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Posted on 12/15/2006 2:07:00 PM PST by WesternCulture
There's a certain aspect of this issue that the article below fails to comment upon, therefore, please read my comments to the article.
"Sweden: the world's most modern country?
Is Sweden the most modern country in the world? And are Swedes the most insecure people on this planet? These two questions are central to a new series on SVT due to premiere on Wednesday.
The programme, 'Världen's modernaste land' (‘The most modern country in the world’), is a reflection on what it means to be a Swede. The presenter, television-friendly linguist Fredrik Lindström, has already notched up two major successes for the national broadcaster.
In his two earlier series he analysed the idiosyncrasies of the Swedish language and lent a curious ear to the nation’s most mysterious dialects.
But now Lindström has chosen to burrow into the deepest crevice of them all: the Swedish psyche.
Over seven episodes the timeless riddle that is Sweden will be broken down into its constituent parts and slowly unravelled.
The programme considers the theory that the Swedish mentality is premised on two opposites: complacency and insecurity.
According to Lindström and his historian sidekick Peter Englund, Swedes tend to trust in the notion that Sweden is one of the best and most modern countries in the world. But these same people also view themselves as tepid and boring when viewed in an international perspective.
Fredrik Lindström explains these generalisations held by Swedes about themselves and their country as “a sort of self-fulfilling prophecy”.
The programme offers answers to a whole catalogue of the type of questions posed by anybody who has spent any length of time in the country.
Wednesday’s first episode offers a dissection of the supposedly antisocial Swede.
Why is it not the done thing to talk to people on the bus, whereas when invited to somebody's home you are expected to babble incessantly? Is this not a burden for the famously reticent Swedes? Or is the shy Swede just another myth that needs deflating?
“There is a historical reason that is often mentioned to explain Swedes’ antisocial side: land partition reforms begun in the late 18th century, which destroyed village communities,” Lindström explains.
As a result, rather than preserving a strong sense of community, ”everybody had to look after themselves as much as possible. This becomes clear in sayings such as ‘alone is strong’ or ‘a good man looks after himself’.”
In another episode Lindström casts viewers back to the late 1960s, when plots were hatched to build a million flats, when politicians embraced the cardigan, formal titles were abandoned, the word "mysig" (nice and cosy) made its national breakthrough, and people started taking off their shoes at the door.
While shoe removal and cosiness might be viewed as intertwined, there is also a political sub-text, according to Lindström.
“It is a commonly held opinion in Sweden that it is bourgeois to keep your shoes on indoors. This is probably inherited from the 1960s when the radical left wished to distance itself from middle-class habits such as indoor shoes.”
All through the series the questions just keep on coming.
Why are 40 per cent of Swedish households inhabited by a single person (60 per cent in Stockholm), which is a higher proportion than anywhere else in the world. Is this a sign of modernity, atomization, independence, or something else entirely?
Why do Swedes have such a weakness for rational arguments, technology and standardisation?
Why did the pared down functional style prove such an architectural hit in Sweden?
Are Swedes cold-hearted engineers who always let their heads rule their hearts?
Is it true that the majority of ‘traditional’ Christmas dishes made their debut in the 1960s and 1970s?
Why is everybody just sitting there? Why is nobody doing anything?
So many questions! Could be worth tuning in to get some answers.
Världens Modernaste Land will be broadcast on SVT 2 on Wednesday at 8pm. Repeated on SVT24, Thursday, 10pm; SVT2, Saturday, 11:50pm; SVT2, Sunday, 12:40pm
Paul O'Mahony"
While many US citizens still view Sweden as a "Socialist" country, Sweden has in fact been more successful in capitalism than most industrialized nations around the Globe the last 15 years and have boasted substantially higher figures of GDP growth rates than the other, mostly zero-growth, economies of Europe.
Furthermore, Several Liberals in the US fancy making Sweden an example of what the future United States of America ought to look like while being unaware/ignorant/dishonest enough to recognize that:
1. North America and Northern Europe constitute two completely different cultural and political traditions. At best, We can learn from each other.
2. There is a very strong tendency among Scandinavian voters in general (Swedish, Danish, Norwegian, Finnish, Icelandic) of turning to Conservatism presently. The old "Socialist" ideas of the 1960-1970's is something we sent down the drain 25 years ago. Today, Scandinavians believe in hard work and capitalist investment (while I must admit several of our taxes are very high - while in fact corporate taxes are lower than in the US).
Today, Many Scandinavians feel the tradition of strong unions and the idea of the welfare state have helped the Scandinavian countries become the richest part of the world per se, while there ALSO - even in a homogenous culture whith a inherited codex of honor like Scandinavia - exists a great risk of these factors strangling the development of an economy heavily dependent on competition with the world outside of its borders (which is the situation in all of these countries). This has been the case in several contexts and a lot of voters have got fed up with narrow-minded socialist policies.
Welfare is OK, but creating something using your very own hands is worth ten, if not hundred, times more. That is the spirit that gave birth to IKEA, Volvo, Nokia, Ericsson, Lego, SAAB and Electrolux.
What could American Liberals learn from the recent development of Scandinavia?
- That the values of Hard Work, Culture, Family, Education and Enterprise are intrinsic to restoring Civilization when under attack.
Ping to our 67-member Swedish Ping List, including our newest member, Dixie Yooper. (SPL members, please add Dixie Yooper to that list I sent you yesterday.)
Sweadish VOLVO makes most of the garbage trucks in the USA. They outlast any the US can build,
I recently watched a show about the Copenhagen-Malmo bridge/tunnel. Very impressive (Although the cost was never mentioned). Unfortunately, it appears that the roadway has facilitated the Muslim invasion of Malmo.
It looks like the pendulum is swinging the other way in the Scandanavian countries for many reasons. I hope the US is paying attention.
For Example...
I find the following quote from a female professor disturbing:
Unni Wikan, a professor of social anthropology at the University of Oslo, in 2001 said that Norwegian women must take their share of responsibility for these rapes; because Muslim men found their manner of dress provocative. The professor's conclusion was not that Muslim men living in the West needed to adjust to Western norms, but the exact opposite: Norwegian women must realize that we live in a Multicultural society and adapt themselves to it.
So, what again do we have to learn from Sweden?
"Swedes view ourselves as being more in touch with the phenomena of globalization (and especially that of the international political, scientific and technological development of our times) than any other nation. "
Really?
even in a homogenous culture whith a inherited codex of honor like Scandinavia...
Funny, I don't recall the Finns being particularly fond of the Swedes nor of the same language/cultural stock.
How's that influx of Muslims working out in Malmo and elswhere? Are there still students receiving government stipends while working on there 3 or 4th degree because of a lack of jobs?
Malmo...
"I recently watched a show about the Copenhagen-Malmo bridge/tunnel. Very impressive (Although the cost was never mentioned). Unfortunately, it appears that the roadway has facilitated the Muslim invasion of Malmo."
I heard the residents of Malmö financed it all in order to encourage muslim immigrants to emmigrate to Copenhagen, Malmö's twin city.
“It is a commonly held opinion in Sweden that it is bourgeois to keep your shoes on indoors. This is probably inherited from the 1960s when the radical left wished to distance itself from middle-class habits such as indoor shoes.”
No, they are not. We used to have a "Finnish" guy at our company who told me stories of the racism his wife and children experienced from the Finns in school. She and his children were red-heads. He also experienced some racism, as he was dark-haired. Yes, a "modern culture". I have no background to talk about how the Swedes behave, however.
I heard that Finns regard Swedes as their gay cousins.
“It is a commonly held opinion in Sweden that it is bourgeois to keep your shoes on indoors. This is probably inherited from the 1960s when the radical left wished to distance itself from middle-class habits such as indoor shoes.”
For once the radical left had a good idea ( borrowed from the Japanese ) . Nothing like stepping in a pile of dog poop in the dark and then walking through your plush carpeted living room ...
nothing good has come out of Sweden since the Krag Jorgensen.
I see this quote a lot, so I went looking for more information and found this, which makes me wonder just what the original context of the statement was:
For the last ten years, Unni Wikan has publicly campaigned to convince the Norwegian government to reform its welfare policies and multiculturalist practices directed at immigrant populations. (...) In 1995 she sent shock waves through polite Norwegian society by publishing a book-length study that concluded that the state's policies of cultural respect and financial generosity toward the country’s immigrant and refugee inhabitants were effectively betraying the latter, abetting ethnic ghettoization, creating welfare dependence, and destroying self-respect.(...)Unsympathetic readers might reasonably accuse Wikan of engaging in a racist polemic, of being an apologist for anti-immigrant or anti-Muslim politics. Overall, the book tends to portray immigrants as lazy, criminally inclined, mostly illiterate men who steal welfare benefits and violently repress their daughters' and sisters' life chances. To criticize the book in this way, however, would be, according to Wikan, to participate in a "conspiracy of silence" (p. 11 and passim) that victimizes young women and abets the creation of an ethnic underclass. Researchers’ fears of being accused of racism, Wikan recounts, have impeded the qualitative and quantitative studies necessary to evaluate and reform state policy.
We don't wear our shoes inside the house. And it isn't because we are trying to be pretentious -- the carpet, the floors, etc. all last a lot longer.
A thousand Swedes,
Run through the weeds,
Chased by one Norwegian!
women should pack heat, to protect themselves from Muslim (and other) thugs.
If I remember correctly, Sweden is also becoming for producing something else.....more babies named Mohammed than any other....
Well, I have a good friend in Sweden whom I talk to and online game with all the time. I remember he told me that the current Prime Minister's platfrom was to bring to every Swede broadband access to the internet. I generally have a favorable viewpoint on Sweden although some of their social leftist ideas their government has, i disagree with very much and Sweden taking in the Moslems, well, that is a problem that is brewing.
"What exactly does "modern" mean in the context of the article?
"Swedes view ourselves as being more in touch with the phenomena of globalization (and especially that of the international political, scientific and technological development of our times) than any other nation. "
Really?"
- I'm not saying it's a fact, I'm just saying many Swedes view things this way.
By "Modernity" we don't mean the same thing as, For instance, A deranged Sorbonne Professor denying the progress The Western Civilization have made since the Renaissance, While himself/herself living a life of luxury.
By Modernity "We", Meaning Conservative voters of Sweden/Scandinavia, Aim at a society where each and every citizen is encouraged to work hard, Take part in the progress of his/her country as well as that of Humanity.
A life of luxury is a very nice thing indeed. If you, Contrary to several employees of the Sorbonne and suchlike places, Also find something worth beliving in while in life, that's even better.
"Funny, I don't recall the Finns being particularly fond of the Swedes nor of the same language/cultural stock."
All of the other countries around the Baltic Sea/The Scandinavian Peninsula have had severe trouble with Sweden. Either they have been annected by Sweden for a long time (Finland/Norway/Estonia/Lithuania/Latvia)
throughout history or have met harsh military resistance from us in their expansionist planning (Russia, Poland, Germany).
Today, I'd like to say most of this antagonism have been forgotten.
Swedes don't celebrate different military triumphs like many other countries do. We feel there's no need to behave like that, While I personally feel a nation has the right of exploring its past and ask herself WHAT was done right and WHAT national qualities this or that victory depended on.
By the way, You're right, Finnish language is not related to the Swedish one. In fact it's not an indoeuropean language at all. It is, however realted to estonian and somewhat related to hungarian.
Having lived in Sweden for nearly 15 years, the really amazing thing is how self absorbed Swedish people can be. Kind of obvious in the article. Then again, living by yourself leads to talking to yourself a little too much and maybe a little too much introspection. A lot of very immature and irrational thought/discussion typifies Sweden, but I suppose that's expected as a result of the "shoeless" 60's brain wash.
Big yawn....
"Today, I'd like to say most of this antagonism have been forgotten." - yeah, take a ride on the red line out to skärholmen or norsborg and check out the new antagonism. Oh the times, oh the demographics....
"Having lived in Sweden for nearly 15 years, the really amazing thing is how self absorbed Swedish people can be. Kind of obvious in the article. Then again, living by yourself leads to talking to yourself a little too much and maybe a little too much introspection. A lot of very immature and irrational thought/discussion typifies Sweden, but I suppose that's expected as a result of the "shoeless" 60's brain wash.
Big yawn...."
In your company, talking to yourself seems like the only way to assure oneself of a sensible conversation.
I have a very similar history and am glad that I'm an American as well. I'm proud of my ancestry and enjoyed multiple visits to Sweden, but the US is home.
My Grandfather was a hardworking, coffee loving union worker as well, but he couldn't take the Swedes' obsession with butter and herring.
A friend of Norwegian descent gave me a sign that read:
"You can always tell a Swede, but you can't tell him much."
I still have it in my office at home.
"Japan is the most advanced country on this planet. If you want to see what the world will be like 10 years from now, visit Tokyo..."
The GDP/Capita of Sweden is higher than that one of Japan.
Therefore, My choice would, Naturally, be to stick to the cash flow here in Sweden and visit Japan for holiday instead of vice versa.
The japanese culture, people and nature are things very appealing to me, but the economical policies Japan followed for decade after decade since the Meiji Restoration undeniably had its flaws.
"The article sounds like a collection of Swedish cliches, as told by...a big boob."
I bow down to the only poster here bold and clearsighted enough to realize this aspect of reality which I struggled hard to veil.
My wife was born and raised in Sweden and has been in the US for 10 years. And I can tell you, she is conservative through and through; votes Republican. She loves it here and is a very good horsewoman, excellent cowgirl, and respected cattle rancher.
(and kinda cute too)
"My wife was born and raised in Sweden and has been in the US for 10 years. And I can tell you, she is conservative through and through; votes Republican. She loves it here and is a very good horsewoman, excellent cowgirl, and respected cattle rancher.
(and kinda cute too)"
I don't blame her - And I don't blame you for marrying a Swedish woman!
Furthermore, If I was American, I'd love to vote for The Republican Party too and let me tell you Conservatist ideas are on the rise over here (even if many Europeans still thoughtlessly swallow everything liberal/leftist European media feed them with).
Have you ever visited Sweden?
Anyhow, Greetings from a European admirer of the True spirit of America!
if you've never visited Tokyo, you should and within a day or two you will understand what i mean.
i have visited sweden and japan several times, as well as the rest of europe, america and south america extensively.
"..i disagree with very much and Sweden taking in the Moslems.."
Sweden is not the only country that takes in Muslims. I suggest that you visit any international airport in the U.S. and observe how many of them arrive here on a daily basis.
" by advanced, i mean that the Japanese are living right now the way people in other modern, large cities in the western world will live in 2016. "
Please elaborate ...
And Tokyo is NOT Japan , any more than NYC is America . Ever been to the Japanese countryside ? Advanced ? That'a a laugh . I ought to know , I live here in the Japanese boonies .
Yes, I have been to Sweden. She is from Smalland and it is a beautiful country. We hope to return someday to visit her brother and sister. And she lives up to her Smalland heritage!(the first Swedish words her brother taught me was "yelba smallander")
"it is a grave mistake IMHO to assume per-capita income is the measure of advancement. by advanced, i mean that the Japanese are living right now the way people in other modern, large cities in the western world will live in 2016.
if you've never visited Tokyo, you should and within a day or two you will understand what i mean.
i have visited sweden and japan several times, as well as the rest of europe, america and south america extensively."
I agree there are limits to what GDP/Capita figures actually tell you concerning the prosperity/standard of living/advancement of one given nation compared to any other one. For instance, Norway has an even higer GDP/Capita than Sweden, but does that mean Norwegian roads, hospitals, houses and general standards of living etc are superior to swedish ones? No - and this is because of two major reasons; Norway hasn't been a very rich country for a long time, like Sweden has. GDP figures just like GDP/Capita figures are accounted for ANNUALLY - It's as simple as that. Secondly, Norway has chosen to place a great deal of its national income in stocks, bonds and other "securities" for different reasons, so therefore they can't consume nice cars and other luxury items in the way many Swedes do and as as a consequence, They don't appear as rich as their eastern neighbors (although they're in fact richer by annual GDP/Capita).
Anyhow, I feel that with a Conservative government, Extremely well performing corporations and a very hungry attitude towards the blessings of globalization, Sweden faces an economic development the coming 10 years that the US and Japan can only dream of.
I'm not saying Sweden can compete with Japan or the US in matters of size, But I AM nontheless convinced the Baltic region is quickly developing into one of the most interesting regions in the field of economical development of our times presently (Just look at how Northern Germany presently is gearing up for steady growth). Sweden has an incredible amount of small, middle and large size companies that will prosper from this circumstances.
the remarkable thing about japan, it seems to me, is that it is actually two countries (at least). if you go up into the heavily forested mountains (forested no doubt because some of the mountains were too craggy to get lumber out easily), much of it is like going back into the 16th century with its perfectly preserved temples and cemetaries, while in tokyo the pace of life is insanely fast and the contrasts are wild.
down here in chile, you have "persian markets" with baskets full of fruits and vegetables - in akihabara, you have street vendor stalls that look similar, with the same sort of baskets, but full of colored LEDs or computer switches or ICs. Japanese manufacturers invariably test market new ideas and products in Japan first, so typically you find electronics for sale there that will not appear anywhere else for two or three years, if at all.
what amazed me in the salaryman hotels were the bathrooms, built from a *single* piece of extruded plastic (shower, sink, toilet, walls, mirror cabinet) by, for example, yamaha. all amazingly compact and well thought out.
the overcrowding and high tech atmosphere that permeates japan and particularly tokyo provides to me, at least, a real sense of future shock and over the years i've santiago, chile, for example, start to pick of much of the same modernistic feel -- which i had seen in tokyo years before.
"Interesting article. Thanks for posting. My grandparents sailed from Goteborg around the turn of the century, and I was able to visit Sweden back in the sixties. Lovely land, and gracious people, all of whom were happy (at the time)to speak English to an American youth."
Thank You for replying to my original post/commentary. I'm convinced Sweden of the 1960's was an extraordinary well performing society in terms of courtesy, friendliness and overall citizen qualities.
Just like the US.
Furthermore, I was born in August 1969, about one month after the United States of America was succesful in trying to place an astronaut on the surface of the Moon. My parents and other members of their generation still talk of having witnessed it on live television.
Well, As this thread is about "Modernity", I hope we can all agree to be modern enough to realize that if that was achievable by the technological standards of the 1960's, We Westerners of today will find the strength to restore our own culture, as well as inspiring humanity to forward the cause of scientific endeavour, exploration and true human cultural advancement.
Study Greek and Roman Antiquity.
Study The Glorious Renaissance.
Study the thoughts of the Founding Fathers of The United States of America.
Study Abraham Lincoln, Study Winston Churchill and while doing this, Keep an eye on the children living among you this very day
- and educate them thoroughly.
KINDA cute?
You better not say KINDA cute directly to her.
"My wife is.... list follows... (and kinda cute too)
KINDA cute?
You better not say KINDA cute directly to her."
God bless you, Dr Phil.
Don't forget to buy my new b0ok for Christmas: Dr. Phil's I'm OK, You Kinda Suck
Knowing my family was originally from Sweden, some Norwegian friends of mine used to say something like that to me, to which I'd reply, "...All chased by one crazy-ass American with a gun, so don't mess with me!"
Actually, I've always wondered where those lines came from. Someone once told me they had an American origin, but who knows if that's true.
Its the fish sandwich he has in his pocket.
"Yes, I have been to Sweden. She is from Smalland and it is a beautiful country. We hope to return someday to visit her brother and sister. And she lives up to her Smalland heritage!(the first Swedish words her brother taught me was "yelba smallander")"
Nice to hear you enjoyed Sweden.
Personally, I haven't seen enough of Smalland/Småland. Been there only three times or something. However, I think it's a Wonderful part of Scandinavia (by the way it's perfectly correct to call Småland Smalland as Små means small - BUT grammatically speaking, "Små" is in fact only proper swedish when used in the plural form of "liten", meaning small. "A small mouse" is "En liten mus" in Swedish while "Two small mice" is "Två små möss" in our language.)
I'm not from Smalland/Småland (I'm from Gothenburg), But I can't deny that Småland ought to be admired by everyone, even by us residing on the West Coast of Sweden.
Two examples of amazing persons from Smalland/Småland;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrid_Lindgren
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingvar_Kamprad
Greetings from Gothenburg!
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