Posted on 10/15/2005 5:22:43 PM PDT by Gator61
NASHVILLE, Tennessee (AP) -- A leading Jewish organization is condemning the Southern Baptist Convention for using a group of "messianic" Jews -- those who have converted to Christianity -- in its evangelism.
Anti-Defamation League director Abraham Foxman said the effort is offensive because the Southern Baptists are using Jews who have converted to Christianity "to go after other Jews."
"If people convert, that's their individual business," Foxman said. "But don't use them as a tool to convert other people."
At the heart of the ADL's complaint is a decision by the Southern Baptist Convention executive committee to ask its missionary boards to study the idea of recognizing the Southern Baptist Messianic Fellowship as "an evangelistic mission to Jewish people."
(Excerpt) Read more at adl.org ...
So tell me, what is the ADL’s beef in a country where we have freedom of religion?
Someone should tell them that they do not have to convert or even listen, although it would be nice if they were polite to people who just want to share heaven with them.
What a beautiful sentiment. I sure would like you to share heaven with us! ;-)
I suppose to the ADL, tolerance means no one can try to persuade anyone else to join them -- even if it means lacking tolerance for Christians, who are called to proslytize!
The real irony in this is in the fact that Jews are the ones who first converted Jews and non-Jews to Christianity. There would be no Christians trying to convert Jews had there been no Jews trying to convert the world to Christianity. So it's all really ridiculous that they complain when you really think about it.
I mean "proselytize"...
Well, I agree the ADL is being ridiculous, but not for that reason. After all, the Jews around today are precisely those who REFUSED to accept Christ. So it's not as if all Jews are a block, and the pronoun "they" covers both current Jews and ancient messianic Jews.
The Southern Baptists are too effective. That's the problem, as far as the ADL sees it. It puts them out of a job.
Obviously. But it still stands as an ironic truth. Jews are responsible for bringing Christianity to the world (well, I would argue of course that God is responsible, but from the human perspective, Jews are responible).
Is there any particular reason you
DON'T want to go Heaven?
John 1:4
In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.
In him was life. Jesus Christ, the Word, was the source of life in all things created, and of the kinds and degrees of life which they manifest. The life of Christ among men has clarified and enriched all ideas of life. Many things are commonly though erroneously said to be dead; and those who speak of 'dead' matter often mistake absence of visible motion for absence of life.
The life was the light of men. The life of the Word is not only the source of all forms of physical life, but is also the light of men. 'Light' here stands for the truth, and more especially spiritual truth, revealing and directing the conscience of a person, the highest of the various degrees of life thus far attained in the world. Its significance in this connection comes largely from its contrast to those kinds of life in which there is little or no light at all. A seed, a blade of grass, a rose, and oak-all have life but not light, which is given only with intelligence. The animal world, in part, has but little of this light; and its true life can increase only with increasing power of thought. The 'light of men' is the greater measure of ruling intelligence and spiritual life given by the Word to those of his creatures who are most like unto him. It may also be considered in a special sense the historical manifestation of Christ's example.
John 1:5
And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
The darkness apprehended it not. The moral darkness of those who rejected or did not receive the spiritual light given them.
SOLI DEO GLORIA!
Very well stated, and thoughtful as well!
Nietsche referred to Christ as "the ultimate jewish consequence."
The ADL needs to better focus its activities...at this time its leftists who are the biggest anti semites in this country....ADL should hone in on them.
BTW, your words are very kind, and I really appreciate them.
So,Rabbi Foxman,remember that freedom is the operative word,and the exercise of that freedom means that some Christians in the US will convert to Judaism and some Jews will convert to Christianity.
Sorry Charlie, but Christ and his followers are responsible for bringing Christianity to the world.
And of course, Jesus was.... A Jew!
susie
(Denny Crane: "I like nature. Don't talk to me about the environment".)
The ADL is their own worst enemy, inventing anti-Semitism where there isn't any. Israel has no better allies than the Southern Baptist.
And Christ and his followers were Jewish. You didn't know that?
To listen to the ACLU, trying to convert someone and bring them to the light is absolutely the most evil thing that one can do.
No one is required to listen to anyone who is trying to proslytize. Just say politely you are not interested and walk away! Why is ADL trying to deny freedom of speech and religion who feel it is a religious duty to proslytize? So long as there is no coercion, proslytizing is free speech!
Sorry, I was told that Jesus was the son of God. I am so stupid. A jew you say?
If people are lying then I'm against it too. But if it's just that people aren't liking another person's faith then I say tough! Turn the tables. Try and covert them. Whatever. Defend you own faith for gosh sakes. But don't take away the right of someone to share their faith with others. That's unAmerican.
Yes they may have been semetic racially , all being from the arabian lands, but my understanding of Judaism is that of a denial of Christ. How am I wrong, here.
Almost everyone has a beef with the Southern Baptists.
Its just everyone being envious because they just cant bring themselves to admit thet they know that we are doing it right.
Nah, Nah, Nah, Nah, Nah, Nah!
Yes they may have been semetic racially , all being from the arabian lands, but my understanding of Judaism is that of a denial of Christ. How am I wrong, here.
I believe Christian Jews see themselves as true Jews who recognize the promised Jewish Messiah. They are not believers in contemporary Judaism, but they do still believe themselves to be Jewish Christians. You have to understand the theology of both religions to understand why they would see it that way. Theologically it makes perfect sense. But forget the theology, if they see themselves as Jewish Muslims then they have that right too. This is America. Let them try to convert whomever they wish. Alternative to the ADL: DEFEND YOUR FAITH. Oh, but I'm guessing the objectors mostly have no faith.
I don't have much sympathy for someone who's so weak-minded that a Christian pretending to be a Jew can successfully convert him to Christianity but a Christian admitting to be a Christian can't. People are ultimately responsible for their own beliefs. This complaint by the ADL is absurd.
As someone of Jewish heritage, I've had the usual quota of proselytizers come to my door over the years and try to peddle their brand of Christianity or Mormonism or Jehovah's Witnesses or whatever. I have no problem with them seeking converts; that's their burden, not mine. I just politely say I'm not interested. We live in a religiously tolerant society with free speech, so what's the big deal?
I beg to differ. A jew who accepts Yeshua of Nazerath as the Messiach is an apostate jew.
It's not that they "oppose" Messianism as such, but they object to Christians of Jewish heritage being used as a tool of conversion. Jews have every right to be concerned about aggressive conversion tactics, and they're only exercising their own freedom of speech to condemn a practice they find reprehensible.
Not that I don't want to, I just don't thing there is one.
Utterly asinine. I "devoutly" hope the Southern Baptists don't cave in to this PC crap, and furthermore, that they denounce it for what it is. The ADL's arrogance is breathtaking, though in no way surprising. No religion, and no self-appointed spokesman for a religion, gets to tell another religion how to go about its business.
ADL should focus on the Jews' real enemies, the Islamo-fascists ... though admittedly that may be less acceptable to some of our "friends" on the left.
Are you a sinner? If you are then YOU are responsible for His death.
You act as though He is still dead or something.
But what if you are wrong?
:(
Aww...don't feel like the Lone Ranger there. We're out to convert everyone. It was commanded of us to do so. Why not just defend your faith with kindness and graciousness. Why so angry?
There are plenty of former Christians who have become Orthodox Jews, we just don't wave them around like trophies.
"Jews were responsible for Christ's death."
You've missed the forest for the trees, my man.
How was the weather in Toledo today?
Please be careful. Only specific Jewish individuals at the time of Christ did this. There is no racial "blood guilt" -- and look at how pernicious this notion has been through history. I don't think you want to go there.
LOL!
You live in a world full of other people, sir or madam.
Get used to it.
Not being a Christian myself I hesitate to speak for them, however I do believe that many of them do try to convert Hindus and Muslims. I know for a fact that they try to convert atheists.
Have a nice day.
Christian missionaries have gone to the four corners of the world. They are not focused on Jews alone. Evangelization is a tenet of the Christian religion, an injunction in our holy book, just as Jews have injunctions set forth in the Torah. If you don't want to listen, just say you're not interested and WALK AWAY! Don't try to deny freedom of speech and religion to others just because you don't want to hear it.
Sometime these totalitarian types just don't get it do they?
And his followers weren't Jewish?
I'll try to be a good person anyway and I'll hope that God will forgive me.
And maybe you'll put in a good word for me.
It's called "Freedom of Speech."
Of course, the socialists at the ADL are typical of all lefty ideologues in that they believe free speech is only for them.
Foxman needs someone to change his diapers.
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