Posted on 06/06/2005 8:26:38 PM PDT by TrebleRebel
ANNAPOLIS, Md. - During the anthrax mail attacks in 2001, Bill Paliscak, a gung-ho, hockey-playing postal investigator who had missed 3 days of work in 11 years, removed a filthy filter above a mail-sorting machine to preserve it as evidence. Anthrax-laden dust showered down on him.
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David Scull for The New York Times Bill Paliscak cannot live at his home until an elevator is installed.
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Agence France-Presse Workers in October 2001 cleaned the Brentwood postal facility in Washington, where employees like Mr. Paliscak were exposed to anthrax. Four days later he began to feel feverish. Soon he was in intensive care. After spending the next three years in and out of the hospital, Mr. Paliscak, 41, now needs a wheelchair to move about, sleeps with a breathing device to get enough oxygen and takes dozens of pills a day.
-------------------------- After consulting with dozens of specialists across the country, his doctors at Sinai Hospital of Baltimore remain convinced that his anthrax exposure produced his disease, in part because exhaustive testing found no other cause. They believe his experience may hold scientific lessons about anthrax, which experts consider the likeliest weapon in future bioterrorist attacks.
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Anthrax experts asked about Mr. Paliscak's illness had varying views. Dr. Brachman, of Emory University, said he would not rule out anthrax as a cause, despite the test findings. Dr. Ken Alibek, a former Soviet bioweapons expert now at George Mason University, was more skeptical. "You cannot make the diagnosis without laboratory confirmation," Dr. Alibek said.
Both wondered whether Mr. Paliscak's illness might be a devastating reaction to some other substance on the filter, such as yeast or mold spores. But Mr. Paliscak's doctors said they could find no evidence for that possibility
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
What ever became of that scientist they were suspecting of being behind that antrhax attack?
I've often wondered about the general safety of buildings where the only source of "fresh" air is through ventilation systems. Think about it, then try to open a window.
You mean Steven Hatfill? He sued the FBI 2 years ago and the FBI spent the next 2 years trying to get the suit dismissed. They failed and now it looks like the suit is going ahead.
ping
Fascinating case -- virtually certain it was anthrax, yet blood tests didn't detect anthrax.
Could it be that our tests are not sensitive enough, and anthrax can cause serious illness in quantities so small we can't detect them?
Do you remember that old woman in some state where there was no anthrax detected anywhere, yet she died of it?
They went through her mail, etc., couldn't find it.
And wasn't there another case in NY, where they couldn't find where someone got it from?
It sure sounds like we can't detect it in really small quantities.
Also -- how many others may have gotten ill and even died, without it being attributed to anthrax?
I feel hurt. You didn't ping me to this. I had to find it all by myself. ;)
Therefore the immune response you develop wouldn't be to a "known" anthrax or sub type but to another bacteria altogether. Since the anthrax antibodies are different than those you screen for, your test will be negative.
If the correct culture media wasn't used to screen the patients or if the serology tests weren't placed in the correct tubes for storage, transfer, or analysis then the tests would be "negative" but the patient will still have the disease.
The key is if the patient gets "better" or doesn't die if the appropriate antibiotics( doxycyline, penicillin, ciprofloxin) are started.
Even if you live, inhaled anthrax is a mother and may result in permanent lung and heart damage due to the lung problems and even if treated has anywhere from 45-75% mortality rate.
It shows how much we don't know.
FReepmail me if you want on or off my health and science ping list.
Interesting possibilities.
I wonder how much antibiotics they were giving him.
It's possible, that after their tests were negative they stopped the antibiotics -- I wouldn't put it past the doctors.
Well anyway they apparently treated him better than the victims of the DoD mandatory anthrax shots debacle. We had a guy featured in the Memphis local paper-- used to be the base Fire Chief-- he's in a wheelchair and has been deteriorating in health since his anthrax shots back in '99. Now he can move his left eye and that's it.
Of course they don't know what caused it or the other health problems associated with many other members of his unit-- they just know it's not the anthrax shots.
Ping to #14
ping
Good research thread for reference
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3c0301d41783.htm
Freeper Research on Anthrax Profile 11/26/01
good info.
Please add me to your ping list for Anthrax?
Or is the ping list for FBI ineptitude or Gommint agency stupidity?
No matter. Please add me.
You're on the list. Below is another UPI story just out. Anthrax covers a broad range - including FBI ineptitude and gubbmint agency CYA.
Clearly the CDC do want to admit this man was made ill with anthrax since they sent him into the building with only a papermask for protection.
http://news.webindia123.com/news/showdetails.asp?id=86476&cat=Science
Inspector may be fifth anthrax victim:-
ANNAPOLIS, Md. | June 07, 2005 7:11:27 PM IST
An inspector looking into Washington's anthrax attacks contracted anthrax-like poisoning symptoms, but officials refuse to list him among those attacked.
Two people were killed and two others were sickened in the fall of 2001 because of anthrax traced to letters to two U.S. senators. Postal Inspector Bill Paliscak removed the filter above the machine that sorted the letters near where the two dead men had worked, The New York Times reported Tuesday.
The dust that drifted down contained anthrax spores. Four days later Paliscak became ill with anthrax-like symptoms. He's been in and out of the hospital since, the Times said, and his medical bills total more than $800,000. But he's not considered a victim of the anthrax attack because blood tests never showed anthrax-related bacteria and antibodies.
Medical officials, including the Centers for Disease Control, say a proper diagnosis cannot be made without laboratory confirmation.
While the Department of Labor determined Paliscak's illness was work-related, and he receives workmen's compensation, Paliscak and his personal doctors are frustrated by the lack of a formal anthrax diagnosis. One doctor accused the CDC of having it's head in the sand about the case, the Times said.
(UPI)
Your thinking is right on! Good work.
BA, did you read this?
Here's a much earlier story describing the CDC sending this guy into the building inadequately protected:
http://www.ph.ucla.edu/epi/bioter/testingnotdetectanthrax.html
The mysterious case of William R. Paliscak Jr. raises the troubling possibility that officials may not have fully recognized the extent of the wave of anthrax cases linked to letters sent last fall by an unidentified bioterrorist.
This kind of ineptitude or "it's not in his bloodstream" given the tests that might not be conclusive, is the kind of thing that makes me nuts.
I almost died from a bloodstream infection that can't be tested for, either. But it's symptomology is specific, and the only way to make the diagnosis. I had to read up on it, go through 4 doctors to finally find one who "believed" in this disease, in order to be treated for it.
I feel for Bill Paliscak.
Paliscak's own doctors (from Johns Hopkins no less) seem utterly convinced that anthrax was to blame, in spite of no positive test. They are blaming no positive test simply on the antibiotics killing the bacteria - but by that time toxins had been produced by the bacteria and had done irrepairable damage. The CDC denial is for no other reason than they don't want the liability. They sent Paliscak into a building contaminated with weaponized anthrax and they made a grossly incorrect recommendation on the level of protection he needed.
That was a dry well brought on because the FBI, for some bizarre reason, made the mistake of listening to an underqualified ultra left-wing professor in New York State with a personal grudge and an axe to grind, and the media jumped on the bandwagon.
The poor guy is still in the process of trying to clear his name and get his life back, but "we screwed up" are three little words the government never really wants to have to say.
Good to see Mr. Shane back on the anthrax story.
Mua, postal thread here.
I agree with you 100% re Hatfield, Battle Axe.
"And wasn't there another case in NY, where they couldn't find where someone got it from?"
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/EID/vol9no6/02-0668.htm
I remembered this case. I'm a veteran from where this lady came from, i.e. Vietnam, a native born New Yawker and still a current resident. IIRC, there was a story in the NY Times that suggested it was airborne anthrax that rode on the prevailing wind pattern from the Franklin Park, New Jersey Post Office over New York City.
Interesting ! Most definitely Ames.
Bump
Hi, B.A. Thanks for the ping and remember my interest in this matter.
I'm afraid the link and science behind the article is over my head. But I'll continue to read all your comments about this with interest.
Actually, DNA inversions of various kinds occur frequently and easily in nature.
The paper you're probably referring to is:
Comparative genome sequencing for discovery of novel polymorphisms in Bacillus anthracis, by Read TD, Salzberg SL, Pop M, Shumway M, Umayam L, Jiang L, Holtzapple E, Busch JD, Smith KL, Schupp JM, Solomon D, Keim P, Fraser CMI don't have access to the full text, but I see nothing in the abstract that raises any red flags about anything "unnatural" found in the anthrax genome, and if they had noticed anything of that kind, that would have been the sort of thing that they'd have headlined in the abstract.Abstract: Comparison of the whole-genome sequence of Bacillus anthracis isolated from a victim of a recent bioterrorist anthrax attack with a reference reveals 60 new markers that include single nucleotide polymorphisms (SNPs), inserted or deleted sequences, and tandem repeats. Genome comparison detected four high-quality SNPs between the two sequenced B. anthracis chromosomes and seven differences among different preparations of the reference genome. These markers have been tested on a collection of anthrax isolates and were found to divide these samples into distinct families. These results demonstrate that genome-based analysis of microbial pathogens will provide a powerful new tool for investigation of infectious disease outbreaks.
If you have access to the text, could you post the relevant portion here -- the part concerning the inversion you felt might be "too complicated"?
Yes, Connecticut. She was the last known victim of the attacks. The other lady in New York worked at a hospital in Manhattan. Neither woman had any known contact with the anthrax letters, so eventually authorities said they thought it was from cross-contamination in the mail centers. However, they could never prove it whatsoever.
Yes, thanks, those were they ones I was thinking about.
You have raised some most interesting points and there is much to speculate. Like you, I have been convinced since day one that the anthrax attacks were perpetrated by AQ and likely with the assistance of Iraq.
I have quite a few files left, even after my computer crash, which point to Iraq as providing assistance to AQ in this regard. Even the Senate Intelligence Report said that Iraqi intelligence trained AQ in biological and chemical attacks.
As well, it is entirely unlikely that it is coincidence that the first person killed with anthrax in October 2001 happened to work for the man who rented an apartment to some of the 9/11 hijackers. And a few doctors in Florida came forward in 10/01 and said they recognized the hijackers, treated them for what they thought at the time was a burn or spider bite but later recognized as cutaneous anthrax.
"Can you provide a link to more than one incident of cutaneous anthrax first diagnosed as spider/bug bites??"
"After the devastating September 11, 2001 attacks there was immediate speculation of linkage between the two events. It is alleged that a "skin lesion" found on Ahmed al-Haznawi, one of the September 11 hijackers who sought treatment in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, was cutaneous anthrax. However, the anthrax letters were mailed after September 11. It is difficult to see how the hijackers were responsible for the anthrax attacks unless there were surviving comrades who continued their terrorist campaign."
What is the True Number of Victims of the Postal Anthrax Attack of 2001?
Tyler C. Cymet, DO, Section Head, Assistant Professor
Gary J. Kerkvliet, MD, Associate Program Director
To the Editor:
The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) counts as victims 22 people who were involved in the postal anthrax attack of 2001. We disagree. As scientists it is difficult to accept that fewer than 68 people were harmed in this event. There is no debate that at least 5 people died from inhalational anthrax, 11 people had cutaneous anthrax develop, and 6 people had diagnosed inhalational anthrax and survived. The debate concerns those individuals at the periphery: 38 people at the Hart Senate Office Building, Washington, DC, and 5 people at the America Media Inc building, Boca Raton, Florida, in whom anthrax was detected by nasal swab. These people were treated with antibiotics for 60 days and offered the anthrax vaccine, which many agreed to receive. Although they were treated like victims, because they did not have symptoms of anthrax, they were never counted as victims of that attack.1
The state of Delaware postal worker who tested positive for anthrax antibodies, but had a rash that appeared different than would be expected from anthrax, therefore was not counted as a victim because the rash was atypical.2 The CDC laboratory technician who had an abrasion while working with anthrax samples from the attack and, subsequently, had cutaneous anthrax develop was not counted as a victim.3 Finally, the US postal inspector in whom "aborted anthrax syndrome" developed after being exposed to large amounts of anthrax and becoming seriously ill was yet another victim not counted in this category.
That totals 68 people.
Bioterrorism affects more people than those who express the worst or classic case of an ensuing illness. Weaponized anthrax is a new illness that is still not understood. If we are to learn from this attack we need to start with an open mind.
Family Medicine Sinai Hospital of Baltimore
Internal Medicine Johns Hopkins School of Medicine Baltimore, Maryland
Sinai Program in General Internal Medicine Johns Hopkins School of Medicine
Anthrax Victims Relief Legislation Introduced In Senate 2003. So, where's the relief?
"Mr. President, 2 years ago, a letter containing about 1 gram of highly concentrated anthrax was opened in my office in the Hart Senate Office Building. Potentially deadly anthrax letters were also mailed, apparently by the same person or persons, to my dear friend and colleague, Senator PATRICK LEAHY, and to several news organizations. Two years later, all of those crimes remain unsolved.
The anthrax attack on the Senate remains the largest bioterrorism attack ever on U.S. soil. Here in the Senate my staff and members of Senator Feingold's staff were exposed to up to 3,000 times the lethal dose of anthrax.
The entire Hart Senate Office Building was closed for 3 months while scientists searched for a way to do something that had never been done before: To reclaim a building that had been badly contaminated by anthrax...."
- Mr. DASCHLE
"Thomas Morris and Joseph Curseen worked for the U.S. Postal Service. They were decent, hard-working men who pushed themselves and continued to go to work and church even as anthrax infections were killing them. They and Robert Stevens, Kathy Nguyen, and Ottilie Lundgren all lost their lives in the anthrax attacks.
Their families have suffered a devastating blow. This bill would allow them to receive some small compensation for their losses without having to suffer through the additional trauma and long delays associated with a lawsuit."
-Senator Tom Daschle
Oh, Battle Axe, I'm sorry. Somehow your request fell off the radar. Here you go.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/546116/posts
See post #15 for excellent links about anthrax:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1047022/posts
Filters in HVAC in major mailer's facilities are almost never changed.
I can walk into a postal facility and tell you in about 10 seconds if the filters need changed, and that has happened. On the other hand I find it exceedingly uncomfortable to walk into any major mailer's facility due to the dust and mold spores that occur when filters are not changed.
Given the amount of dust generated by processing mail, those filters don't last long, so it's not unreasonable to imagine the Postal Inspector was sicked by both anthrax and several other things, including toxic molds.
People who laugh at the threat posed by clogged filters in large buildings probably have clogged filters. It's one of the symptoms donchaknow!
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