The Salt Lake Shooter and Sudden Jihad Syndrome

Conservative Crusader ^ | 02-23-07 | David M. Huntwork

[TheConservativeCitizen]

If you only read the news as reported by the Main Stream Media, you would never know that we had just recently experienced another Jihad style attack by a Muslim on American soil.

On Monday, Feb. 12th, one time Bosnian refugee Sulejmen Talovic (age 18) walked into the Trolley Valley shopping mall in Salt Lake City and in a six minute rampage killed five people and severely wounded several more. The dead were identified as Jeffrey Walker, 52, Vanessa Quinn, 29, Kirsten Hinkley, 15, Teresa Ellis, 29, and Brad Frantz, 24.

My initial (blogged) reaction was:

“Any guesses as to whether he's a Muslim or not? I may be going out on a limb here, but I sense another follower of Allah and the Religion of Peace.... And might I add that this is a great example of how having a large section of the population allowed to conceal carry is a good idea.”

Sure enough it turns out Sulejmen Talovic was indeed a Muslim and that little nugget of information has fueled a firestorm of speculation among bloggers and unleashed accusations of ‘cover up’ directed towards the Main Stream Media and law enforcement investigators. The media showed an interesting and obvious reluctance to initially disclose, let alone discuss, eighteen year old Talovic’s religious persuasion...

[pepsionice]

While some of us might be willing to examine the Muslim angle to this story...if you were a kid in Bosnia...when the ethnic cleansing was taking place...you are screwed for the rest of your life. It doesn't matter what religion you had...there was death around every turn. The US took in alot of these refugees...and this kid is simply episode number one that we will have face.

[nyconse]

Another example of the peace loving mooslums. The MSM is really a piece of crap. All mooslums are suspect in my eyes. There is no such thing as a non violent mooslum. There is only a mooslum waiting to explode.

[43north]

What are you talking about? This loser was 3 years old when he lived in Bosnia. Don't hand me that "now he's screwed for the rest of his life" crap. He's a freaking jihadist. Don't try to explain away what their cult teaches them to do with worn-out sociaological theories from the 60's. What else could it be? That he was improperly toilet trained?

Give me a break!

[vpintheak]

That is true. It is also true that any sane person must also admit there is something about islam that turns people into flippin' psychopaths and represive SOB's.

[hsalaw]

I disagree. The United States took in a lot of Jewish refugees after WWII, many of whom were survivors of the "ethnic cleansing" of the Holocast, and I don't recall them either going on murderous rampages or being given a free pass if they did so. I have no trouble ascribing this foul and evil deed to the "religion of peace."

[WorkingClassFilth]

There was another one a year or two back who was from Bosnia (I think). He was one of two separate Islamofruitcakes that attacked Greyhound bus drivers with box cutters. The first one was a few weeks after 911 and he was killed in the crash. The second guy, though, was an active participant in a unit known as a death squad according to reports.

[JerseyJohn61]

He must have been another one of those Bush Administration
plants, sent in there to distract attention from that WOT
thing. I'm certain that those at the DU will get to the
bottom of this....JJ61(wink)

[pandoraou812]

I agree with you. We have taken in people from many countries and they have not gone on killing sprees..... I think we are going to see more of these crazy Islamics doing things like this. Another thing which scares me is the fact that so many inmates convert to Islam in prison. They seem to be very militant about their conversion too. I lived near a mosque years ago and most of its members were converts from jail. They scared the hell out of me.

[Mr. Mojo]

The media showed an interesting and obvious reluctance to initially disclose, let alone discuss, eighteen year old Talovic’s religious persuasion...

Let there be no doubt that had the perp been a professed Christian the MSM would've repeated that fact ad nauseam.

[WorkingClassFilth]

Oh, that and a bit more. I can see interviews with experts, theologians and mental health authorities all discussing the dangers inherent in R-A-D-I-C-A-L F-U-N-D-M-E-N-T-A-L-I-S-T doctrines. Urgent cautions for viewers that may know somebody who shows symptoms of religious conviction beyond watching Dr. Schuler and the Hour of Power TV on Sunday morning.

[TBP]

Why is the media suppressing this sotry? Why are they afraid to write about jihad in the USA?

[ansel12]

"I disagree. The United States took in a lot of Jewish refugees after WWII, many of whom were survivors of the "ethnic cleansing" of the Holocast, and I don't recall them either going on murderous rampages or being given a free pass if they did so. I have no trouble ascribing this foul and evil deed to the "religion of peace."




Pretty good point.

[REDWOOD99]

Because it means that W is right.

[ThreePuttinDude]

While some of us might be willing to examine the Muslim angle to this story...
if you were a kid in Bosnia...when the ethnic cleansing was taking place

Are you saying that this jihadist gets a pass because he was part
of an invasion, into a country that was trying to defend itself against Muslim invaders?

The only ethnic cleansing in Yugoslavia was the Ethnic Albanians murdering Serbs/Christians
in the Christian towns and cities in Yugoslavia.

Ethnic cleansing is another myth fed to us by the freakin' media.
Similar to every damn town or city in the middle east is the most holy, or some such crap.

[TheDon]

I read the family disagrees with that theory.

[Choose Ye This Day]

Salt Lake police so far keep saying that his religion played no factor, as far as they can tell. Nobody recalls seeing him at the local Islamic Center (2 blocks away from the massacre site)--or nobody has admitted such yet.

Usually, if they're wacked-out jihadis, they leave behind their martyrdom video, and they leave clues. So far, the police have found none. They say they are stumped.

[Cindy]

ON THE NET...

OSINT.INTERNET-HAGANAH.com (CONTRACOSTATIMES.com): Salt Lake City - "TROLLEY SQUARE OPERATION TO BE USED AS A CASE STUDY" (February 21, 2007)

KSL.com: "FATHER OF SHOOTER BELIEVES SOMEONE TOLD HIS SON TO KILL PEOPLE" (February 16, 2007, 12:49 pm)

SALT LAKE TRIBUNE: "TROLLEY KILLER HAD VIOLENT JUVENILE HISTORY" by Stephen Hunt and Brent Israelsen (Last updated February 15, 2007, 6:20:05 PM MST)

LittleGreenFootballs.com - "SALT LAKE CITY KILLER'S RECORDS RELEASED" (February 15, 2007)

Media.www.USISHIELD.com (AP): "GUNMAN KILLS 5 AT SALT LAKE CITY MALL" (ARTICLE SNIPPET: "The card store Cabin Fever had been packed with Valentine's Day shoppers Monday night when the shooting started, store owner David Dean said. Dean said his assistant manager called him, saying "someone's in the store killing people." The place was "all shot up," Dean said. He said three or four of the victims were shot inside.") (February 15, 2007)

LiveLeak.com: "DRAMATIC HOME VIDEO SHOWS UTAH MALL RAMPAGE"

JIHAD WATCH.org: "DESERET MORNING NEWS HITS 'ULTRACONSERVATIVE' WEBSITES FOR SUGGESTING SALT LAKE SHOOTING WAS JIHAD-MOTIVATED" (February 15, 2007)

JIHAD WATCH.org (BISMARCK TRIBUNE): Salt Lake City - "FBI: NO REASON TO BELIEVE SALT LAKE MALL SHOOTER WAS MOTIVATED BY RELIGIOUS EXTREMISM OR TERRORISM" (February 14, 2007)

KUTV.com: "FULL COVERAGE OF THE TERROR AT TROLLEY SQUARE" (Febuary 14, 2007, 9:48 pm US/Mountain)

CNN.com: "UTAH MALL GUNMAN WAS SREBRENICA SURVIVOR, COUSIN SAYS" (February 14, 2007, 11:59 p.m.)

FRONTPAGE MAGAZINE: "SALT LAKE JIHAD?" by Robert Spencer (February 15, 2007)

SLTRIB.com: "TROLLEY SQUARE: SUSPECT RARELY SEEN BY HIS NEIGHBORS A high school drop-out, Talovic's life and motive for the shooting remain a mystery" by Matthew D. LaPlante (ARTICLE SNIPPET: "Police say the gunman met his first two victims in the parking lot, firing off two rounds as they fell. "Die, motherf-----," Talovic said to them, according to one witness. Talovic appears to have uttered few further words. Witnesses said he moved deliberately through the ground floor corridors, firing round after round at helpless others, sometimes swearing, sometimes ordering his victims not to look at him. In seemingly random fashion, showing no emotion, he slaughtered five people and seriously wounded four others.") (Last updated February 14, 2007, 01:29 AM MST)

DESERET NEWS.com: "6 MINUTES OF HORROR: SHOOTER AIMED TO KILL AS MANY AS HE COULD" by Pat Reavy and Ben Winslow (ARTICLE SNIPPET: ""His intent was to shoot as many people as he possibly could," said Salt Lake City Police Chief Chris Burbank. Police released details Tuesday on Talovic's shooting rampage that left five people dead before off-duty Ogden police officer Ken Hammond and four Salt Lake City police officers killed him in "a shootout," Burbank said. Four other shooting victims are hospitalized. Talovic was armed with a shotgun, a .38-caliber handgun and "a backpack full of ammunition," Burbank said. Around the man's waist was a bandolier of shotgun shells. "He had a pump shotgun," said one witness, DeEtta Barta. "He was shooting, and he shot about four shots.") (February 14, 2007)

WorldNetDaily.com: "UTAH GUNMAN, 18, WAS MUSLIM FROM BOSNIA" (ARTICLE SNIPPET: "David Dean, who owns a greeting-card store at the mall, said three or four people died inside his store, which was packed with Valentine's Day shoppers.")(February 13, 2007)

JIHAD WATCH.org (AP): "SALT LAKE CITY: BOSNIAN TEEN WANTED 'TO KILL A LARGE NUMBER OF PEOPLE'" (February 13, 2007)

LittleGreenFootballs.com - weblog: "SALT LAKE CITY KILLER IDENTIFIED Sudden jihad syndrome?" (February 13, 2007)

Google - Search News: "SULEJMAN TALOVIC"

[singfreedom]

I, also, believe this was a "terrorist" attack. One of those independent terrorist actions the jihadists are always encouraging. I'd not heard ANY news source report that this thug uttered the "God is Great" mantra, although it is clearly audible on the video.

I agree with his father though, there was clearly someone who helped him obtain the weapons AND the practice space and training to use said weapons.

Throughout our nation's history we have taken in the hapless victims of other nations' wars, but I don't ever recall having to worry about them, individually or collectively, becoming, for no apparent reason, suddenly unhinged and killing Americans. MANY of our legal immigrants have witnessed, and been the victims of, horrible crimes, but I just know of to many who HAVEN'T reacted in such a fashion.

[Dr.Zoidberg]

Sudden Jihad Syndrome or How I lost all self control and got closer to allah.

[cgbg]

why suppressing this story?

In the view of government and media elites (national, state, local) the public dosen't have a need to know anything that might make them panic or reduce their travel or other normal commercial activity. They also believe the sheeple don't have a need to know anything that could reveal government or media incompetence.

What the government and media "leaders" agree on is that "they" should control the political agenda. They don't a "bunch of right-wing extremists" disrupting their game.

Add to that a pinch of political correctness and a dash of laziness and stupidity and we are there.

[driftless2]

"screwed for life"

Tell that to the thousands of holocaust survivors of WWII. I've read many stories of Jewish survivors who lost whole families, friends, and relatives during the war. They made it to other countries and got on with their lives. I doubt any of them decided to gun down people in countries that gave them a new life. The kid was only three when he left Bosnia. You can't ignore the strong possibility that he was just another Islamic skull full of jihad mush who decided to take out some non-jihadists on his way to paradise.

[singfreedom]

Does anyone know if Utah has a conceal/carry law?

As for myself, and my family, it wouldn't alter travel plans or any commercial activity. We would just be more diligent about carrying our c/c defensive weapons.

I don't think that politicians, or the MSM, are worried about Americans changing their lifestyle. I think their overriding concern, in every instance of "sudden jihad syndrome", is that the American public will rise up, en masse, and massacre Muslims---as you said, they think we are all too stupid to handle the truth.

[Kozak]

Salt Lake police so far keep saying that his religion played no factor, as far as they can tell. Nobody recalls seeing him at the local Islamic Center (2 blocks away from the massacre site)--or nobody has admitted such yet.

Uh huh. Except for the audio file of him yelling "Allah Akbar" several times just before the police plugged him.

[Kozak]

Let there be no doubt that had the perp been a professed Christian the MSM would've repeated that fact ad nauseam.

Usually a story about a multiple shooting involving an 18 year old "child" would be good for WEEKS of hyperventilating and breast beating by the press. THIS time down the memory hole in 2 days.

[Kozak]

Why is the media suppressing this sotry? Why are they afraid to write about jihad in the USA?

For the same reason the FBI will NOT recognise these free lance Jihadists for what they are. What is to be done about them? The answer scares the Feds and the press. Enough anger from the general public, and we WILL solve the problem and it won't be pretty.

[Dosa26]

Usually, if they're wacked-out jihadis, they leave behind their martyrdom video, and they leave clues. So far, the police have found none.

If I was to hazzard a guess, in the third world shtholes you become a hero for doing the whole "I'm a warrior of islam" rap, the mother-thing beams and the father praises. Here, all the razamataz will cause problems for the family (for instance, does this lunatic have any brothers? Where do THEY live, they obviously had the same upbringing...and so on.)

[tkathy]

Blame others crap. This "kid" was obviously brainwashed into hatred and murder by the mullahs of murder.

[Beckwith]

First response is from an individual making excuses for this murdering S.O.B.

Happens every time one of these savages goes on a murdering spree.

"Oh Fadda, he's really a good boy."

[PeterPrinciple]

Why is the media suppressing this sotry? Why are they afraid to write about jihad in the USA?



Because then Bush would be right................

[restornu]

I always wonder years ago when we have the kinds of killings go back to the first time when that 16 years in the play ground of Arizona shoot those kids them himself.

There is a pattern in most all of these cases.

To get our attention like a reallity show and experiment in how we as people will respond.

Another reason is to distract us from some other important even going on and our focus is diverted to these events.

Don't get me wrong this still could also be a Jhadist that was activated to distract our minds.

So the next time one of these kind of events take place also look around to see what else was taking place elsewhere!

[SauronOfMordor]

The father of Trolley Square shooter Sulejmen Talovic apologizes over and over for the ordeal. Suljo Talovic says no one who knew his son saw this coming, and he believes someone pushed him to do it.

At the mosque the shooter prayed at, the month previously the imam was dismissed and disappeared:

The relative said the abrupt departure - one that left the imam "in shock" - was driven by something more than his marital issues. The imam, the relative said, had recently raised concerns about board finances, the exclusion of women from the board and the housing of "suspicious" individuals in the mosque.

[SauronOfMordor]

While some of us might be willing to examine the Muslim angle to this story...if you were a kid in Bosnia...when the ethnic cleansing was taking place...you are screwed for the rest of your life. It doesn't matter what religion you had...there was death around every turn. The US took in alot of these refugees...and this kid is simply episode number one that we will have face.

The lack of similar incidents involving the Vietnamese Boat People over the last few decades shoot a few holes in that theory.

We also had a decided lack of incidents post-1945 involving Jews shooting up Germans in the US

I think Islam is extremely relevant here, in that its teachings explicitly DEMAND violence against non-Muslims. See my FR homepage for references from the Quran and Hadith

[DCPatriot]

Is it a written rule? A gentlemen agreement?

Is it taught in journalism school?

Why does a massacre like this not reach the light of day in the mainstream media?

If the Utah Shooter event were to get the coverage Anna Nicole Smith and Britany Spears are getting, it would lead to the bloodshed of innocent people.

The Islamics weren't the only ones in the past 100 years that butcher whole groups of people.

IMO, that's the reason. And probably a good one.

[SauronOfMordor]

Salt Lake police so far keep saying that his religion played no factor, as far as they can tell. Nobody recalls seeing him at the local Islamic Center (2 blocks away from the massacre site)--or nobody has admitted such yet.

A relative confirms him as attending that mosque

Although he quit school at 16, Sulejman Talovic often attended Friday prayers at the Al-Noor mosque on 700 East in Salt Lake City,[ a block away from the mall] said Salih Omerovic, Ajka's cousin.

Salih Omerovic said the young man stopped coming to the prayers in December, when he landed a full-time job at Aramark Uniform Services in South Salt Lake. He said Sulejman Talovic's father had pressured his son to get a job to help out with the family's living expenses.

A spokesman for the mosque had issued a statement saying there were "no records" of the shooter attending the mosque. This is only relevant if they kept attendence records, which they probably didn't.

It more likely also means "we have destroyed all records which may have mentioned him"

[EverOnward]

"They say they are stumped."

Doesn't surprise me. When I lived in that valley the police were stumped when the thieves footprints in the snow ended at the ditch. My Dad had to do his own detective work. The police did, however, manage to arrest my brothers for trespassing on our own property. My parents came home wondering why the chores weren't done -- hard to do chores at the police station.

[SauronOfMordor]

Usually, if they're wacked-out jihadis, they leave behind their martyrdom video, and they leave clues. So far, the police have found none.

Or at least have not admitted to finding any. Three possibilities:

1. None was left
2. One was left, and it was destroyed or hidden by the family
3. The police found one, but are not revealing it for political considerations

[SauronOfMordor]

The links at post 35 and 32 are not on your list yet

[ko_kyi]

Regarding post #3

Well said.

[Cindy]

Thank you Sauron of Mordor.

[WLR]

"..if you were a kid in Bosnia...when the ethnic cleansing was taking place...you are screwed for the rest of your life. It doesn't matter what religion you had..."

Well that explains all those Greek Orthodox Terrorists (The Greek Style Chicken and Ouzo gang) who came here at the turn of the Century murdering people because millions were murdered by the Muslim Turks...

No?
Maybe it was the Armenian small grocery market Christian Terrrorists who came here after millions were murdered by the Muslim Turks.
No?


Oh.. I remember it was the Jewish Terrorist Accountants Guild (an especially ruthless gang) who after surviving the Nazi Holocaust and coming to America just could not stop running into bus and train stations and murdering people....

Oh not them either?...

Maybe it was all the Combat Veterans?...

No not them either.? mmmm

Just Stop it.

Your attempt to misdirect and mislead the American People is shameful.

W

[Choose Ye This Day]

I heard the audio and I couldn't make heads or tails out of anything. Didn't sound like "allahu akbar" to me.

[WLR]

"allahu akbar"

Well that completely settles it...

On Page 26 section C of the AL Quiada Manual it clearly states..

"One must shout Alla Akbar in order to qualify as a AQ Certified Islamofacist Terrorist"

The game is up for you distorters of the truth.

Black is not White, Up is not down and a Muslim that randomly murders people is not going to get a "Pass" cause you don't like/cannot face the obvious truth.


W

[Choose Ye This Day]

Get a grip.

You can jump to all the misguided conclusions you want.

I'm simply stating the facts. One poster says the kid screamed "allahu akbar" as he shot people. I say it didn't sound like that to me. That does NOT make me a distorter of the truth.

Go peddle your paranoia to someone else.

[Cedar]

"If you only read the news as reported by the Main Stream Media,"

Fortunately, this is happening less and less for most Americans.

[WLR]

"Get a grip.

"You can jump to all the misguided conclusions you want. "


If I was mistaken good..

Better that than for you to be trying to downplay a potential terrorist connection..


W

[Kozak]

Did you listen to the "cleaned up " version that was posted?

I recorded the file myself and did a little audio processing with Nero and it sounded to me like "Allah Akbar". One thing I do know for sure is the FBI WILL know what he said. I just doubt that knowledge will get spread to the public.

[Kozak]

http://www.meldt.com/audio/2nd_comment_70_stretch.wma

Slowed down clip.

Also see post 64 on this thread for audio analysis

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1786291/posts?q=1&&page=51

[ronnie raygun]

We silly americans continue to fund the liberal media by watching thier unpatriotic newscasts and buying thier rag papers. They all have us believing all jihadists are fun loving! wake up America start today to patronize the media with your views and patriotism!!!!!!!

[ronnie raygun]

WOW! wait until the liberal, TERRORIST PROTECTING ambulance chasing, ememy lawyers in America get a hole of this new syndrome. sounds like "people dont kill people guns kill people"