65 years on: Tales from invaded Poland

BBC News ^ | Septebmer 1, 2004 | Liam Allen

[lizol]

"Poland's defeat of the Soviet Union in that war helps to explain why the Soviets were eager to help Nazi Germany partition it".

I think you're right about it.

"and took Kiev"
Yes, but only for a short time and without intension of keepieng it. It was supposed to be the capital city of independent Ukraine.
And became one, but of the Ukrainian Soviet Republic.

[Lukasz]

You know that if you really want to attack someone you will always find a reason to do it. For example first polish-german war was in 972 and what is the reason why they came back so many times? You always find a reason.

[Lukasz]

They fought not only in Ukraine, also in Belarus, Lithuanian and Latvian lands. Interesting story is that Latvian government ask our leader for help to free Latvian city Dinaburg occupied by Bolsheviks and Poles without any benefits for Poland liberated the city and gave it to Latvia.

[Grzegorz 246]

"...his ambition being to establish a Federation of allied states in Central Europe in order to block Soviet imperialistic ambition.
In alliance with Ukrainian Hetman Symon Petlura the Poles took Kiev..."

It's from your source.

"It doesn't really matter who was fighting whom -- the fact remains that the Poles invaded Ukrainian territory, and took Kiev. "

According to this logic we could say that in 44 US soldiers invaded French territory and took Paris.

[r9etb]

Sigh..... We're merely talking about whether the Polish were actually within the territorial boundaries of the Ukraine, or not. They were. The Russians invaded them back, and were defeated outside of Warsaw.

And that's all I'm saying. I'm not interested in who was right, wrong, or painted purple.

[Grzegorz 246]

We are always right :-)

[r9etb]

According to this logic we could say that in 44 US soldiers invaded French territory and took Paris.

Well... That's exactly what we did (with some help from the British).

[Grzegorz 246]

OK, but for me this is a little strange way of thinking. I think that France was rather liberated, not invaded.

[r9etb]

I think that France was rather liberated, not invaded.

French territory (under German occupation) was indeed invaded, and Paris (under German occupation) was indeed taken.

In fact, it sounds rather similar to what was going on with Poland in the Ukraine... ;-)

[Grzegorz 246]

OK you're right, let's end this impressing discussion :-)

[r9etb]

OK you're right, let's end this impressing discussion :-)

Sounds good to me. ;-)

[macel]

With the outbreak of hostilities in February 1919, the Polish-bolshevik war started, however both sides of the conflict committed minor forces. Pi³sudski did not want to start an offensive against Bolshevik Russia, as he did not want to help the anti-communist forces, who did not support the independence of Poland.

In April 1920, Pi³sudski signed an alliance with Ukraine under the leadership of Simon Petlura, where Poland passed to Ukraine its rights to the right bank of the Dnepr river up to the 1772 border, in exchange for cession of Galicia and Volhynia to Poland. Subsequently the allied Polish and Ukrainian armies under Pi³sudski's and Petluras's leadership launched a successful preemptive attack against the Russian army in Ukraine, pushing back the Red Army and liberating Kyiv. However, his plan to install a working government of Ukraine failed.

The Soviets launched a long prepared attacked in Belorussia, soon also counter-attacking in Ukraine, reconquering Ukraine and advancing through Poland. Pi³sudski's supporters claim that it was thanks to his command that the overwhelming bolshevik forces were defeated in the Battle of Warsaw (known to Poles as the Miracle on the Vistula River). Others point at foreign support (Marshall Foch assisted Poland) and the role of the government, presided by Wincenty Witos.

The final Treaty of Riga (1921) forced by Pi³sudski's political opponents gave Belarus with Minsk to Russia, that together with incorporation of Central Lithuania after referendum of 1922, made Poland more like a national state, in opposition to Pi³sudski's aim of restoring a Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth as a federal country including all Central European nations.

from wikipedia.org