Posted on 07/19/2006 7:49:50 PM PDT by MindBender26
There is a strong but previously undisclosed undercurrent running through the Coast Guard’s investigation of yesterday’s cruise ship accident that left 92 passengers seriously injured, two of them critically. The questions are being whispered, but there is no denying them; “Was this a terrorist attempt to sink the ship?”
This much is known. The 3000 passenger 22-knot floating hotel "Crown Princess" was 11 miles south of Port Canaveral, heading out on a Western Caribbean cruise when suddenly, everything turned topsy-turvy. According to passengers, the ship listed somewhere between 20 and 40 degrees as the vessel made a violent and unnecessary turn to the left.
I’ll leave the passengers descriptions of down becoming up, merchandise sliding earthquake-like off shelves and people flying everywhere with a force that was so strong the water cascaded out of the ship’s four swimming pools to other accounts.
Here is the understory.
So far there is absolutely no explanation of why the ship executed the vicious turn to port and everything not tied down slipped to starboard. It had been to sea before, recently docking in Florida on a trip down from New York. The weather was fine, the sea calm and clear and no other vessels in the area. They can find no mechanical problem…. and ships weighting 226,000,000 pounds don’t just turn like that by accident.
The current question then is; was it attempted sabotage?
Two factors are on everyone in the federal law enforcement and news media fields minds tonight. These ultra modern cruise ships (the ship was launched in 2003) are nothing more than top heavy, barely seaworthy floating Miami Beach-like art deco hotels. Many experienced seamen think they are an accident waiting to happen with their huge sail-like sides ready to catch a freak wind or wave and little natural stability. More than one marine architect thinks it’s just a matter of time until one capsizes.
Add to that the composition of the crews. Cruise lines “rent” their ship’s crews. The dining room staff, from waiters and busboys to the overly gracious matre-d are supplied from one agency, the cabin stewards from another, while another company supplies the deck department, (the traditional “sailors.”)
On one ship I was on last year, the only direct employees of the cruise line were the Master, the Chief Engineer, the Purser (who is really a nautical hotel manager) and the Social Director with the bad toupee. Everyone else, from head pastry chef to hull painter to helmsman were all “rented” from a Ships Chandler (supplier) service.
Remember that word; “helmsman.” He’s the one who steers the ship. Too fast a turn and perhaps a huge ship turns over and becomes huge permanent underwater monument to wretched excess.
Many of these rented crews, especially the “sailors” are from Indonesia. Indonesia has a huge and increasingly violent and fundamentalist Moslem population.
The questions being asked tonight, as I said, quietly, here in Florida are, was there a radical Moslem at the wheel and did he try to capsize the Crown Princess and thereby take 3000 infidels to the bottom with her?
Think about the Moslem mind. 3000 scantily clad, alcohol drinking, pork eating Christians and Jews drowned in a flash. What a great way to guarantee a madly hyper-focused helmsman his 76 virgins! No need to get a shoe bomb on a Trans-Atlantic airplane. Just take a hard left and they’re all dead, in time and in range of the cameras for the evening news.
(We all hope) It will probably turn out to not be the case, but in the Islam’s war on America, stranger tales have turned out to be true.
bump
Michael Rivero, is that you?
BTTT
Hmmmmm....I'm no Capt. Jack Sparrow but I can't imagine that a cruise ship would even be able to turn fast enough to list without some sort of outside help.
Well.
This certainly opens up a multitude of possibilities.
Hmmmmmm. Interesting. Unlikely. But needs to be investigated.
Keep me posted.
ping
No offense to you personally, but of all the options available to a terrorist crew-member bent on destruction, a sharp turn is pretty low on the list.
George Noory should be on the case...
I'd like to know when a big ship got so responsive to steering that you could turn so fast you'd tip it over. I've done that in a 16 foot Sunfish sailing boat, but it's hard to believe you could do it with a ship that size.
Good grief. This is totally irresponsible.
If this ship had gone down, it would probably be blamed on the center fuel tank.
These top heavy ships would turtle around 25 degrees (if not less) but 20 to 40 degrees was just a passenger estimate.
Doubt that sabotage was involved.
>Michael Rivero, is that you?
Sir, I have been called mad, vain, self-centered, a bad writer, a lousy lover, a worse drunk,and much worse. All that I can take.
But linking me with Mad Michael? You go too far, Sir!!!!
:~)
I hope so.
Gets me out of taking my wife on that damn cruise she
keeps harping about.....copy, paste, e-mail to her inbox!
Our assigned cabin steward was named Mohammed. He was from Indonesia.
[quote]monument to wretched excess.[/quote]
Oh, brother.
>No offense to you personally, but of all the options available to a terrorist crew-member bent on destruction, a sharp turn is pretty low on the list.
All people and items coming aboard ship are screened, just like airliners.
Terrorists love low-tech.
It happened a few years ago, I think it was the NCL Dawn. They had a bow and stern thruster problem that caused the ship to tip 20 or 30 degrees to one side, then it snapped back. A bunch of folks were injured.
Well one thing's for sure, America's terrorist that are constantly planning strikes haven't taken a vacation while all eyes are on Israel.
Could Alzahiri(sp)/bin laden have a hand in Hizballuh Israel conflict?
Our waiter was from Indonesia. He was a real nice guy.
Na...Michael working with the, pro Islam, "Blame it on Bush and the NeoCon Jews", Left theses days
"....of all the options available to a terrorist crew-member bent on destruction, a sharp turn is pretty low on the list."
At first consideration, your assessment seems apt......until one considers that no equipment or even serious planning whatsoever is required to steer full to port while underway at speed. Only a helmsman with intent. Very economical and even secret operation.
I'd be curious what kind of steering system it has. Cables? Hydraulics? Electronic controls? Could be some kind of glitch or break in the system.
Sources?
This article contradicts itself.
If it's true that "More than one marine architect thinks it’s just a matter of time until one capsizes."
They why does one need to attribute what happened to sabotage?
Depends. Did Ken Lay do this?
Ping.
I'd like to see a graphic representation of what the passengers felt was the extent of the "lean" on the ship since I can't seem to picture what they're saying in my mind. My inclination is to believe a phantom wave crashed into the ship to cause the damage that apparently happened. How can a ship that enormous have reacted to any steering, navigational, or engine inputs that quickly?
~ Blue Jays ~
They work against waves, but obviously weren't enough in this case... or maybe they were... and prevented a disaster.
No, this was just Carnival Cruise Lines operating like they normally do. Princess used to be a pretty good company. Now that they're owned by Carnival, they've become just another Greyhound bus on the sea.
Yes, but they will be boys.
>This article contradicts itself.
>If it's true that "More than one marine architect thinks it’s just a matter of time until one capsizes."
>They why does one need to attribute what happened to sabotage?
Because it was a clear day, little wind and no commanded turn in any direction.
Big ships like this one can't make radical abrupt turns. It takes much effort to even begin to turn a ship like this. It's not a formula car for cryin out loud. This explanation is BS.
> I'd be curious what kind of steering system it has.
> Cables? Hydraulics? Electronic controls?
Steering (and listing) is not just a matter of rudder,
or even differential thrust, on modern ships. They also
often have stabilizer vanes (for heavy seas) and/or
bow/stern thrusters (for tug-less docking). In concert,
all of these systems could impart some interesting
dynamics.
Given the number of fires, groundings, illnesses and
other mishaps attributable to incompetence on these
boats, I'm inclined to think malfunction/incompetence
until contrary evidence arises.
What, he gets 4 more virgins if he kills Christians and Jews? ;o)
Where is Michael Rivero anyway?
>Big ships like this one can't make radical abrupt turns.
But this one did, didn't it? (see MSM reports, please)
>Where is Michael Rivero anyway?
He lived on the Big Island, part of the Free Hawaii Movement.
What?
...The 3000 passenger 22-knot floating hotel "Crown Princess" was 11 miles south of Port Canaveral, heading out on a Western Caribbean cruise ...
It had completed the Western Caribbean cruise and was heading to Brooklyn.
...the ship was launched in 2003...
It was launched in 2006.
The steering system is hydraulic electric. Huge hydraulic rams position the rudder. The controls are electric, unless things have changed since I retired as a Coast Guard Marine Inspector, there should be servos controlling the whole system from the bridge to the steering compartment.
These ships have thew equivalent of airplane "black boxes"...every movement, every control input to the engines and systems is recorded, as well as who did what...this will be easy to backtrack and confirm/deny..
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