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THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION: WHAT DOES IT REALLY SAY?
Christian Law Association ^ | 2003

Posted on 01/07/2005 3:51:55 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe

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To: mrsmith

Thats what jury nullification is supposed to be about. No matter what laws get passed, if the people refuse to convict, then they are indeed at the top of the pyramid.

Thats how it's supposed to work, anyway.


61 posted on 01/07/2005 5:44:49 PM PST by djf
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To: Dog Gone

Whether Judicial Supremacy is "logical" or not, this doctrine is not dictated by the Constitution. Congress' impeachment power is the check on the President's power.


62 posted on 01/07/2005 5:45:28 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Whether Judicial Supremacy is "logical" or not, this doctrine is not dictated by the Constitution.

I don't disagree with that, but it's no longer reality and never will be again.

63 posted on 01/07/2005 5:51:28 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

Says you.


64 posted on 01/07/2005 5:52:04 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Dog Gone
Article III, Section 2: In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.
65 posted on 01/07/2005 5:54:22 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Fine. Overthrow the government. I'll watch.


66 posted on 01/07/2005 5:54:29 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Tailgunner Joe

To their credit, the Supreme Court has never challenged Congress's power to limit their jurisdiction.


67 posted on 01/07/2005 5:55:58 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

All congress has to do is reassert their Constitutional authority over the courts. The Judiciary has usurped powers that don't belong to them. It's time to take that power away.


68 posted on 01/07/2005 5:57:43 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe
The constitution is the recipie for good goverment.

What we need to do is tell everyone who knows nothing of the constitution that the constitution puts limmits on the government...and does not allow the government putting limmits on the people.

We must tell everypne that when the government says they are going to allow us to do this..or tell us to do that.....well......they damend well can't because the constitution does not allow it.

69 posted on 01/07/2005 6:13:55 PM PST by Radioactive
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To: dAnconia

Bump for later


70 posted on 01/07/2005 6:17:20 PM PST by dAnconia (The government cannot grant rights,but it can protect them. Or violate them.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Excellent post. Certainly everyone should reread this from time to time.


71 posted on 01/07/2005 6:23:11 PM PST by Raffus (Thanks to all Veterans for their service to our Country.)
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To: djf

The time honored pledge to defend the Constitution is honored only in the few seconds it takes to say it. Politicians abandon it with in minutes thereafter.


72 posted on 01/07/2005 7:16:08 PM PST by Goreknowshowtocheat
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To: Dog Gone

I agree with you that you can't understand how the Constitution applies in real life just by reading it. Not even the framers could agree on what it meant, not even at the time it was written. It's full of compromises and gaps that had to be filled in over time, not always very satisfactorily.

A lot of the arguments about "strict construction" vs. "living breathing etc." are just a way of saying "I am right and you are wrong." Scalia is as bad as any of the rest of them in pretending that he's a "strict constructionist" when he really means "my interpretation is the correct one." They all do it. They always have.

For example - the author of the posted article says that "the Constitution relied on the Bible." Well, that's not anywhere in the Constitution, and there are plenty of sources that beg to differ. Argue about it all you want, it's still just an opinion.

Conveniently packaged as if it were factual in the hope that you are easily bamboozled, especially when you read something you want to believe because you like what it says.


73 posted on 01/07/2005 7:20:06 PM PST by CobaltBlue
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To: longtermmemmory
Now we have 12 linear feet of new case law every year.

Much more than that, if you count all jurisdictions.

On the other hand, back in the old days, when lawyers only had Story/Storey on the Constitution and Black's Common Law and a book on equity and a book on pleading, they winged it a lot. Not just the lawyers, but the judges. They made up stuff as they went along.

Lots of weird opinions, but you probably don't study old case law much, is my guess.

74 posted on 01/07/2005 7:28:43 PM PST by CobaltBlue
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To: CobaltBlue
Not even the framers could agree on what it meant, not even at the time it was written.

Good lordy, is that true. I think most Americans think that our Founders were one big wise committee that came up with this thing in some spirit of compromise and God-given wisdom. Cripes, Aaron Burr shot dead the guy on our $10 bill in 1804.

We did extremely well in coming up with our Constitution, and while I won't argue that it's being followed precisely today, it's reasonably close. We're probably doing much better than expected. If we assembled the same guys in 2005 to draft a constitution, I'm afraid of what it might look like.

75 posted on 01/07/2005 7:36:11 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: djf; mrsmith
-- there has to be a blank spot at the top for "the people".

53 mrsmith







Thats what jury nullification is supposed to be about.
No matter what laws get passed, if the people refuse to convict, then they are indeed at the top of the pyramid.
Thats how it's supposed to work, anyway.
61 djf






Exactly. -- We have allowed the
'justice system' to infringe upon our right to be tried before fully informed juries. -- The application of the law in the case at hand should be part of every felony trial.

Instead we have 'directed verdicts', -- a mockery of the system itself.
76 posted on 01/07/2005 7:44:22 PM PST by jonestown ( Tolerance for intolerance is not tolerance at all. Jonestown, TX)
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To: Dog Gone
If we assembled the same guys in 2005 to draft a constitution, I'm afraid of what it might look like.

Given the same circumstances, they would make the same document. We have amended the Constitution when necessary. If people cannot understand simple words and they come to diametrical positions using the same words, there is no hope for humanity.

77 posted on 01/07/2005 7:59:57 PM PST by AndrewC (Darwinian logic -- It is just-so if it is just-so)
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To: AndrewC
It's not the same circumstances, though.

I'd like to hope that they'd (or we'd) come up with a remarkably similar document, but those guys never envisioned the Industrial Revolution. Nor could they.

Things have changed. If someone wants to be a strict constitutionalist and mean it, find where it allows the government to build the US Air Force. It doesn't, of course, having been written more than 100 years before air flight began.

It really doesn't envision a standing army, although you can twist the words to allow it.

I don't know what a new constitutional convention would come up with. I'm about 85% content with the one we have, even though we've messed with it quite a bit.

78 posted on 01/07/2005 8:09:07 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone
It's not the same circumstances, though.

If someone wants to be a strict constitutionalist and mean it, find where it allows the government to build the US Air Force.

Well, you would quibble over a name? What do you expect the armed forces of the United States to be wielding? Muskets? The U.S. Air Force is an outgrowth of the Army Air Corps. We'll just roll back its name and make you happy.

Clause 12: To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

Clause 18: To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.

You have a stronger case against the Department of Education.

79 posted on 01/07/2005 8:40:25 PM PST by AndrewC (Darwinian logic -- It is just-so if it is just-so)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Bump and thanks!


80 posted on 01/07/2005 9:00:15 PM PST by lainde
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