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lol.. chickens coming home to roost roost roost, maybe?
just like old times, indeed, and surprise, much the same faces are in office while Rome begins to combust.
Posted on 09/16/2005 9:59:01 PM PDT by NormsRevenge
SACRAMENTO – Four years after electricity prices soared and blackouts rolled across California, the state is in danger of another energy crisis – this one involving gasoline and natural gas as well, said a draft report Friday. The state is a captive of its own geographic and regulatory isolation, separated by miles and mountains from many refineries and fossil fuel sources. Moreover, the state sets stricter fuel standards to trim air pollution, driving up prices and limiting availability as is evident in the wake of Hurricane Katrina, said the California Energy Commission.
"California's way of life is threatened by its growing dependence on oil and natural gas, spiraling energy prices, potential supply shortages and an inadequate and aging energy delivery infrastructure," said the report that, in its final version, will go to Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger and state legislators.
The draft was released as a three-day international global warming conference hosted by the commission and the California Environmental Protection Agency concluded. Commissioners are to vote on adopting the report Nov. 16.
An EPA panel separately released draft proposals for how the state can meet Schwarzenegger's goal of cutting the state's emissions of greenhouse gases to 2000 levels by 2010, 1990 levels by 2020, and 80 percent below 1990 levels by 2050. A final version will go to Schwarzenegger in January.
The problems are interlinked: Warming temperatures could harm the Sierra Nevada snow pack that provides hydroelectricity, while hotter summers will drive up electricity demand.
"As the state's demand for electricity intensifies, California could face severe shortages in the next few years," partly as a result of the warming trend, the energy report warned.
Both panels recommended conservation, improved technology and regulatory changes among responses.
But the energy commission report warns that "the state has made only minimal progress" since it made similar recommendations two years ago, and calls for policy-makers to "take immediate action." Few new power plants are operating despite an intensive drive after the last electricity crisis, with 7,000 megawatts worth of approved plants on hold due to regulatory and market problems.
California's demand for transportation fuels has increased nearly 50 percent in 20 years. It is second only to Texas in consumption of natural gas, 87 percent of which is imported from other states or nations and much of which goes to produce electricity.
Electricity transmission problems last year cost the state's economy more than $1 billion, the energy report estimated, and this summer led to Southern California's first rolling blackouts since the 2000-2001 crisis.
If all Californians would modify their Hummers to run on alternative energy sources, just like the Governator, there would be no crisis. Perhaps horse manure as a source of fuel. /sarc
Savage had an interesting idea:
Invoice Mexico for one barrel of crude/illegal in the USA every year. I'd up the ante to once a month.
Failing that ( my idea ):
1. Establish a government-recognized program by which Greenies voluntarily stop driving, stop using refrigeration, stop using electricity, produce their own food ( w/o ANY commercial energy input) and start using only rainwater or (yuck) reclaimed "graywater".
They can wear little gold stars to let everyone know just how SPECIAL they are.
Hello, Ariana? Ariana? Buehler???
2. Build the F'ing nuclear power plants.
3. Harvest the oil shale, tar sands, and coal fields.
Stupid thought, but California's laws bring that out in me.
I took too long to post. Your ideas are better than mine.
Thanks. Coffee is good food.
They were just doing what they'd been paid to do, by natural gas investors.
What a load of crap. The CEC consumers millions annually to generate idiotic reports that re-state the obvious. We should drop the CEC immediately and fire all the free-loaders wasting taxpayer money.
Your reasoning is beyond understandable, so will excuse it to ignorance. (not stupidity)
I am retired oil field trash (smile when you say that) who has just a bit (decades) of knowledge on the subject, from exploration, drilling, production, (onshore/offshore) to refining.
Nonsense. Read the whole post.
I am retired oil field trash (smile when you say that) who has just a bit (decades) of knowledge on the subject, from exploration, drilling, production, (onshore/offshore) to refining.
Little do you know about who funds the environmental move-mint.
3. Harvest the oil shale, tar sands, and coal fields."
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You missed the point.
"The draft was released as a three-day international global warming conference hosted by the commission and the California Environmental Protection Agency concluded. Commissioners are to vote on adopting the report Nov. 16." (emphasis added)
The report has nothing to do with predicting or satisfying California's future energy needs. It's about perpetuating the myth of "global warming". Building nuclear power plants or developing the abundant and available alternate fossil fuel sources, would only accelerate the effects of global warming, in the world of their twisted little minds.
Beyond their focus on the mythical global warming, the report builds upon the false premise that California's high fuel prices has anything to do with the source of California's fossil fuels. Transportation is not the primary reason for high-energy costs, it's government-induced scarcity. By not allowing development of indigenous source of fuels within the USA, including off-shore, Alaska, and nuclear power, the US government has ceded the market to off-shore providers, who of course have no qualms over acting the role of a monopoly to increase the price of their product.
"Global Warming", of course, is intended to target hurt the Western 1st world countries, in behalf of the oppressed third world. If the CA EPA and the Liberal so-called Scientific community was serious about global warming, they wouldn't exempt the developing countries (such as China, Russia, and the former Russian republics) from the proposed Kyota restrictions. If, in fact, greenhouse gases produced by man's use of fossil fuels are destroying the planet, then EVERY country needs to "conserve", and EVERY class needs to conserve. The Environmenta movement is merely reconstituted Marxists peddling "economic class warfare" and anti-"Western imperialism" using a "green" wrapper.
The "scientists" pushing Global Warming are, as their Marxist predecessors, totally non-serious, unworthy of consideration. And, they wrote this report. If the CA Governor does anything but toss it in the trash, he's also non-serious.
The entire report was an exercise of religious (albeit secular humanism) faith, not science. If California makes energy policy based on this myth, then market forces will punish California business, as both high-priced and scarce energy forces markets away from California-produced goods and services. The market-force guided economic cycle, unlike global warming, has been proven through repetition. It's a repeatable phenomenon, where as the truth about "global warming" cannot truly be known for hundreds if not thousands of years.
SFS
We are all entitled to our opinions, but not the facts.
calpowercrisis:
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Calif hasn't built a new energy plant in decades.
Busnissmen in Texas figured that Calif would need additional evergy and so built extra plants in business friendly Texas and sold futures in energy to Calif at inflated prices.
Then Calif lawmakers lamblasted these businessmen but still no new energy plants in the antibusiness mood that is Calif.
The hell with them. If Calif needs more energy, let them pay Texans exorbitant prices.
If the Mohave Generating Station is forced offline at the end of the year as is scheduled, Southern California will lose enough electricity for a million homes. To stay online they have to settle water disputes with the Indians and install a billion dollars worth of air pollution control equipment in the next three months. I'm going to California and sell candles.
Yhrn post some. Here are a few of mine.
Welcome to reality. It's a tough road.
The headlines in my local newspaper stated that natural gas prices were subject to rising by 70% this winter.
The wood (clean-up from hurricane Katrina) I place out on the roadside for FEMA removal is being salvaged by the locals, unlike it was for hurricane Ivan.
Or they could just send the illegals home and cut consumption by 20 to 50% depending on what percentage of the state you believe to be illegal.
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lol.. chickens coming home to roost roost roost, maybe?
just like old times, indeed, and surprise, much the same faces are in office while Rome begins to combust.
I retract my earlier post to you as to, ignorance, not stupidity. You have proved it is indeed the latter.
It must be nice to believe something without supporting facts.
What you are going to have to explain is how the major donors to the environmental movement (leftists all): the Pew family, the Rockefeller family, the British Royals, and the Packards (now in methane hydrate to the tune of $300 million) have no interest in high prices by means of regulatory constraint when they are are all heavily invested in methane production.
These folks work through political donations, funding NGO lawsuits, paying for useful university research... Such actions are invisible to you in the industry.
Go ahead, make my day.
And they won't even let us harvest the trees with which to make wooden paddles, therefore we are without a paddle!!!
Whata ya mean "sails?" They've cut off our ag water that we used to grow cotton with for sails in CA, as well!!!
You're funny as heck, but you're fallin behind their curve!!!
He expects you to worship both him and his economically unviable "Hydrogen Highway" for his equally impracticle "Hydrogen Hummer!"
It's past time that we just start ignoring them and their laws.
My weapons are strictly for self-defense ONLY!!! I will follow the law, even if it is an "ass" until we can get it changed politically and judicially!!!
The thought occurred - do the schools have any incentive to car pool?
Any CA educators - or parents - here who would know?
BTW My work is 20 miles from home - car is essential.
Thanks for the ping to an enlightened thread, backhoe and Norm have even revived some of the oldies....got this thread on the calpowercrisis list.....
MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
Ah... That'sa big 10-4 there muthertrucker! Hev we got us a convoy? Git back!!!
Yeeeeeeeeeehawwwwwwwww! Giddy Up!!! (clip clop, plip plop)
Good deal! I love threads like these!!!
I'd lost track of the "Greyout Davis" graphic- thanks!
LOL.. Thanks!
Basically every screwball enviro law dealing with energy has helped the Opecker Princes and Opecker Thugs.
Wow. Such persuasive alacrity.
Not all of it. Geothermal used to be considered alternative energy. Biomass has considerable promise and we have to do something about overgrown vegetation anyway.
I remember it being a beautiful article and I think I saw some replies by you on it too. Can't remember the title and I'm not worth a tinker's damn at searching for these things.
It depends upon the form. If you are processing wood waste into the grid with portable gasifiers on the site of the harvest, the trucking costs are next to nothing.
Anyway, I've been enjoying listening to Barbara Simpson interview Henry Lamb... He took it back to the county master plan process with all the Agenda 21 injection like you discovered and made it clear how this is all implemented around the corner through community activists through the guidance of NGO's.
Anyway, it reminded me of how the elected I defeated kept hyping forest biomass to the point that I finally dubbed him "Biomess Bill!" So as you can see... Yes, my mind is pretty much sealed up on the subject!!!
Forester, do you remember that great article somebody posted on FR about the failure of several alternative energy possibilities a couple of months ago?
Gees! I guess I'll havta go search!!! (I hate when that happens)
I guarantee you, they were analyzing transport of the mass to a large central processing plant, not portable generation and local distribution.
And... You'd undoubtedly be right, of course. Conventional wisdom, all the way baby!!! (grin)
Not exactly...I read so much stuff that it gets hard for me to remember what's what. C_O is right about portable biomass being economical - it eliminates the transport costs (cost of diesel fuel) of the wood chips. I have outlined how this would work several times on this forum over the years.
On another related topic. I was watching a senate hearing the other day on C-span, and Dominci asked the fed energy info agency lady to explain a map that she had. The map was of the all of the oil wells in the gulf of mexico. Each black dot was a well. All of the wells are between the Mexico/Texas border and the Alabama/Florida state line. Dominici asked why isn't there any oil wells off the florida coast, is it because there is no oil there? The agency lady said that there was PROVEN oil and gas reserves off the florida coast in what is known as lease 181. There are no wells because of the moratorium.
He pressed on- how come there are no wells off the east coast or the west coast, isn't there oil there? Yes she replied, there is oil but no new drilling is allowed.
Then came the finale: she stated that the entire lower 48 was off limits to new drilling under the moritorium except for the area of the gulf coast between the Mexico/Texas border and the Alabama/Florida state line that was depicted on the map. I was amazed, there were so many dots on the map, that area of the blue ocean looked like someone spilled pepper on the map.
IMHO, there is no energy shortage - there is shortage of leaders with a backbone .
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