Ready, set, mutate... and may the best microbe win

Rice University ^ | 18 May 2006 | Staff (press release)

[Almagest]

<< Just the man I've been looking for! How would you render the slogan of Darwin Central (the conspiracy that cares) into Latin? The best w've come up with are the following: >>


I like two of them. The connotations of the others are a little too far off:


<< 2. Coniuratio quae sollicita est. "The conspiracy which is concerned." >>


Well -- that word "sollicita" most often carries connotations of anxiety and worry -- but this one rates high.


<< 4. Coniuratio Compatiens "The caring conspiracy." >>


Probably the best one. It's also concise. Take it from the magistro antiquo -- this is the one you want.

[I got the rope]

You know I've been researching for the last hour or so...and by just looking at the amount of variation on the planet of various species...we have always been in the Age of Bacteria.

Their numbers are incredible and they live on just about every surface on earth...including inside of us. Amazing.

I wonder if a similar long term experiment on the common cockroach over the course of a 100 years would show significant change? I wonder what the effect of increasing gravity on cockroaches would give us in a 100 years?

[Conservative Texan Mom]

Does ToE suggest that all life evolved from the same type of single celled organism, or does it only take it back to a variety, or even just several single cell organisms?

I have been under the impression that it is one single cell organism, which leads me to a question. This organism would reproduce asexually. As it populates, and the environment changes, it would mutate for survival. If it's mutating to maintain survival according to the environment, then would all of the mutations be the same until it is populated to a degree that it begins to compete with it's self and the environment for survival? Is that when divergence would begin according to evolution?

[PatrickHenry]

Probably the best one [Coniuratio Compatiens]. It's also concise. Take it from the magistro antiquo -- this is the one you want.

That's pretty much what's been decided. It wasn't one that I came up with, but if you like it, I'll stop my grumbling about how I suffered with those relative pronouns and the passive voice. Thanks. Much appreciated.

[Almagest]

<< Before Newton the Cartesian mechanistic model of gravity prevailed. >>


Among scientists.


<< The main criticism of Newton came from rationalists like Leibniz who made the entirely reasonable criticism that his model of gravity contituted "action at a distance." >>


The main SCIENTIFIC criticism -- right.


<< Leibniz's point was that Newton's model was in effect positing a miracle-- hardly an argument that it had "made science atheistic." >>


That's true. But I was not referring to criticism from other scientists -- but criticism from religious folks who did not like the "implications" that the movements of the planets could be explained without recourse to the supernatural.

I spent a large part of my life reading religious arguments along with the scientific ones. Can't get all that time back now, but I did pick up a few real gems -- such as Luther and Calvin's criticism of Copernicus, for example. Reading sermons leads to all kinds of unintended discoveries!

[Almagest]

<< No problem, I can take the teasing. But what makes you think it wasn't a tyypo? >>


I thought of that -- but it would not be as funny that way!
With my typo-leanings, I'll give you and everyone else plenty of fodder. It'll stune you fer sure!

[PatrickHenry]

You know I've been researching for the last hour or so...and by just looking at the amount of variation on the planet of various species...we have always been in the Age of Bacteria.

This is definitely a microbe's world. I've read that they are, by far, the great majority of the planet's biomass. Very successful in terms of survival and reproduction. Of course they miss out on a lot, but they don't know about it, or care. We do know, and we care, but we probably miss out on a lot too.

[grey_whiskers]

I wasn't thinking of the *rate* per se, but of the "coverage" necessary. If you are mainly selecting for one thing, with few other factors coming in to eliminate cells which possess the beneficial mutation, then you won't have to get as lucky so often. If you have other major causes of morbidity/mortality, then some of the cells which otherwise might've given rise to the highly adapted progeny, will die off from other causes before their advantageous genes get passed on.

I assume this would affect the perceived selection pressure, changing the rate at which the particular mutations in question 'take over' the population: and therefore changing the number of times a mutation has to occur at the favored site before things take off...

Cheers!

[Right Wing Professor]

Is there only one solution set for this temperature increase?

Try again in plain English.

[grey_whiskers]

Given the number of times the threads get moved to the Smoky Backroom, or get hijacked, how about:

8. Coniuratio interruptus

Cheers!

[Right Wing Professor]

I wasn't thinking of the *rate* per se, but of the "coverage" necessary.

For each point mutation, there were about 25 instances per generation. The key is, that if the population is large enough to be mutationally saturated, the element of chance is eliminated.

Think stat. mech.. The population was large enough to be thermodynamic (barely). Once you get above the level of fluctuations, the result is inevitable.

[AndrewC]

Shamoo said it's significant that the mutations didn't arise where expected within the gene. Four of the six occurred in regions of the gene that are identical in both heat-resistant and non-heat-resistant forms of G. stearothermophilus . Shamoo said this strongly shows the dynamic nature of evolution at the molecular and atomic level.

The killer whale has discovered something Dr. James Shapiro knew many years ago.

A 21^ST CENTURY VIEW OF EVOLUTION

In addition to temporal specificity, it turns out that many natural genetic engineering functions show intriguing degrees of selectivity in where they act within the genome. This selectivity appears to be chiefly related to interactions between natural genetic engineering systems and the cellular systems controlling transcription and chromatin formatting. The examples we have of target selection include the action of localized point mutagenesis, retrotransposons and DNA transposons (see 9, 10 for specific references):

...

These few cases of targeting for natural genetic engineering may well be the tip of the iceberg. It is likely that many more instances will be discovered when the target specificity of MGEs and mutators are investigated systematically. The indication that target selection for natural genetic engineering can interact with the transcriptional control apparatus and chromatin formatting provides a realistic basis for thinking about molecular mechanisms that can target mobile regulatory modules (e.g. LTRs or transposons) to a series of functionally related genetic loci. This kind of molecular targeting would greatly enhance the potential for creating novel adaptive multilocus genome systems in response to an evolutionary crisis. [emphasis mine]

[Doctor Stochastic]

Is that when divergence would begin according to evolution?

Divergence begins when the system undergoes inexact replication. (Of course, at finite temprature, almost any system undergoing replication will replicate inexactly; it's a consequence of the Second and Third laws of thermodynamics.)

[mjolnir]

But I was not referring to criticism from other scientists -- but criticism from religious folks who did not like the "implications" that the movements of the planets could be explained without recourse to the supernatural.

Those lectures of Calvin and Luther you refer to sound interesting; I do remember reading Calvin on Copernicus. But the problem I had with your statement is that you seemed to be dividing up scientists and believers, whereas the cosmology of Leibniz, is, if anything, more God obsessed than that of Calvin or Luther but certainly just as much so. The theological assumption that God made the universe to make sense on every level may have made Leibniz an easy target for caricature by Voltaire, and it did lead him on the wrong path regarding Newton's theory, but on the whole that assumption we're talking about one of the most brilliant and productive men who ever lived in too many fields to count.

[Virginia-American]

Coniuratio interruptus

"Coniuratio" is feminine, so it would be "interrupta"

But the thought's good

[jwalsh07]

Ok, here goes. If the experiment is done 10^10 times, will any other combination of point mutations cross the finish line?

[Dimensio]

Almost like it was planned...

Well, in this particular case, it was. In other situations, it's a result of variable environmental conditions rather than actual planning.

[grey_whiskers]

"Coniuratio" is feminine, so it would be "interrupta"

Sorry, I was going for the pun on a well-known phrase also involving interruptus.

If I had used the correct form the pun would have been lost.

Cheers!

[Conservative Texan Mom]

Would this be a catalyst to produce this divergence?

[Doctor Stochastic]

Would this be a catalyst to produce this divergence?

What's "this"? I'm not sure I understand the questions.