Posted on 08/18/2007 1:28:34 AM PDT by shrinkermd
On Sunday, Christian baseball fans will stream into Dodger Stadium for what is becoming more common fare at professional ballparks across the country -- "faith day."
Following the Dodgers vs. Rockies game, fans with special tickets will gather in a corner of the parking lot for a concert by the Christian rock band Hawk Nelson, an appearance by characters from the "Veggie Tales" Christian television program and testimonials by several devout Dodgers. The purpose, according to event organizer Brent High, is to promote the Gospel of Jesus.
...Critics of the Christianizing of pro sports -- including interfaith groups, Jewish leaders and secular progressives -- have voiced reservations about the seemingly ever-closer relationship between evangelical sports ministries and major professional sports teams. Frequent on-field religious gestures by players already rankle many -- does it really honor God to knock the snot of your opponent on the football field and then point to the sky? And shout-outs to God during live post-game interviews offend those fans who would prefer to enjoy their sports without a dose of in-your-face religion.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
Do people have to parade their religion ALL the time?
Yes, I'm aware of what I'm setting myself up for here. But whatever happened to praying behind closed doors, and not wearing your religion on your sleeve, but living your life as a person of faith?
It's the people who are always telling everyone how faithful they are who are the ones who usually have something to hide. In my experience, the people who are the truly religious do so without all this "Look at me!" stuff at non-religious occassions.
Do they even allow FCA (Fellowship of Christian Atheletes) in Highschool any more?
1 game out of 81 isn’t wearing your faith on a sleeve.
Good Luck
They do here in VA....
If this article was about some muzzie group, it would read how government and management weren't bending over and grabbing their ankles to provide the devout with prayer rugs and foot baths....
Sept. 18th and the Cubs are in 1st place.
GOD is hanging around Wrigley.
GO CUBS.
I’m still glad you have Jaques Jones and not my Twins :)
I think within the cultural milieu that gave us our founding documents, which acknowledged our Creator, God’s commands would have been taken seriously, including the fourth one.
One, there is no such phrase in the US Constitution. Two, even if there were, the free exercise clause guarantees the right to publicly express religious views and practice religion. Of course this depends on having judges who can understant the plain meaning of the Constitution as written instead of of emanations an penumbras caused by bad acid trips.
I'm sure the author would approve of gay days and multi-cultural days in which the culture and mores of Americans of European origin are mocked.
That would be living it.
What we have here is a sad cultural phenomenon that is nonetheless, judging by the historical standard of the Old Testament with repeated falling away by the Jews, nothing new.
This "faith day" is not what Christianity is about. It is about ink, paper, water, bread, wine, and the ultimate act of love. "For greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends."
It highly honors God to use your God-Given talents to their best!
Whatever happened to freedom of religion? Freedom of Assimulation?
Following the Dodgers vs. Rockies game, fans with special tickets will gather in a corner of the parking lot for a concert by the Christian rock band Hawk Nelson, an appearance by characters from the "Veggie Tales" Christian television program and testimonials by several devout Dodgers.
BTW... did you notice this was AFTER the game? It required SPECIAL TICKETS to attend?
Precisely. What stops the faithful from doing all that you describe? Nothing that I can see.
What we have here is a sad cultural phenomenon that is nonetheless, judging by the historical standard of the Old Testament with repeated falling away by the Jews, nothing new.
Yeah, the culture at large doesn't support the beliefs you note. But that doesn't prevent individuals from practicing them.
This "faith day" is not what Christianity is about. It is about ink, paper, water, bread, wine, and the ultimate act of love. "For greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends."
Very well said.
Calm down. Why all the YELLING?
Wherever did I question freedom of religion? Wherever did I questions freedom to assimilate? (And what does publicly parading one's religion have to do with assimilation?
So what if it's after the game and requires special tickets? What does that have to do with my point?
I'm sure if it were Muslim Day people here would think so. ;)
Opps
Assimulate wrong word..
Meant Assemble or associate.
Because you said "stuff at non-religious occassions". Thus the very reason I highlighted a couple of words in my post (which you got all huffy and claimed I yelled)...
It is not stuff at a non-religious occasion whatsoever... it is a special occasion that is totally seperate after a sports event.
Calm down. Why all the YELLING?
Your the one that need to calm down. Yelling is a post that is completely in caps.. Emphasising is using the upper case to make a point on a select word or phrase.
publicly parading one's religion
God forbid one be allowed to attend a special event after the game to worship freely. Others might think they are parading... Jesus should of only preached on the Sabbath and hid the rest of the week.
Because you said "stuff at non-religious occassions". Thus the very reason I highlighted a couple of words in my post (which you got all huffy and claimed I yelled)...
It is not stuff at a non-religious occasion whatsoever... it is a special occasion that is totally seperate after a sports event.
Calm down. Why all the YELLING?
Your the one that need to calm down. Yelling is a post that is completely in caps.. Emphasising is using the upper case to make a point on a select word or phrase.
publicly parading one's religion
God forbid one be allowed to attend a special event after the game to worship freely. Others might think they are parading... Jesus should of only preached on the Sabbath and hid the rest of the week.
Your = You’re
If it sold tickets I could careless.
Hell they seriously have knitting day at the ball park here.
Ultimately that’s what a baseball team wants to do, Put butts in the seats.
Who cares who they cater to on a home game? Now if it was Suicide Bomber Memorial Day at the park, that would be a different ball game.
How did I get all huffy? Forget it, I'm not interested.
So baseball rallies or whatever are religious occassions? Guess I missed that part at mass...
It is not stuff at a non-religious occasion whatsoever... it is a special occasion that is totally seperate after a sports event.
OK. And...?
Your the one that need to calm down.
Why? Have I been uncivil?
Yelling is a post that is completely in caps.. Emphasising is using the upper case to make a point on a select word or phrase.
Which you kept doing. Funny how you went from several times in one post to zero in this one, if it was merely emphasis and not yelling.
God forbid one be allowed to attend a special event after the game to worship freely. Others might think they are parading... Jesus should of only preached on the Sabbath and hid the rest of the week.
When did I say one not be allowed to attend any special event? When did I say one should be prevented from worshipping freely?
Answer: I didn't, but you have to imply I did to maintain your persecution pose.
I merely asked why people felt the need to parade their religion in non-religious situations. You can pretend I was attacking religion, if it makes you feel good to play the victim role, but I didn't do that.
You can just not answer my questions. No need to act all persecuted.
I only care to the extent that I'm curious about why people do this, that's all.
Now if it was Suicide Bomber Memorial Day at the park, that would be a different ball game.
Sure would bring new meaning to "sacrifice fly."
"They've got a man on second--OH, he just blowed up and took out the infield!"
Judges who fail to understand their jobs and jobs limitations are so numerous it hurts.
Yes, I'm aware of what I'm setting myself up for here.
You knew exactly what you were doing. You fully steamed head first into this... and yes you are attacking Christians.
“Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy, to not do any work” incl. spending money so others can work on the Lord’s Day.”
Paul discussed this in the New Testament and said that keeping the Sabbath was not a requirement because we are not under the Law anymore, so that is not required to ‘live what one believes’.
I will have to reply tommorrow... it is way past bedtime.
Uh, yeah, that's why I wrote "Yes, I'm aware of what I'm setting myself up for here." Which you quoted. (?)
and yes you are attacking Christians.
LOL! Quote where I attacked Christians!
Go ahead--show the words I used to attack Christians, or apologize. Which you don't have the grace to do, I'm sure.
Well-named. Down a couple of quarts, I'd say.
At work we had a similar mental excercise a few years back during the World Cup.
I envisioned an Israel/Palestinean game where the Palestineans sent in a suicde bomber to take out the Israeli goalie to win the game.
As to your question of why people do it? Many faiths require/encourage public expressions of Faith. I always thought Christianity is one of those. The idea of Fellowship is strewn throughout everything I ever learned.
Think like those Falon Gong people, they could be all underground in China, but thier religion REQUIRES them to be open and practice thier faith in Public. Even if that means you are persecuted and killed.
Amen.
*Dons asbestos suit.*
When religion and the secular meet, religion almost always suffers.
Thanks for the info.
I know plenty of people who show their faith by publicly doing good works and publicly advocating prayer while they do it, publicly acknowledging their faith, etc. I know people who are openly and vocally Christian who work at a homeless shelter near me; someone I am very close to works at a hospice and is similarly very vocal about her religious motivation. THAT is what I consider being open and practicing their faith in public. THIS sort of thing nowhere in that ballpark, so to speak.
Could you expand on that? Thanks.
I wasn’t talking about you are driven to go to a ball game because you are a christian.
Area churches think going to a ballgame with your church group will build bonds (not barroid) within the group. If anything is the goal it’s that.
Oh and the Rockies, like any club, love group sales
Well, you have professional sports who say, “Hey, we’re selling tickets! Great!” And then you have the religious who say, “We’re bringing our message to a boatload of people! Great!”
A couple of things happen down the line:
A)The religious groups begin making demands that prove less than beneficial to the bottomline and the sports guys drop them like a bad habit.
B)The religious folks keep pandering via pop culture to what they perceive as an increasingly wider audience and in the process somehow forget the original message.
Just my opinion, but linking a “for profit” organizations with religion doesn’t seem a great strategy.
I understood your point. I understand why the club would want to do this. My interest, though, is in those who want to attend this thing as some kind of demonstration of their faith.
Just my opinion, but linking a “for profit” organizations with religion doesn’t seem a great strategy.
It cheapens the religious faith to allow oneself to be used in this way, IMHO.
How utterly convenient for you--I call you out to prove your accusation of Christian-bashing, and suddenly it's bedtime.
Right now there appears to be synergy. But the ultimate goals (pun intended) of professional sports teams are not the ultimate goals of those with faith.
Quote below...
"But whatever happened to praying behind closed doors, and not wearing your religion on your sleeve"
This is a no brainer... you attacked Christians that dared show their faith outside of their home...
Nothing happened, Christians founded America so they could show their faith whenever and where ever they felt like it. Thomas Jefferson hired a band to play during a revival held in a public building once... Did he give a hoot if it offended you? The founder Benjamin Rush proudly proclaimed in congress --"I am neither... I'm a Christocrat" -- Show me exactly Biblically that a Christian is not to gather with other Christians? Did the revival meetings at the rivers to Baptize member occur in the dark or out in public as a testimony to all.
Basically you have made a veiled attempt to critise Christians that show themselves in public as they are without hiding their faith. You bushed off the FACT that this event was after the game and required special tickets (thus was not even within the context of the sports event).. and you have yet proven that to me or anyone else that Christians are to hide their true nature to others in public. What exactly gave you this impression?
Can you keep you comments civil please, thanks.
Thomas Jefferson also edited the King James Bible — removing all the miracles (the guy couldn’t stop tinkering!). Does that offend you?
Knocked THAT one outta the park! :)
No, I didn't. What a pathetic attempt to smear someone who dared ask WHY people chose to do this.
The rest of your post is completely meaningless spin trying to couch my question as an attack.
You have a lot of nerve asking me to be civil after such a loathsome lie.
Did he remember to take this one out too...
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish [ought] from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
He must of done that during one if his French visits. LOL..
I didn’t read anything in there that said people are going there as demonstrations of faith. It’s not like they are replacing Mass with America’s Pastime.
When I was a kid we always went to Scout night at the Ball park.
Some of it was reinforcement as a group, but mostly it was cheap tickets and you more knew the environment you were taking your family to. Some of these people are crazy about the whole environment thing (both ways.) The author (I bet) hates seeing God mentioned anywhere especially to an audience. Hence the disgust for Dungee and all of this.
These people wouldn’t want to sit around me and my friends at a game. So they generally don’t go except maybe on faith night when I’m more likely to be at the pub cursing up a storm.
Careful--you'll be called a Christian basher.
Thanks for your observations. Too bad there's always a smear-merchant like LowIntelligence--uh, LowOil who has to play martyr when people try to open up an interesting discussion.
Handicap pitcher... thanks
You can google “Jefferson Bible” and several sites have the complete text.
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