Posted on 01/07/2005 10:12:48 AM PST by BurbankKarl
Voting by dead people isn't always a scam
By Jonathan Martin and David Heath Seattle Times staff reporters
Days after his wife of four decades died of liver cancer, Robert Holmgren came home to find her absentee ballot. He filled in Charlette Holmgren's intended votes for Dino Rossi and George W. Bush, forged her signature, and mailed her ballot along with his.
"I know by the law it wasn't right, but it felt right in my heart," he said. "I wasn't trying to defraud anybody. I was just going with my wife's last wishes."
In six of the state's largest counties, at least 24 dead people were credited with voting in the November election. Some of those can be explained as clerical errors — a voter mistakenly signing the wrong line in a poll book, for instance — and others are cases in which people inadvertently voted in their relatives' names but not in their own.
But three of the cases, including Holmgren's, warrant referral for felony prosecution, elections officials said last night, and several others require further investigation.
Allegations of dead-voter fraud have reverberated on the Internet and talk radio. And the state Republican Party intends to cite dead voters in its expected challenge of the closest gubernatorial election in state history, one in which Democrat Christine Gregoire beat Republican Rossi by 129 votes.
But despite the handful of suspicious cases in which dead people were credited with voting, in at least half of the two dozen cases there is no evidence that extra votes were cast in dead people's names, according to a Seattle Times analysis reviewed by county officials. The clerical errors and surviving relatives' slip-ups mean the wrong person — but not an additional person — was credited with voting.
All but two of the dead voters were in King County. Pierce County did not provide voter history despite numerous requests for the records. One dead voter was from Clark County in southwest Washington, and one was from Spokane County. Of the 24, 14 were credited with voting absentee and 10 with voting at the polls.
Secretary of State Sam Reed said he would "prosecute to the hilt" any valid case of fraudulent votes cast by the dead. But he said he was relieved that there appeared to be few such cases and said the enormity of this year's voter registration and turnout may explain some of the clerical mistakes.
At the request of The Seattle Times, King County elections manager Bill Huennekens opened poll books and voting records to reporters, examining 22 instances where the dead were credited with voting.
Chris Vance, state Republican chairman, said the party has researched votes credited to dead people and believes fraud is a serious problem. "People pass away, then other people vote their ballot," he said. "There's not hundreds [of ballots], but it happens, and in a close election it matters."
Removing names
The slow and cumbersome process of removing the deceased from voter rolls opens a window for mistakes.
Florence Kinnune, whose 71-year-old husband, Charles, died in September, said she wrote the word "deceased" on his absentee ballot envelope and returned it to the county. He was credited with voting.
In some cases, election workers simply scanned the wrong line in poll books. In Clark County, Angie Johnsen, who died in 1997, was credited for a vote cast by Daryl Johnson, whose name is listed below hers, according to county auditor Greg Kimsey.
In King County, Brandon Jones lives in the home of his late grandfather, Donald Jones, and he voted this year at the polls. But a poll worker scanned the wrong line of the poll book, giving Donald, not Brandon, credit for voting.
In other cases, people cast ballots in the name of dead relatives. Maxine A. Zemko of Seattle said she has been voting under the name of Maxine M. Zemko — her mother — since her mother's death in 1983.
That year, according to the younger Zemko, King County elections workers mistakenly erased her from the voter rolls instead of her deceased mother. As an additional complication, Maxine A. Zemko bought her mother's house, so both Maxine Zemkos shared an address. And as her mother would have, Maxine A. Zemko said, she voted for Christine Gregoire.
"Nobody has ever questioned me," said Maxine A. Zemko. "That's part of why I kept doing it, because I wondered how long it would take for them to figure it out. I guess I should fix it."
Usually not a scheme
Nationally, there is rich lore about dead voters, said election reform expert Doug Chapin, citing an old joke from Boston about voters wanting to be buried in specific city boroughs to have their voting rights live on.
But voting by the dead usually indicates simple error and not a widespread scheme, he said. "The reality may not match the lore," said Chapin, director of the nonpartisan Election Reform Information Project.
County elections offices are supposed to receive quarterly updates of death certificates from the state Department of Health to purge dead voters' names from their rolls. But there is usually a six-month delay in processing data. That meant a May update didn't include any 2004 deaths, and a November update came the day before the election — too late to purge the dead.
There is another problem: Counties aren't notified of all deaths in the state, so sometimes a voter's death notice goes to the wrong county.
Under a federal law passed after the 2000 presidential election, the secretary of state is compiling a statewide voter-registration database that may ease the confusion.
It is possible for the votes to be legitimately credited to the dead. Pamela Floyd, the state's deputy elections manager, said an absentee ballot cast by a person who then dies before Election Day counts. "The day they cast their ballot is Election Day for them," she said, citing court rulings.
In whose hand?
Anne Witte's absentee-ballot envelope from the November election is signed in what looks like her elegant script, with a flowing W and looped T's.
But Witte, a longtime Republican activist from Sammamish, could not have penned the signature. She died in February.
Vernon Witte, her husband, said he never saw the ballot and thinks it might have been stolen from his mailbox.
According to the election office, Anne Witte's ballot was postmarked Oct. 28. The signature on the ballot envelope, shown to The Times, closely matched that on Anne Witte's voter-registration card.
Dean Logan, head of King County elections, said the matched signatures made him question the authenticity of Anne Witte's original card. "I want to do more research," he said.
Other ballots also defy easy explanation. Marcia Pettersen, 54, the daughter of Joan MacDonald, said she had been picking up the mail for her mother since the 81-year-old woman died last August. MacDonald was credited with voting by absentee.
"I never saw an absentee ballot," Pettersen said. "I have no idea how this could have happened."
Viola Fey, whose 80-year-old husband, John, died in May, said she recalls throwing his ballot into the trash.
"They came on the same day. I sent mine in and threw his out," she said.
Reed said the super-heated election year may have derailed purges of dead voters. In addition to dealing with a new primary-voting model, counties struggled with record numbers of voter registrations and ballots.
Some voters, he said, may have taken advantage. "The emotion over this presidential race exceeded any other race I've seen. People felt like it was a holy crusade, either anti-Bush or pro-Bush. When people get that emotional, and temptation is in front of them, well ... "
Seattle Times reporters Justin Mayo, Christine Willmsen, Mike Carter and Cheryl Phillips contributed to this report.
I'm amazed the lengths the Seattle media will go to in order to protect Gregoire's butt.
Forging a ballot is illegal, period.
I admire his sentimentality, but yes, it's both a scam and illegal.
Cheating old folks out of their life savings isn't always a scam. My dear departed parents always hoped that I would become rich. By bilking the elderly, I am merely going with their last wishes.
In Indiana it's legal to vote if you are dead, if you have a valid drivers license and walk in to the voting booth. Due to voter record purging they labeled some people as dead who were quite alive.
Once she died, she lost her right to vote. Sorry, dude. She also can't collect Social Security.
Gogol's DEAD SOULS had to do with buying the souls of dead Russian serfs. A tax scam as I recall.
And Grandma would want you to have a new car, too.
Bob Holmgren said yesterday that he voted on behalf of his late wife, Charlette Holmgren, who died Sept. 29. The West Seattle man filled out his own ballot and hers, and signed both of them.
"Her vote was important to her," Holmgren said. "She was very strongly against Governor-elect Gregoire." Election officials said all signatures on absentee ballots were doubled-checked against the signature on record.
I don't claim that Republicans are saints who would never, ever, ever cheat, but this guy sure talks like a Democrat.
Or: Voting for dead people is always illegal.
Guess it depends on which side of the fraud you're on.
Not under the new and improved Dimwit rules. In 2000, Carnahan died in a plane crash. Thus, he was ineligible weeks later to be elected U.S. Senator from the State of Misery. Didn't stop the MSM and Dimwits from announcing that Carnahan was the widow and the Dimwit governor from giving the seat to his widow.
But forging a signature on a ballot is, which should make the ballot invalid and the perp should be charged, period.
The bottom line is that if Rossi had won, the press would have a radically different perspective on what constitutes voter fraud. There are laws against signing other peoples' names on official documents. Period.
The temptation results from all the boons and banes that government hands out. If the handouts were eliminated, the temptation would evaporate. Ergo, the love of government is the root of [much] evil.
Boy, are you an intolerant, insensitive, racist, bigoted, homophobic, reactionary!
(welcome to the club)
-PJ
Thanks for the reminder about the Mink stink. The law doesn't apply to the Dimwit Party. Even when it does, an activist judge will rule otherwise.
bttt
Darn - beat me to it!
The Democratic Party fully supports the Civil Rights of Necro-Americans!
Well said. The MSM is doing everything in their power to ignore this mess. It is a good thing that the public is demaning that things be examined.
What I find totally beyond belief it that neither the Seattle Times, the PI, the TNT, the Everet Herald, or the east side papers have cornered Ron Sims and asked him what went wrong.
I think they are trying to protect Ron as much as they are Chris.
Yeah... It's that same "right or wrong" thinking that gets me in trouble with my teenager! :-)
Bingo.
You know this article is part of the cover-up when they use what is probably the only example in the state of someone casting an illegal vote for Rossi/Bush as their lead-in. How much do you want to bet that they had to check around a lot before they found this guy?
Typical Dem attitude - wait years and years for the government to do something that you should take responsibility for yourself.
Who says this guy is real. He could be made up out of whole cloth.
Not a good example in there. My grandmother almost voted dead though, right after she sent in her absentee ballot she got really sick, was in the hospital during the election. It can happen legitimately, but it's probably pretty rare.
Anne Witte's absentee-ballot envelope from the November election is signed in what looks like her elegant script, with a flowing W and looped T's.
But Witte, a longtime Republican activist from Sammamish, could not have penned the signature. She died in February.
Vernon Witte, her husband, said he never saw the ballot and thinks it might have been stolen from his mailbox.
According to the election office, Anne Witte's ballot was postmarked Oct. 28. The signature on the ballot envelope, shown to The Times, closely matched that on Anne Witte's voter-registration card.
Dean Logan, head of King County elections, said the matched signatures made him question the authenticity of Anne Witte's original card. "I want to do more research," he said.
The question: who did "Anne Witte" vote for? if you answered "Rossi/Bush", what made you think that?
Of course, I'm sure you and others on this thread were not fooled by this article, but this type of biased reporting really frosts me, and it can fool some of the voting public!!!
BTW, who's Dean Logan? and I'm sure glad you FReepers and other kindred spirits out there are keeping Gregoire's feet to the fire...if all else fails, call the FBI!! The rest of the Republic is depending on you all to call them on this...it ain't Florida or Ohio this time, it's real and these "irregularities" (HA) must not go unchallenged!!
FReegards from Ohio... / rant...LOL!
Last I looked, one of the prerequisites for voting is that the voter be breathing (i.e.: alive)
I love it----talk about taking the 'intent' of the voter to the extreme.
*geez*
Your skepticism is well warranted, probably more accurate than my guess!
This is so transparent. Why Republicans are in on this too! Any coincidence that their main example is a Republican? I don't care if he gave $2000 to Bush (he didn't, nor did his wife give a dime to anybody) he forged her signature and knew what he was doing. Felony + 1 year in jail.
In other cases, people cast ballots in the name of dead relatives. Maxine A. Zemko of Seattle said she has been voting under the name of Maxine M. Zemko — her mother — since her mother's death in 1983. That year, according to the younger Zemko, King County elections workers mistakenly erased her from the voter rolls instead of her deceased mother. As an additional complication, Maxine A. Zemko bought her mother's house, so both Maxine Zemkos shared an address. And as her mother would have, Maxine A. Zemko said, she voted for Christine Gregoire.Ignoring the fact that it's a huge non-sequitur, her mother's been dead over 20 years! How would she know what her mom would have wanted? Why would she vote in her mother's name and not her own for 20 years?
Equal voting rights for dead people too!!!! LOLOLOL
"...her mother's been dead over 20 years! How would she know what her mom would have wanted? Why would she vote in her mother's name and not her own for 20 years?"
Who says she voted in her mother's name and NOT her own?
Why not vote under BOTH names? I'm sure she did!
Just curious! We in Ohio have called Sec./State Blackwell to support and thank him after the trashing he took yesterday in Congress...many here on both sides know he's an honest man, there were the usual unfortunate "imperfections" in the election process (guess which precincts? LOL!!) but there was no vote fraud aside from some earlier dubious voter registrations (again, guess which "side"?) and the CBC, Tubbs-Jones and others were absolutely disgraceful with that!!
I worked the Republican telephone banks for several months here in Oregon before the election. Oregon is a one hundred percent vote-by-mail state. I lost count of the people I asked for to be told they had been dead for quite some time. At least twenty percent had moved, but were still on the voter rolls. Others I called at their listed out-of-state phone number had been living in the other states for some time. Some said they were voting in the other state and wanted to know what to do with the Oregon ballot. Some people I called had listed a cell phone number with out-of-state prefixes.
I spent the last week of the election every day going door to door to remind people to vote and also picking up votes to deliver to the county election office. I was assigned to precincts that had large assisted living facilities and elder care homes. Several people at those facilities told me their son, daughter, or grandchild had their ballots. Several said they didn't know if they received their ballots, but they were listed as voting in every recent election. People told me their children were at college in a different county and had received a ballot at each address. They asked what to do with the extra ballot. Several people told me the person I was looking for was their child who lived in another state and was voting there, but they still got the Oregon ballots at their parent’s address. Every requested absentee ballot in our county was followed by a second ballot this election by mistake. There is no statewide database of voters so you could potentially get a vote-by-mail ballot in each county. I believe Oregon’s vote-by-mail system provides for massive voter fraud.
I believe that there should be a national voter database. I agree with the DemocRats when they say every vote should count. Where we disagree is every vote should be validated and should only count once.
Nothing like a close reading, LOL! Her Mom passes on in August, and the daughter still hasn't stopped the mail?!?!
Gee, it's a good thing there were only 24 dead people voting, and even though 22 were in the crucial King County, that still isn't enough to swing the election...! /heavy sarcasm
Now if he will just apologize, everything will be OK.
[/sarcasm]
Ron Sims is the King County Executive.
In King County, unlike most counties in this state, has the elections function is not under the County Auditor's responsibility, but instead under the control of the County Executive.
Ron Sims is a prominent Democrat in the State and actually was the main Democratic Party rival in the primary Goveror's race to Chris Gregoire. Ron has high party aspirations and has been known to pull political fast ones every now and then.
After years of problems with the elections dept in King County and a very pointed State Auditor report, the King County Executive (Ron Sims) and the King County Council got into a fight and re-organized the elections department and put in under control of both Democratic Party dominated organizations. The County Council set up a Citizens Election Oversight Committee to make sure that the new Elections head, Mr. Dan Logan, cleaned things up, even though it is still functionally under the control of the County Executive, Ron Sims.
None of the problems being discussed is totally a new problem that was not known prior to the election. It was just that the King County Council, its Citizens Oversight Committee, and Ron Sims were all saying earlier in the year that all the problems were be worked out.
It is now clear that the mess was not fixed. It is even more clear that "the buck doesn't stop on Mr. Sims or the County Coumcils desk."
Sad for the old guy but he voted for her AFTER she died. That is a straight violation of the law. (of course we are assuming he voted democrat, the article does not say and it would change nothing)
This article sounds like damage control. The democrats are in trouble.
Is seems clear the mess was made worse.
Like I said, very interesting!! But...that "selected" BS didn't work to stop W's re-election, so I say, go for it and let the Dem. chips (is that like "cow chips"? ouch! / mean) fall where they may...hopefully in jail!
Thanks for the info/update!
Sam Reed said that? Then in addition to being a RINO, he's barely literate.
(Some of us would agree that there was "enormity" in the Dim fraud, however.)
Actually, I honestly believe Logan "reduced" the amount of problems. It was a horrible mess, now it is just a bad mess.
Having said that, Logan, Sims and the County Council are still responsible for not cleaning things up adequately.
The only problem is that I don't think that either Mr. Sims is that "intelligent" to pull it all off and I don't think the democrats of King County are "smart enough and dedicated enough" to attempt this. Organized Labor, Certain radical civil rights groups, and some radical feminists groups might be dedicated enough to try to really steal the election, but I am not sure the King County Democrats are.
I could see out-of-state get out the vote groups trying to steal the election, but nobody thought it was going to be close . The convensional wisdom was that Chris G had it locked up. Therefore, it is unlikely that an out-of-state group would have infiltrated or spent the kind of money required to add a couple thousand votes prior to Nov 2nd to a Democratic forecast Governors victory election.
Stinkin' reporters: They lead with a story of one of the few republican's who cheated in this election, trying to make it appear that both parties cheat.
Nonetheless, assuming the stories are true, it is a tinkle in the ocean compared to the stories they apparently didn't find worth investigating such as:
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