Poll: New Yorkers Want Gay Marriage

Some people might have seen it as an opportunity to repent. New York didn't.

That the "right" lobby has managed to frame this issue based on something other than equality is, of course, besides the point.

The issue, of course, is not based on equality. It is based on a group who choose to engage in a deviant, unnatural, and unhealthy form of behavior trying to redefine the institution of marriage and to force people to accept and condone their behavior.

Welcome to FR by the way.

That the "right" lobby has managed to frame this issue based on something other than equality is,

Equality? You mean like a civil right?

I thought this was all about democracy and the rights of the majority.

Should a fringe minority be able to overule majoritorian rule? My guess is you and your pedarest friends would say yes.

There are several interesting things about this indication of the mentally disturbed state of opinion in New York City. At the risk of stepping on some toes, we will endeavor to explore them.

1. There is nothing rational about the concept of "Gay Marriage." Neither reason, sex, justice, order, morality, enterprise, physical fixtures nor buildings nor whatever, are verbally dependent. Changing the nomenclature of something does not change its nature, or change its attributes. All of the King's horses and all of the King's men--even after their failed efforts to put Humpty-Dumpty back together--will never be able to make marriage between people of the same sex possible. You can call something marriage, but whether it is or not depends not upon the use of words, but on the attributes of reality.

2. New York is not a typical American City. It has a huge foreign born population, and a huge population of only marginally assimilated peoples of a great variety of ethnic backgrounds. Those who favor liberal immigration policy, always claim that America can assimilate virtually anyone in fairly short order. But that is, of course, nonsense, also. Those huge ethnic enclaves in New York, are not assimilated. And what assimilation has taken place, is not assimilation towards traditional American norms, but rather a melding of values brought from overseas, with a self-conscious identification--induced by Leftist demagogues--with the concept of victimization. People caught up in that mindset, not only do not move towards traditional American norms, they move away from them.

3. The result of points one and two--as well as other more subtle factors, not addressed--is that New Yorkers have actually moved away, not only from traditional American values, but even from the values that they, or their parents or grandparents, brought to this country. "Gay marriage" does not reflect the value system nor the perception of reality of any traditional human society. It is a product of a combination of neurotic factors, present in the contemporary urban scene.

Before we all fall down the rabbit hole with Alice, we need to rediscover reality in American life. It is not a bad thing, when you get to know it. It actually benefits everyone--even in this case those in unnatural relationships. Because, at least when they understand what is not possible, they will be able to find what they can do to actually make their lives better. Insane pipe dreams just do not benefit anyone. And the fact that by changing the meanings of words, you can reach any conclusion you want, will never make that conclusion real.

William Flax

Always question the poll taken.

I'd be perfectly content to leave this matter to a vote, just as long as it isn't judges doing the voting. I favor the people of each state setting their own policy with regards to marriage or its euphemistic substitutes, ideally through a direct vote via ballot initiative. I favor letting Congress set federal policy.

So I'm all for settling this with non-judicial votes. I'm confident that my views will win out in most states, and federally if it is settled by votes, and I have no problem letting the liberal states adopt gay marriage, or more likely civil unions, just as long as all the other states aren't bound by their lunacy.

The seeming contradiction between support for gay marriage and for Bloomberg's decision to appeal the ruling for gay marriage caught my attention too.

As was said, it could simply be that those polled prefer a resolution, but it still seems a bit odd.

I would like to believe that it is a principled stand on the part of those polled in that they favor gay marriage, yet they don't support having it rammed through by Courts and instead prefer implementation of it through the proper legislative and popular means.

I'd like to believe that, but its probably too much to hope for, but then again, I have long thought that if a poll were done asking those in favor of gay marriage/civil unions if they support having it imposed by the judiciary or by democratic means, that many of them would oppose the illegitimate interference of the Courts.

This could be wishful thinking, because afterall it is liberals who favor judicial activism in the first place, so it goes to reason that most of those who hold the liberal support of gay marriage/civil unions would likely also favor the general concept of judicial activism since it is, after all, the only way that liberals can win battles in the cultural war. Despite this, I am optimistic that many of those who favor gay marriage/civil unions could be convinced that it is wrong for the Courts to settle this issue, and any such people are defacto allies in this narrow regard because to remove the Courts from the equation is to attain victory for conservatives.