So dark the ax of Ismail
Posted on 04/21/2007 10:18:40 AM PDT by em2vn
It was reportedly scrawled in red ink on the arm of the Virginia Tech gunman after his shooting rampage that left him and 32 others dead. It was written on an overnight postage Seung-Hui Cho sent between the two shootings. .....a variation of it appeared on a file ....sent to NBC that included Cho's rambling, hate-filled video, incoherent written messages and photos. While there's no clear explanation of its meaning, the Internet is abuzz with speculation about the meaning of the phrase "Ismail Ax" on Cho's arm, "A. Ishmael" on the package and "axishmiel" on the file.
(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...
I’m reminded of my dog chasing his tail.
“Call me Ismail”
Having viewed a fairly detailed graphic of the shipping label, I’ve been saying for the last two days that the return address on the label was A. Ishmiel, not Ishmael or Ishmail. The spelling on the file name seems to confirm that. If you look closely at the return address on the label, you can see a small dot over the fifth letter, making it an ‘i’. As a result, it matches the file name, and raises questions about the accuracy of the reporting on the ‘arm logo’.
in this sick SOB’S mind it had a meaning and someone with his pc or writings will figger it out.
There’s also the post I made about the Neo-Nazi symbols that Cho used —
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1820522/posts
Cho had all sorts of “connections” — but he was never a “member” of any of these connections. It was mainly in his head (like his imaginary girlfriend, called Jelly). He just borrowed these symbols and attached them to his mixed up thinking and twisted concepts he had.
So, you have a “smattering” and a “smorgasbord” of so-called “radical ideas” that he “used”....
Regards,
Star Traveler
I figured, it is his last staement.
Is mail cut off.
The mail NBC received is his final word.
The mail was his ax to grind?
ax
1. an instrument with a bladed head on a handle or helve, used for hewing, cleaving, chopping, etc.
2. Jazz Slang. any musical instrument.
3. the ax, Informal. a. dismissal from employment: to get the ax.
b. expulsion from school.
c. rejection by a lover, friend, etc.: His girlfriend gave him the ax.
d. any usually summary removal or curtailment.
–verb (used with object) 4. to shape or trim with an ax.
5. to chop, split, destroy, break open, etc., with an ax: The firemen had to ax the door to reach the fire.
6. Informal. to dismiss, restrict, or destroy brutally, as if with an ax: The main office axed those in the field who didn’t meet their quota. Congress axed the budget. Also, axe.
—Idiom7. have an ax to grind, to have a personal or selfish motive: His interest may be sincere, but I suspect he has an ax to grind.
You said — “Having viewed a fairly detailed graphic of the shipping label, I’ve been saying for the last two days that the return address on the label was A. Ishmiel, not Ishmael or Ishmail. The spelling on the file name seems to confirm that. If you look closely at the return address on the label, you can see a small dot over the fifth letter, making it an ‘i’. As a result, it matches the file name, and raises questions about the accuracy of the reporting on the ‘arm logo’.”
I would be willing to bet, that when you were looking at that detailed graphic of the shipping label — you never picked up on the “Neo-Nazi” symbol[s] in it — either....
Regards,
Star Traveler
So dark the ax of Ismail
You said — “I’m reminded of my dog chasing his tail.”
Yep, that’s what it showed in his last CAT scan. They wondered how the dog got in there.... :-)
Cho Seung Hui is Keyser Söze.
Somene posted about this before, only he changed the X to a K and then he posted information about a shrink that treats the mentally ill named, Ismail Ak.
He is in Turky.
You said — “It was Isaac, not Ismael or whatever, that God commanded Abraham to sacrifice as proof of his loyalty and obedience (Genesis 22).”
Ummmmmm...., in case you hadn’t noticed before — *this very thing* is one of the main points of contention between Judaism and Islam. They have argued over this point from the beginning.
Study up on Islam and see...
Regards,
Star Traveler
I love that graphic... LOL
[I’m going to buy a magnifying glass today and examine my money.... :-) ]
Hey! Did you get the significance of “88” in the address?
Check it out —
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1820522/posts
Well, there's more to it than that, and it is only one hypothesis among several possible.
Here is my thread to which you refer:
lol, OK, that’s a keeper.
Don't forget November 22, 1963.
You have no idea how far up this thing goes.
I think he was just one lone crazy man.
That’s true but the idea is no more valid than anything else that has been proposed.
In Cho’s mind it could have meant nothing more than does Acme Safe Company in the the Wiley Coyote cartoons or it may have indicated everything.
Was there an 88 minute time lapse to when he killed the first two people ( Emily being his imaginary lover) to when he mailed the package or the time to the second killings?
You said — “Was there an 88 minute time lapse to when he killed the first two people ( Emily being his imaginary lover) to when he mailed the package or the time to the second killings?”
No, actually the “88” is on the Anti-Defamation League’s web site, showing that it’s a symbol for Neo-Nazi’s....
You can see more at this link —
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1820522/posts
Also, the Nazi web site, Stormfront, was discussing this on one of their threads, until it got too much attention and they wiped the thread out. I was able to pull a few comments from that Neo-Nazi thread about it and post it over on this FReeper thread (above)...
How I came across the Neo-Nazi thread was from one of the Virginia Tech student blogs. One anonymous poster put in that blog, the link to the Neo-Nazi discussion, which I then picked up. It doesn’t appear that too many others have picked that up, yet.
Regards,
Star Traveler
You said — “I think he was just one lone crazy man.”
That he was, definitely. But, at the same time, Cho picked up all sorts of “hate symbolism” from all over the web and attached it to his manifesto, in symbolic language. You can hear his “symbolism” too, just “laced” throughout his manifesto. In addition, he put Neo-Nazi symbolism on his return address, too. He mixed that on the very next line from the Islamic symbolism...
So, he was “mixed up” in more ways than one (not only in his head) — so that he “mixed up” symbolism from all sorts of hate literature and groups. He did that “with purpose”...
Regards,
Star Traveler
Cho’s message, if you could call it that, was one of syncretic madness.
You said — “That’s true but the idea is no more valid than anything else that has been proposed.”
But, then again — you see — you’re thinking “too logically”. That’s because when we think about idealogies and philosophies, we try to be *consistent* with one or the other or the other. We do that, because others will “call us to account” — when we are *inconsistent* with a particular philosophy.
For example, if you are Islamic, it’s inconsistent (in their belief) to have Christ crucified. They don’t think he was. And He also was not the Son of God, either. He was simply a prophet, leading up to the final prophet of Mohammed.
If you try to maintain, in the Islamic way of thought that Jesus Christ was crucified — you will be “called out” as being inconsistent with Islamic thelogy — and rightfully so.
That’s just one example....
BUT, Cho was already totally mixed up so his ideas and “idealogies” were like going to a “smorgasbord” in his brain — it was a “little bit here” and a “little bit there” to make up his crazed ideas, as he presents in his manifesto.
And thus — where you go wrong in your particular “line of thinking” — is that he *has to be consistent* — and if he isn’t then this means it was *nothing* in his mind — and we haven’t “proven the case”.
That’s simply your “sane” mind at work. It wasn’t Cho’s mind, however.
With Cho, you pick at it all, you combine it, and you “synthesize” it into whatever reality you want it to be.
THEREFORE, Cho *did* have symbolism from all sorts of idealogies and hate philosophies — all combined together in his manifesto and it all did have “meaning” (in his twisted brain) — even if it doesn’t seem “consistent” to us.
So, when you say — “but the idea is no more valid than anything else that has been proposed...” — to that I say —
“Cho was all of the above and none of the above!”
Regards,
Star Traveler
absolutely no doubt there — and *that* is my message...
LOL..., great graphic...
You asked — “Was there an 88 minute time lapse to when he killed the first two people ( Emily being his imaginary lover) to when he mailed the package or the time to the second killings?”
Well, let’s see (I haven’t checked it out before...) — 7:15 AM to 9:01 AM (time of mailing)... equals... 106 minutes (did I do the math right?).
The difference from 88 equals 18 minutes (just for curiosity, to see how far off it is).
Does that answer your question?
Regards,
Star Traveler
You said — “Well, there’s more to it than that, and it is only one hypothesis among several possible.”
With Cho, the line that everyone should remember is —
“He was all of the above and none of the above.”
That answers all you need to understand about Cho.
Regards,
Star Traveler
All your Ismail Ax are belong to dead crazy guy.
Sometimes people are just crazy and you can’t make any sense of what they do.
You said — “Sometimes people are just crazy and you can’t make any sense of what they do.”
That’s right. You cannot make any “sense” of it from a “normal mind’s framework”. However, there *is* a kind of “sense” to it from a twisted mind’s framework. And that was Cho’s mind (twisted, unhinged, self-absorbed, feeling persecuted, everyone was out to get him, subject to huge injustices and so on).
And so, that kind of twisted and unhinged mind *will pick up* symbolism from whatever source to fit their confused and “smorgasbord” ideas from many different philosophies. They won’t be consistent and — in fact — the various philophies that he borrows from can be *against* one another. That doesn’t matter to Cho. He’s only “cherry picking” according to what his twisted brain sees, from the various kind of hate literature and philosophies out there.
So, you can make a bit of “sense” from it, as long as you don’t try to hold him to “consistency” and “normalcy”. That’s where everyone goes wrong in “trying to make sense” — they’re doing it from a “normal standpoint”....
Regards,
Star Traveler
Uh-oh!!
I said — “The difference from 88 equals 18 minutes...”
This is way too weird. I won’t tell you what the 18 minutes means... :-)
That would be “way too conspiracist” (which I don’t believe is the case). BUT, the 88 and then the 18 “can” be construed as having some meaning (both in the same “area” or “philosophy”). Hint: source is at the same place as the other.
I don’t believe it really is “meaningful” though, because I don’t believe Cho had *that much control* so that he could make the timeframe fit down to the minute. That would be assuming that he did have that much control. People normally can’t do that.
Regards,
Star Traveler
P.S. — Okay, let’s see how many others pick out the “18 minutes” significance (it’s “far out”)... LOL
What time did the second killings take place?
You forgot 8. (ebonics) to pose a question.
You said — “What time did the second killings take place?”
Not exactly sure of that one. I only have an approximate idea. Perhaps you can get a source for that information?
Thanks...
Regards,
Star Traveler
People want to know “why”, so we can make rational plans to avoid similar evil in the future. Cho’s twisted mind had reasons, and he thought that he was spelling it all out with his manifesto, but to everyone else, it’s all a bunch of fractured nonsense.
That’s all we’ll ever understand about this particular evil madman. Fortunately, I don’t think we need to know much more about him, to take steps to mitigate future risks from threats that look like this.
Followup: — for that, try to get the time of the *first* 911 call. That will pin it down. Students were on the phone to 911 when he was in their classroom.
I still think that, after checking the computer records, that it will turn out the reference was to Ismail Ak.
Here is the timelines.
Forget my theory.
Just going off the cuff anyway.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/18/wcampus418.xml
Thanks for the timeline. I kept that for future reference.
“Jelly” as in KY Jelly?
you’ve got a “theory” I would say... LOL
You said — “That’s all we’ll ever understand about this particular evil madman. Fortunately, I don’t think we need to know much more about him, to take steps to mitigate future risks from threats that look like this.”
Well..., I don’t think that this is the case — that this is all we’ll ever understand about this guy. Keep in mind “profilers” go deeply into those things. And then they use that information in their work. Perhaps what you’re really saying is that people simply prefer not to go into it (personal preference) rather than “we cannot know or understand any more about this guy...”
Regards,
Star Traveler
That spelling is consistent with this reproduction of the Quran which shows the spelling as "Ishm'ael."
You forgot
Verb: to inquire
So, then, the address is spelled one way, the arm is spelled another way, and the file name is spelled a third way? Maybe the kid’s just a victim of bad phonics training.
LOL on the phonics.
I’m not so sure that the “arm” reference might not just be bad reporting. I’ve seen it reported various ways.
What is the “file name”?
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