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Feathered ancestor of T. rex unearthed [Transitional species]
Nature Magazine ^ | 06 October 2004 | Zeeya Merali

Posted on 10/06/2004 2:08:54 PM PDT by PatrickHenry

click here to read article


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To: Dog Gone
I'm puzzled. The description of the protofeathers sounds like hair, not feathers.

Such large returns of conjecture. From so small investment in fact. You look for feathers on a dinosaur, you'll find them everywhere. Even where they ain't.

Why can't it be simply reptilian and prey? Occam not allowed to play here?

61 posted on 10/06/2004 8:10:40 PM PDT by Publius6961 (I, also, don't do diplomacy.)
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To: Dog Gone

Feathers, hairs, nails/claws and scales are all made from keratin.


62 posted on 10/06/2004 8:12:51 PM PDT by Nataku X (Live near a liberal college? Want to demoralize Dems? FRmail me to join in Operation Reverse Moby!)
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To: DocRock

TOO funny!!! Thanks!


63 posted on 10/06/2004 8:16:23 PM PDT by Borax Queen ("Either you're with us or you're with the terrorists." (President Bush, 29 Nov 2001)
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To: Nakatu X
Fine, but I'm curious why this was described as feathers, or protofeathers, when the description sounds to me like hair.

it was hardly an elaborate description in this article, so there's probably a reason. It's not been revealed here yet.

64 posted on 10/06/2004 8:19:16 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: stanz

I want that baby as a stuffed toy for Christmas.


65 posted on 10/06/2004 8:20:02 PM PDT by Ciexyz (At his first crisis, "President" Kerry will sail his Swiftboat to safety, then call Teddy.)
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To: Dog Gone

do kiwis have feathers or hairs?


66 posted on 10/06/2004 8:23:57 PM PDT by Nataku X (Live near a liberal college? Want to demoralize Dems? FRmail me to join in Operation Reverse Moby!)
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The editor at creationsafaris has an interesting commentary regarding this 'find':

Feathers?

67 posted on 10/06/2004 9:02:26 PM PDT by Michael_Michaelangelo (Kerry is scary)
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To: Dog Gone
What about fish?

What's a fish?

LOL!, just kidding.

Hadn't really considered fish in my question of tasty carnivores. Dunno, eating sea criters just doesn't do it for me like eating land aminals.

Maybe it's all those tiny little bones you have to check for while you're chomping, just so you don't choke to death.

I have eaten lots of different kinds of fish, and should probably eat more to keep the ticker from clogging up, but they're pretty much just a pain 'cause you always get that freakin' tiny little bone no matter how well they've been prepared.

Maybe it's the idea that they live in water, then wiz and poop in the same water. I've never understood how fishies could get away with that and not get some nasty diseases, except maybe they swim away from the excrement really fast, and it all drops to the bottom. That old adage "don't poop where you live" comes to mind...

On the other hand, I love shrimps and similarly easy to eat crustaceans, so I guess the tastiness and ease of consumption blows that phobia outta the water (pun intended).

Experience has taught me that my gut doesn't tolerate (raw) shellfish very well (projectile hurling), unless of course it's had the heck cooked out of it; clam chowda, fried oysters, etc.

So that's my take on fish.

68 posted on 10/07/2004 12:34:25 AM PDT by benjaminjjones
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To: DocRock
hahahaaaa! :^D

69 posted on 10/07/2004 2:10:59 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP (Become a monthly donor on FR. No amount is too small and monthly giving is the way to go !)
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To: evets

"I am an Apteryx-a flightless bird with hairy feathers!"


70 posted on 10/07/2004 2:25:03 AM PDT by WestVirginiaRebel (Whose side would you rather be on? The Moon god worshippers, or people who've been to the Moon?)
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To: Dog Gone
Good catch. There are some structural differences between hair and feathers, though, including the anchoring. IIRC from the "fighting dinosaurs" exhibit in 2000, feather attachments actually leave telltale marks on the skeleton.

Hair did develop from the same structure (scales) as feathers, but it developed in a branch of reptiles (not dinosaurs) that led to mammals and flying reptiles (yes, pteranadon had fur -- at least that's what a few Russian fossils indicate).

71 posted on 10/07/2004 3:41:03 AM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Ciexyz

You want my parrot stuffed? LOL


72 posted on 10/07/2004 5:09:53 AM PDT by stanz (Those who don't believe in evolution should go jump off the flat edge of the Earth.)
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To: Junior
feather attachments actually leave telltale marks on the skeleton.

How could that be? I've never seen a feather on a bird which was attached to the skeleton. Admittedly, my first-hand experience is limited to ducks, quail, doves, and turkeys, but it's hard to imagine that this would ever be the case.

73 posted on 10/07/2004 5:52:50 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

I think there are microscopic attachment points for the muscles controlling feather movement. At least, that's what I got out of that exhibit.


74 posted on 10/07/2004 6:22:32 AM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Junior

Thanks.


75 posted on 10/07/2004 7:29:19 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: jennyp
"The Odo Theory of Evolution is only believed by fundamentalist Christians and Trekkers."

Intelligent people that are more scholarly than you could hope to be, also know it is true. I'm referring to former evolutionists.

But hey, if you want to believe pigs had wings too ... go right ahead. The EVIDENCE does not back it up. It is also NOT a coincidence that ALL prominent evolutionists are atheists.

You can say it is so numerous times however it doesn't make it so. The evidence never has backed up your theories or assertions no matter how many times you chant it or try to vilify people who state otherwise.

76 posted on 10/07/2004 7:34:37 AM PDT by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: Nakatu X; Dog Gone
This is not the first example of "hairy" protofeathers on an obvious dinosaur. Two Chinese dinos, Sinornithosaurus and Sinosauropteryx, have been noted with same, one specimen of the former being in a spectacular state of preservation. Note that some parts of the body covering could be interpreted as simply hair, but others present a truly feathery appearance.

You look at the above and think, "Could be feathers or hair, either one." But let's zoom in on the little cluster near the shoulder.

Looks like the long ostrich feathers you're familiar with on a feather boa if you're a male stripper on weekends, not that I'd know personally.

More pics from the above specimen can be found at the American Museum of Natural History web page on the subject.

77 posted on 10/07/2004 7:38:20 AM PDT by VadeRetro (A self-reliant conservative citizenry is a better bet than the subjects of an overbearing state. -MS)
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To: PatrickHenry
...helping to preserve the soft, feathery outlines.

Too bad they didn't offer a pic to help with the feather vs. fur question.

78 posted on 10/07/2004 7:38:31 AM PDT by mewzilla
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To: VadeRetro

Awesome!


79 posted on 10/07/2004 8:19:35 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: nmh
It is also NOT a coincidence that ALL prominent evolutionists are atheists.

Really, and from what orifice did you pull this "statistic?"

BTW, if there are any prominent evolutionists who are atheists (and I'm sure there are, though I doubt ALL of them are), might it be because of certain Christians' attitudes taht one cannot accept Christianity and evolution? I mean, hell, if you've worked all your life with the evidence and know that evolution happens, and then someone comes along and says you can't believe in God because of this knowledge, might you not feel abandoned by religion and decide it just isn't for you?

I swear, creationists have done more to turn rational people away from God than anything else I can think of. Hence, my contention that creationism is a plot by Satan.

80 posted on 10/07/2004 8:33:58 AM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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