Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

LOSING OUR DELUSIONS: Not Much Left (Despondent Liberal on state of Liberalism)
New Republic ^ | 2/17/05 | Martin Peretz

Posted on 02/17/2005 6:31:56 PM PST by pissant

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 101-104 next last
To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity

well said.


21 posted on 02/17/2005 7:07:40 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: pissant

I really believe that's in the air. The internet is fuelling the idea that these far lefties are not alone in their beliefs, that there are millions of fellow travellers out there. Before they would mope around the public library, noticing the reading copy of The Nation is always in pristine, unread shape when they went to read it. Now they think they are an untapped force of elites who just know so much better than The Masses. And it's time for them to rise up and blah blah blah.


22 posted on 02/17/2005 7:09:43 PM PST by Darkwolf377 ("Drowning someone...I wouldn't have a part in that."--Teddy K)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: JennysCool

You are correct. Thomas Jefferson and some of the other founders may have been the creators of enlightened liberalism (in the US anyway). But the modern liberal in no way resembles that vision; conservatives do.


23 posted on 02/17/2005 7:10:18 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: pissant
The biggest insult to our black fellow citizens was the deference paid to Al Sharpton during the campaign. Early in the race, it was clear that he--like Carol Moseley Braun and Dennis Kucinich--was not a serious candidate.

It's a democracy. Such a snob. Reminds me of Koppel's put down of Kucinich during a debate that he wasn't a "serious" candidate. Sharpton had a special advantage - he seemed to be the only coherent one.

24 posted on 02/17/2005 7:10:38 PM PST by Shermy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: filbert
"Certainly DU ain't it."

Is DU the #1 liberal posting site? Are there any FR-like sites for the left that are a little more normal? (Or dare I say, moderate/conservative democrat?)

If anyone knows of any you can FReepmail me with the sites so we don't give them publicity. :P

25 posted on 02/17/2005 7:12:54 PM PST by Darkwolf377 ("Drowning someone...I wouldn't have a part in that."--Teddy K)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Shermy

I'd take Sharpton over Kerry as President any day of the week. That says boatloads about my regard for the Quisling from Mass.


26 posted on 02/17/2005 7:13:26 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Darkwolf377

I think that was really my point. As far as I know, there isn't a real Leftist alternative to FR. About the only site I know about that has halfway reasonable leftie discussions is Strauss & Howe's fourthturning.com. Even that is only palatable in small doses.


27 posted on 02/17/2005 7:15:14 PM PST by filbert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: pissant

Wow, how did *that* get published in New Republic?


28 posted on 02/17/2005 7:17:03 PM PST by brbethke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: brbethke

The author is the poobah editor, that's how.


29 posted on 02/17/2005 7:18:37 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: pissant
False as a matter of intellectual history about the 60s and the New Deal era. The left did not have better ideas then. They had already lost the real intellectual debate, at the peaks of the culture. They just didn't know it yet, and the shallow pseudo intellectuals among them, who only believe ideas they are told to believe in and cannot examine real arguments on two sides of a question and tell who actually has the truth on their side, continued to believe they were enlightened and the right stupid because that is what they wanted to believe. Socialism was refuted by 1922, by Mises. The bright lights on the left saw as much at the latest by the end of WW II - Orwell, Koestler, Arendt. Hayek had already written "Road" by then. The classical liberals had seen that they had to side with the old conservatives.

When the left saw the same thing, they took the plunge into irrationalism - the old holdout of the European far right - deliberately. Worshipping foreign tyrants as "authentic", getting hot and bothered for Nietzche and his later French publicists, identity politics, the worship of youth rather than learning, slumming and waht Arendt called the "backstairs literature" of conspiracy - all of them were tropes of the irrationalist European far right when they had no reasonable arguments left. The left went for them the instant the old anti-communist wing of the party imploded.

The new left never had ideas on its side. It had sophistry and rhetoric and attitude. All of it borrowed from failed European radicalism of an earlier generation. Orwell, Koestler, and Arendt despised that radicalism, looked on it as a disease, a flight from reality. The new left was never about anything else. The cultural heights lost, they decided to fight on in the sewers.

For a while that gave them a certain catchet, it let them take over university departments in the humanities and social sciences for instance. But they took them over as a wrecking crew, not as thinkers. As soon as that was done, there was nothing to attract the young to the same old sophistry, so clearly empty and tired. Denouncing the patriarchy doesn't go very far with a young woman who has never met her father. Assailing privilege from positions of tenured comfort isn't very convincing, and radical relativist skepticism says nothing to young people who have literally never even encountered the belief in objective truth.

What are the great wits of the left up to these days? Recycled conspiracy crap, apologies for the most inhuman tyrants, antisemitism, thought police, a veneer of nature worship over crass self indulgence, partisanship without bounds, party directed hatred - look closely. That's Weimar. And not the Weimar of the left.

30 posted on 02/17/2005 7:21:41 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: JasonC

Well put.


31 posted on 02/17/2005 7:25:28 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: pissant
"I'd take Sharpton over Kerry as President any day of the week. That says boatloads about my regard for the Quisling from Mass."

I agree. Kerry is a liar and a traitor who has gotten away with his crime. The man is not fit to run a local PTA meeting much less be a Senator, and certainly he is not fit to be the President.
32 posted on 02/17/2005 7:26:36 PM PST by Wolfhound777 (It's not our job to forgive them. Only God can do that. Our job is to arrange the meeting)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Wolfhound777

You related to Darkwolf377?


33 posted on 02/17/2005 7:29:09 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: pissant

. It does not recognize a genocide when the genocide is seen and understood by all. Liberalism now needs to be liberated from many of its own illusions and delusions. Let's hope we still have the strength.

That would be the 45 million killed by liberal abortion.

FORTY FIVE MILLION!

Poor democrats, that would have been almost enough to
win the last election. Almost.


34 posted on 02/17/2005 7:30:42 PM PST by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: pissant

Yikes. For a multi-millionaire stock broker Peretz sounds like Arthur Miller at his most humorless and despondent. His Death of a Salesman shtick is getting funnier. Prior to the election in Nov. he wrote how much he disliked and saw through that phony Kerry but his rag, of which he is publisher, supported Kerry editorially. The whole bunch at the New Republic are just a bunch of incestuous, disappointed old lefties wondering what went wrong and why everybody ain't as smart as they. Occasionally they leave NYC to visit Europe but have no idea what the US is really about.


35 posted on 02/17/2005 7:30:53 PM PST by Shisan (Jalisco no te rajes.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: pissant

Clearly liberalism has no lack of words.

Just ideas.


36 posted on 02/17/2005 7:31:44 PM PST by Uncle Miltie (Democrat Obstructionists will be Daschled!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: JasonC

Bump.


37 posted on 02/17/2005 7:35:30 PM PST by Shermy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: Shisan

And why isn't he offering up his own vision of where his beloved party needs to go? Tough to travel the road when you do not have a destination. The socialism and communism they admired has failed, so there is no longer a rudder to steer the party. Their boat just drifts in smaller and smaller circles.


38 posted on 02/17/2005 7:35:57 PM PST by pissant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: dirtboy; Howlin; Shermy
Is Marty Peretz the last sane liberal alive, ping.
39 posted on 02/17/2005 7:40:47 PM PST by okie01 (A slavering moron and proud member of the lynch mob, cleaning the Augean stables of MSM since 1998.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: brbethke
Wow, how did *that* get published in New Republic?

Marty Peretz owns The New Republic.

He can say what he wants...

40 posted on 02/17/2005 7:44:24 PM PST by okie01 (A slavering moron and proud member of the lynch mob, cleaning the Augean stables of MSM since 1998.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 101-104 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson