Russian trawler captain ups stakes in scandal with Norway [Elektron may ram Norwegian Coast Guard]

RIA Novosti ^ | October 18, 2005

[zagor-te-nej]

You should really try to read my post. In 1920 Spicbergen archipelago was “given” to Norway, before that it was Russian property. Same happened to Crimea and host of other regions that communist stole from Russia. Or in communist Yugoslavia where Croat dictator Tito took Serbian lands in Bosnia, Kosovo and Vojvodina and gave it to the non-Serbs. Serbs (and Russians) were too Orthodox, monarchist and anti-communist so they had to be punished.

“Rules are Rules” indeed, unless Orthodox nations are concerned, when those rules can be bended, changed or broken.
According to my information that “treaty” is very clear - Russians have fishing rights in that area, so fishing was not illegal. Illegal was Norwegian attempt to forcefully stop and board that boat.

“The (Norwegian) coastguard had tried to snag the trawler's propeller with a rope to force it to stop.”
You wouldn’t like if someone tries to do this to American boat, right?

[tomjohn77]

Well I am a Norwegian citizen.

[reagan_fanatic]

LOL - and maybe a couple of 55 gallon drums of this stuff to boot.

[tomjohn77]

If everybody should claim rights because their boarders were like this before the world would be chaotic. To even defend this Russian trawler it makes me wonder about your moral and ethic. They took to inspectors with them thats illegal. Why should he steam a head if he had rights to do what he was doing. Norwegians are fear and behave good in this situations.

[zagor-te-nej]

What I defend is law and legality, and you’ve admitted that Spicbergen archipelago was Russian property. You said yourself “because their boarders were like this before”, right? As I said before, in 1920 Spicbergen archipelago was stolen from Russian and “given” to Norway as a “present”. Letter of that treaty is very clear – Russians have fishing rights in that area. There is even Russian village on the largest island.

You do not dispute all that, you are wondering about my moral and ethics. What is your ethic? You got stolen land and you intend to keep it?
My moral is very simple – property stolen from rightful owners should be returned to those owners. I am little surprised you did not start spitting paroles about “human rights” and “democracy”. I found those paroles empty words – what are important are actions and they are speaking for themselves. 130 plus Orthodox churches and monasteries destroyed in Kosovo and Methohija after NA-TO occupation. I find that unacceptable but I do not blame “you” as much I blame those who are leading Orthodox countries. Their obligation is to defend interests of their people.

[tomjohn77]

How many areas have been stolen during history. So you probably tell all the Americans on this forum that Texas, California should be Mexican. Russia was just a small state thousand years ago, but they have stolen a lot of land. So where do you draw the line in history for the real boarders for countries?

[tomjohn77]

You just fall right into my picture of people from Serbia. People with no moral and ethics that have no real sense of whats right and wrong. Acctually just recently on of my friends was almost forced to give up his money to this stupid Serb. Other than that your people are known for bad ethics and crime and mafia in my country. Why do you behave so much different than Croats and Slovenians. They are great people.

[zagor-te-nej]

Of course Croats and Slovenians are great people – Norway stole nothing from them. If I support Russia or Serbia on these particular issues that is not enough to conclude that I am Russian or Serbian. I support them because they are right and you are wrong.

Russia was a “small” state but they acquired legally Spicbergen archipelago. Before 1920, those islands were never under Norway rule and Russians have fishing rights in that area. This is main issue; rest is your attempt to cover truth with horse cart of manure. And, I do not need your lections on moral and ethics. They are as good as your picture of Serbia. Next time, before you hit enter go to some good search engine and find out what is number of Albanians and Serbs involved in criminal activities in Norway. It may help your understanding.

[tomjohn77]

Okay whats your set boarders for the world. Whats the date for the real border lines, 1200, 1500, 1750, 1900, 2000?

[tomjohn77]

There are signs that Vikings came to Svalbard around 1194. Later it was discovered for a fact by Willem Barents from Holland in 1596. The Dutch, French, Norwegians etc not mentioning the Russians before much later had small communities on Svalbard. But of course after your opinion non of this matters because when the Russians set foot on land its theirs. Better be careful because when there is a few Russian somewhere its their land. A great taught.. sarcasm. In 1925 Svalbard become a part of Norway. In 1935 the Soviet Union sign the treaty of Svalbard that gave Norway the claim of the land.

[zagor-te-nej]

There are signs that there could be life on Mars, so you should do much better. For example, how can you tell those supposed Vikings were of Norwegian descent? What special rights that gives you? Did you not hear of Slavic Vikings?

"To the south-east of Denmark lay the Wends (Vends) or the Slav tribes, who were in many ways just as effective raiders and traders as the Vikings themselves". "The Slavs were always under threat of attack from the Vikings as well as the Franks." "They also gave as good as they got , in military terms, sacking Hedeby in 1000 and harrying Denmark, Gotland , Oland and southern Sweden to such an extent that the Western Baltic was sometimes called Mare Rugianorum after the Slavic pirates of Rugen.

These are Slavs close to my heart – giving, at least whet they are taking. What Soviets stole from Russian people and gave to you is what we are talking about. According by the Svalbard Treaty of February 9, 1920, islands were not made a part of Norway and citizens of various other countries (Russia) have rights to exploit mineral deposits and other natural resources "on a footing of absolute equality". You do not have right to cliam sole ownership of arpichelago. What you are trying to do is to forcefully impose your imaginary rights on Spicbergen and when you try to board Russian fishing ship you have to be stopped – one way or another.

[tomjohn77]

No mentioning of Vikings here. It would probably had said Wends not Viking. Furthermore this telling of Vikings are not enough to claim the land itself. Your logic is so strange its way beyond me. Russians came to Svalbard way later than other people. To you there are different rules for Russians and other people. When a Russian sets foot one place its his land even if others have been there for centuries. Its not strange that they control so much land. Why are you so caught up in this its not your home country. Russia controls a lot of land and sea compare to us. Its not like we are greedy.
This trawler will probably not come into this territory one more time. This is a warning to all other trawlers that are breaking the rules.

[tomjohn77]

One other thing a ship that looks so shitty should be scrapped. Looks like it is due to be trashed