Critics countered on Kerry record of inactive service - Naval Reserve tour is defended

Boston Globe ^ | Michael Kranish

[Cincinatus' Wife]

WASHINGTON -- On Nov. 21, 1969, John F. Kerry made a crucial decision: He wanted to leave active duty in the Navy in order to run for Congress.

"Because various political figures have advised that I move quickly to establish my organization, I respectfully request that I be released from active duty as soon as possible," Kerry, who was serving as an aide to an admiral in Brooklyn, wrote in a memo.

Kerry won early release and was transferred to the Naval Reserve, which the Kerry presidential campaign says required that Kerry do no more than report his whereabouts in case of an emergency call-up. In the past, Kerry has estimated he shaved between two and five months from his active duty; this week, a campaign spokesman said it saved about six weeks.

With the revival of questions about whether President Bush fulfilled his National Guard duty, some of Kerry's critics have begun to focus on what Kerry did in the Naval Reserve, asking why he hasn't released records of his reserve service. The Kerry campaign says that he was on inactive status at the time and did not have to appear for Naval Reserve duty.

"He had no obligation," Kerry spokesman Michael Meehan said.

"The only obligation was that he inform the Navy where he could be reached."....................

[Cincinatus' Wife]

The rules only apply when the Democrats and old media say so.

[fuzzy122]

Authentic Document Proves Kerry in Cambodia

This just discovered by Commissar from FOIA request of official US Navy files:

[Jeff Chandler]

I'd double check those documents, if I were them.

[fuzzy122]

Hey! I just got this popup message!

[GAGOPSWEEPTOVICTORY]

some of Kerry's critics have begun to focus on what Kerry did in the Naval Reserve, asking why he hasn't released records of his reserve service.

Funny, the Kerry critics I see on FR (who have a double-life as political operatives who sinisterly work for Bush while sitting in their pajamas) want sKerry to sign Form 180 to release all of his military records.

Why didn't the Globe mention Form 180?

[maryz]

LOL! Quick -- send this to Dan Rather; it will save him!

[Cincinatus' Wife]

***Kerry run for election to the U.S. House in 1972 during which he found it necessary to suppress reproduction of the cover picture appearing on his own book, The New Soldier. His political opponent pointed out that it depicted several unkempt youths crudely handling an American flag to mock the famous photo of the U.S. Marines at Iwo Jima.***

[ProudVet77]

Kerry spokesman Michael Meehan also still claims Kerry was in Cambodia. Meehan is such an outright liar.

[Jeff Chandler]

them = they

[ambrose]

preemptive damage control...

[rebel_yell2]

Gee, another article by Kranish, Kerry's campaign biographer.

No bias here. Nothing to see.

Move on (.org).

[fuzzy122]

Authentic Document Proves Kerry in Cambodia

This just discovered by Commissar from FOIA request of official US Navy files:

[JLS]

Two points:

1. I think this article about his afirmative obligations is wrong.

2. He also had negative obligations like as a Navy reserve officer not to consort with the enemy.

[maryz]

"Because various political figures have advised that I move quickly to establish my organization,

Even back then, foreign leaders wanted him to be president? WOW!

[fuzzy122]

PLEASE! If you have a few minutes to spend - check out my 9/11 memorial page and turn up your speakers to hear "Have You Forgotten?"

If you don't like the auto-scrolling click here for a none scrolling version of the page.

(It takes awhile to load due to all the pictures and the music.)

Disclaimer: I do NOT make any money off of my site. It's just a place for me to play.
When I can I try to help.

Stay Strong,
Fuzzy122

[Sola Veritas]

This is one of the few times I believe what Three Bandaids says. After I had served almost four year active duty in the Navy (1972-1976), as an enlisted man, I was granted an almost 3 month early release from active duty to start college. The regulations at the time allowed a sailer to be separated from active duty 30 days before beginning college, but not more than 90 days before expiration of your active enlistment. My active duty would have been finished in early Aug of 1972, but I had been already been accepted at a university for the summer semester of 1976 which began in early June. So, I requested and was granted an early release in early May of 76.

Because I had served nearly 4 years, I was not required to serve in the active reserve for my remaining 2 years of military obligation (back then it was a 6 year obligation not 8 as it is today). I did serve voluntarily in a reserve unit for about 10 months after returning home for the extra pay. But it was extremely boring, so I quit. Because I wasn't required to serve in the active reserve they said OK. I spent the rest of my time in the inactive reserve. I didn't have to do anything except let them know where I lived. In July 1978 I had completed my full obligation and was honorably discharged.

So, this one time Kerry is telling the truth. He did not have to do active reserve time - he just had to be available in case of a call up.

[Casloy]

Ok, I can prove that's a forgery. 1969 was one of those years in which there wasn't a 4 January.

Sincerely,

Terry McCaulife

[ProudVet77]

I was enlisted Navy 70-74, and we had a different contract then Kerry. We were regular USN, whereas he was USNR. I have to admit I don't know what his obligation was, but from what I gather he had an active reserve committment. There are some other strange issues like the date of his discharge being 1978. That would make it almost 12 years since his enlistment.
We need more facts. But as W's numbers keep getting better, and F keeps tanking, it seems like the desire to dig deeper is going away.

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Thank you for the LINK fuzzy122.

We remember our brave fellow Americans.

We honor our brave military fighting terrorism.

We will defend the United States of America.

[blanknoone]

That memo is an obvious forgery. We all know that the real one was from Nixon himself!

[Sola Veritas]

"Funny, the Kerry critics I see on FR (who have a double-life as political operatives who sinisterly work for Bush while sitting in their pajamas) want sKerry to sign Form 180 to release all of his military records."

It is late and my mind is a little fuzzy right now. I hope you are trying to be funny and not to denigrate FREEPERS. Whatever, Kerry's reserve time would probably show nothing of interest. If you don't serve in an active reserve unit, there are no records to be kept.

However, I would like to see his full active duty files. I suspect he is suspressing some of his Officer Fitness Reports that weren't that favorable to him - maybe even had open derogatory remarks by the rater. That coming home after three purple hearts really sounds fishy to me. I would guess that it was allowed because his superiors thought him to be a nutcase that might get his men hurt, and jumped on an opportunity to dump him. It is my opinion that every action on his part were never out of heroism but pure desire to make a name for himself (PT109 histronics). Even the pulling Rassman out of the drink. The chasing down of a VC retreating - putting his crew at risk to make a name for himself. That is just my unlearned opinion. However, I knew the type when I was a sailor, and later when I was an officer in the ARNG and Army Reserve.

[fuzzy122]

DOH!

[fuzzy122]

"Thank you for the LINK fuzzy122."

You are very welcome my friend.

Say a prayer for our President and our soldiers!

Stay Strong,
Fuzzy122

[GAGOPSWEEPTOVICTORY]

It is late and my mind is a little fuzzy right now. I hope you are trying to be funny and not to denigrate FREEPERS.

I was using literary license and was being sarcastic as to how the DNC and their buddies at See BS are claiming Howlin, Buckhead, and KC Tanker were these omnipotent political operatives while at the same time were working in their pajamas. No insult was intended towards any FReepers.

My insult was directed at the Times' favorite sister paper -- the Boston Globe and how they didn't address the REAL question we want sKerry to answer in their article: What's Kerry hiding by not signing Form 180 and releasing ALL of his military records.

[Sola Veritas]

Heaven help me. The last thing I want to do is defend Three Bandaids. However, Kerry was a commissioned officer. Almost all Naval officers that were commissioned from NROTC or OCS were given reserve commissions - the military is only allowed so many "regular" commissions at any given time - mostly only academy graduates got regular commissions back then as junior officers.

Just because his commission was USNR does not mean he was a Reservist on active duty. He was an active duty officer with a reserve commission (clear as mud right?). Whatever, he would have had an period of obligated active service followed by inactive reserve time until he had 6 years.

I have heard that he didn't get discharged until many years after his six years were up. I think I can explain that from my own experience as a USAR commissioned officer. I had periods where I didn't serve in a guard or reserve unit, but I wasn't discharged. As an officer I had to resign my commission first. He probably never got around to resigning his commission until he came into the zone of promotion to full Lieutenant. Because he wasn't participating in an active reserve unit, he would not be selected for promotion. When he was passed over twice he was honorably discharged. To summarize, officers have to resign from the reserve after their obligation is fulfilled - discharge is not automatic.

[Sola Veritas]

"No insult was intended towards any FReepers."

I thought that was probably the case. However, sitting here in my underwear (I don't wear pajamas) late at night with insomia, I am a little slow on the uptake - although I guess I am that way all the time!

[conservative in nyc]

Various FReepers have argued over whether Kerry was obligated to drill after he left active duty. The discussions have gotten heated, but many with military backgrounds have said that he wasn't obligated. The Boston Globe article supports that view.

Of the two experts mentioned by the Boston Globe for support of that position, Larry Korb appears to be a Kerry partisan. He told CBS "Essentially, Bush gamed the system to avoid serving his country the way that most of his contemporaries had to." Despite serving in the Reagan Administration, Mr. Korb is a Fellow with the liberal think tank, Center for American Progress. In an July 28, 2004 CNN interview, Lou Dobbs characterized him as someone who "calls President Bush a draft dodger and says John Kerry would undoubtedly make a better war time President." He was also tangentially involved in the liberal flap over whether President Bush was entitled to be wearing a ribbon in this left-wing blog. He seems to be the liberals go-to-guy on the Bush AWOL story, since he served at DoD under President Reagan. I don't know why Korb didn't tell Michael Kranish he's a Kerry partisan. He clarly is.

The other expert, Stephen Keith hasn't been cited in many articles, according to Google News.

[patriciamary]

That's the wrong approach RNC should say how can you use an old story,create new lies ,in order to distract from the facts that Kerry has lied about his service, over 200 of his crew mates have stated that ,and did far worse when he came home and betrayed his fellows soldiers and the proof is his own words,turn this around and put Kerry back on the defensive where he belongs!Lets go Bush team get to work!

[Cincinatus' Wife]

As Lyndon Johnson would say, "Hell, I don't want him to prove it, I just want to hear him deny it."

[Cincinatus' Wife]

...and put Kerry back on the defensive where he belongs!

Bump!

[christie]

.
Good one!

Still adding to the John F. Kerry Timeline. More scandals that one person should be allowed to have.
.

[tbeatty]

Kerry's own records say he wasn't on inactive reserve. He was active for a number of years.

From his service record
Inducted Feb, 1966
OCIU-2 Aug, 1966
DOR as Ensign Dec 1966
DOR as LT(jg) Jun 1968
DOR as LT, USNR Jan 1970
Release from Active Duty/xfr to Active Reserve Jan 1970
xfr to Standby reserve July 1972
Discharged Feb 1978


And it's all here:

http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/Service_Record.pdf

[fuzzy122]

"Good one!"

Thank You. Please Spread the word!!

Here is a link to page I put together full of video and audio links.

The Swiftvets news conference on C-SPAN can be found here.

"Stolen Honor" video clips are at the top.

An interview of Steve Gardner (the gunner that served under Kerry) is next and then the Swiftvets.com ads

There are many other links.

If you have a few minutes to spend - check out my 9/11 memorial page and turn up your speakers to hear "Have You Forgotten?"

Arm yourself with ALL the facts. Then enlighten someone else - spread the knowledge.

Disclaimer: I do NOT make any money off of my site. It's just a place for me to play.
When I can I try to help.

Stay Strong,
Fuzzy122

[AmericanVictory]

That must explain why he no longer felt he had to uphold the Constitution and was free to consort with and assist the enemy, non? His morality, honor and integrity were inactive and no longer required.

[AmericanVictory]

That must explain why he no longer felt he had to uphold the Constitution and was free to consort with and assist the enemy, non? His morality, honor and integrity were inactive and no longer required.

[ProudVet77]

If you don't mind getting the cooties you can read his officer candidate contract at
http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/Officer_Candidate_Agreement.pdf

The relevant statments is page 1, item 4, 2nd sentance.
"Service in the Ready Reserve will be for a period which when added to his active duty will total five years"

I WANT KERRY'S RESERVE RECORDS!

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Thank you for the LINK!

[conservative in nyc]

Ping

[conservative in nyc]

I'm far from an expert on what his discharge from active duty actually meant and how closely Naval Reservists were held to the letter of their service contracts in 1970. I've pinged people from similar threads to maybe get an answer to that question.

Like you, I want Kerry to SIGN STANDARD FORM 180 and release ALL of his military records. (While he's at it, Kerry should release his medical records, and force Mrs. Heinz-Kerry to release her tax returns.)

[ProudVet77]

I figure if the media can make a big deal over W's being absent during the summer/early fall while he was helping in an election in AL, two years of Kerry not attending reserve meetings is worth a look.
Even if he did not have to attend reserve training, in which case I would want to see the note from his mother excusing him, he was active in anti-war activites during the 2 years after his discharge, which is while he was in the Ready Reserve. I believe that is considered treason.

[Arrowhead1952]

With the scrutiny Bush's service in the Texas National Guard has had by the F'ing campaign and the CBS Dan Ra^ther Memogate, I think F'ing should release all his military records as well.

[kabar]

I have no problem with the story. Unfortunately, there have been many reports, including on FR, that Kerry missed drills, etc. This is an easy charge to counter as Kranish did. However, there is a question about what Kerry did while in a reserve status, including meeting with the Vietnamese Communists in Paris at least twice. He also attended the infamous meeting in Kansas City as a member of the VVAW and discussed the assassination of US political leaders.

[Tacis]

MAYBE!! Sure, it could happen this way. But the are some puzzles; why did it take to 1978 to issue a discharge, where are the missing documents, are the multiple Citations forgeries ,too, and most important (especially if all is as innocent as the Traitor says), why hasn't simply released his records, if there is nothing to hide, then was is he hiding it?

No, I believe (and, in the absence of honesty from the anti-American candidate and FREE to hypothesize) that the Navy was so pi**ed at Kerry's treason that they court martialed him, maybe not for treason, but for something they could easily prove, faking reports, homosexual activity, boinking some honey in Cam Ranh Bay who was a Viet Cong spy, and so on.

If Kerry has nothing terrible and evil to hide, then was is he hiding it?

[Radix]

You made me spill my coffee! Laughing out Loud, thanks.

[Soaring Feather]

bump

[AndyJackson]

Re Kerry's reserve status - please for God Sakes drop this. Please please please. He had no drillint obligation. Absolutely none whatsoever. It is not that the rules were not applied to Kerry. The rules were. Under the rules, he had completed an active service obligation (that is what a DD 214 means) and therefore had no drilling obligation. Period. We here at FR have been over and over and over and over this one.

Don't create distraction that can be refuted easily, letting the dems attention wander off of the forgeries and SBVs.

Please leave the issues about military affairs to the military experts around here and stop trying to second guess it. Doing just this is exactly how the DNC got itself in a wringer.

[dilpo]

After 2 years active duty I served 4 years in the INACTIVE ready reserve and was honorably discharged Sept. 16, 1966. In the INACTIVE ready reserve there were no meetings, no drills, nothing. I never wore a uniform or got near a training site in that time. But as a ready reservist was subject to recall to active duty which almost happened during the Cuban Missle Crisis. Also I was an enlisted man (E-3 at discharge), not an officer.

[austingirl]

Your memorial page is wonderful. I have spent this morning alternately praying, weeping, and Freeping. It helps to belong to the community of Free Republic.

[SERKIT]

"The only obligation was that he inform the Navy where he could be reached."....................

Dear Navy People:

I will be going to France to meet with the enemy and see what I can do to guarantee victory to those poor people.

By the way, I committed war crimes myself, and I know the names of those who also committed crimes, but since I feel the war is wrong, I'm not going to report them. I will wait until I have an audience in Congress to talk about that issue.

Oh, while I'm writing to you, can you please add some flowery words to those medals you gave me, and, I know you have never done before, but can you add a "V" to that one medal? When I throw my medals over the fence, I want some good velocity and aerodynamics so they go really far. The V might act like a wing. I'm going to throw 6, 7, 8, or 9 of them, I don't know....

I'm planning on being president one day, so please vote for me when I run.

Thank you,

John Forgery Kerry

[fuzzy122]

"You made me spill my coffee!...

Well then my work is done here!

Beam me up, Scotti!

Stay Strong,
Fuzzy122