry!
Not with cable it isn't and most of these televison ministries are all on cable now. Certainly the ones noted here are.
Around here, there are a couple of over-the-air religious network affiliates that sell time to televangelists. (Daystar on Analog Channel 2 (purchased from the local PBS affiliate), and the TBN O&O on Analog Channel 58, with 5 additional digital channels). Looks like Cashflow Dollar, Hinn, Joyce Meyer, and Copeland may be on Daystar. A quick check shows Hinn, Dollar, Meyer and Copeland on the TBN station as well. I didn't see Long on either list.
Our church will tell you (if you ask) pretty much everything except who gives how much. The published info is much scantier.
Taxes.
Grassley is questioning their tax-exempt status. These guys are raking in tremendous profits from their silver tongues and claiming that because they use the name of God they don’t have to pay taxes like their victims do.
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