Posted on 08/06/2004 8:03:31 AM PDT by churchillbuff
Stop with the Hillary/Keyes comparisons already (like in the linked oped in the newspaper, the Pantagraph). Hillary was on a POWER TRIP -- she pushed local candidates (Lowy and Andrew Cuomo) to the side so she could have the prize for herself. IN CONTRAST, AMBASSADOR KEYES IS RESPONDING TO A CALL FOR HELP FROM AN IMPERILED ILLINOIS REPUBLICAN PARTY. He's on a rescue mission. True, the media in Illinois don't like his decision, they don't want him showing up with a life-preserver - - - but why should he agree with them that the local GOP should be allowed to drown? CONGRATULATIONS, AMBASSADOR KEYES. YOU'VE SHOWN A SENSE OF DUTY BY RESPONDING TO A CALL FOR HELP.
Did any of these papers that are criticizing Keyes' rescue mission, criticize Hillary's power play?
I pray for a miracle for the fine folks of Illinois. And, Dr. Keyes would be a start.
Let me also remind you of this---which KEYES should know, because he is a brilliant man---the PURPOSE of the senate is to protect the states. The purpose of the House is to protect the people. That is why it is doubly important for a senator to be FROM THE STATE he or she supposedly represents.
Is Obama pro-abortion? Because of all the good press he's getting, I'm assuming (Without any other evidence) that he is. If so, it'll give Dr. Keyes a big opening for some rhetorical fireworks. Abortion is Keyes' front-center moral issue - and he'll get a chance to ask a black man if Planned Parenthood should be allowed to abort the next generation of black people.
The media didn't complain. They also didn't complain when Bobby Kennedy did it. But they're already beefing about Keyes - - even though he's coming at the request of the local party (which makes it very different from Hillary's ego trip)
Or there is always Clinton's line, as Howlin suggested. LOL! "Because I can." Of course, only Clinton with his media backup singers could get by with such a flippant statement.
Alan Keyes is playing by the rules and like you said did not push anyone aside to get in the race. As many of you know I am not an Alan Keyes supporter, but I thank him for getting in the race to at least give the GOP a shot at winning.
Don't see how anyone can criticize him when he is playing by the rules that Illinois has on the books. If they don't like it, change the rules. If I remember right, the Illinois RATs toyed with Hillary Clinton before she chose NY to run. There is no comparison in the two -- Hillary leveraged where she could get the highest profile IMHO and chose NY. What about Bobby Kennedy -- did the same thing.
What's different then the candidate that moves to a State specifically to run. Happens all the time but most are not this high profile. Al Gore might as well have been a carpetbagger in TN when he ran for as little time as he spent in the State. Carpetbagger is a joke anymore the way people move around anyways.
The Chicago media will do and say anything to take down Alan Keyes and clear the way for Obama IMHO. Having a conservative represent Illinois would drive the Chicago machine nuts!
I feel sorry for the citizens of Illinois that they need “rescued”. If the GOP is such disarray in Illinois that they need to draft Alan Keyes (with all due respect) they are in BIG TIME trouble. There should be no reason the party can’t find a good candidate in state. Obviously they are afraid of Osmama. And speaking as a former resident of the great state of Illinois, I feel sorry for them.
I like Keyes, he is a fighter & gamer, but he is the sacrificial lamb in this race.
Good luck Alan.
Keyes was invited, the bitch slimed in on her own
What is Alan Keyes' position on our Iraq campaign? Is Keyes an appeaser like you?
It's still carpetbagging. And it stinks of racial tokenism.
Agreed, these are two different situations entirely.
I've never seen you argue for invading Cuba. So I guess you're pro-Castro, an "appeaser" of the communists in Cuba. Sheesh.
What's his position on the Iraq campaign?
Carpet bagging is carpet bagging. Keyes has never lived there, he shouldn't run for office there.
We owe Keyes a big debt of thanks.
Not only did Herself barge into New York State, a native New Yorker (Nita Lowery) was bumped from the ticket to make room for Herself.
Dr. Alan Keys pushes no one to the side. He comes, at invitation, to face an upstart with no experience outside the Chicago political machine.
Barack Obama, like John Edwards, overstates the humble beginnings and upbringing by an obscure unknown of a father. Obama's father was a college student from Kenya, who met and married a white woman from Kansas. By all reports, Obama's father was little more than a sperm donor, and Barack's childhood was spent in Indonesia and Hawaii, raised by a stepfather. Barack Obama misses out on all the essential history of American blacks, which is to be descended from slaves and the child (or grandchild) of Mississippi sharecroppers. Not once did he have to endure the sight of a lynching or church burning.
Nah, I ain't buying it. Alan, you should have known better.
The best part of Mr. Keyes running in the birthplace of Hillry Rotten Clinton is that the DNC will be forced to spend her money...... This is great!!!!
Obama's pro-abortion. Keyes will stuff the issue down Obama's throat, figuratively speaking, of course.
The original purpose of the Senate was to protect the States. Ever since the 17th Amendment was enacted, this is no longer true.
Obama is being groomed and positioned for national office as "the true face of black America". What he really represents is another clintonesque stealth candidate, supposedly a moderate/centrist, but in reality a functional leftist. Like Clinton he possesses the charisma and eloquence to charm, soothe and reassure the voters into dropping their guard while he and his party continue implementing their leftist agenda.
For this reason alone it is important to have an equally intelligent and eloquent black candidate such as Keyes, who is also a true Constitutionist and conservative, oppose him in public debate, and to do it now, and not allow the media to create, without challenge, a "Mythos of Obama".
If it is important to have an "intelligent black" on the ticket, it would then be doubly important to have an ILLINOIS "intelligent black" there, otherwise you are saying there is no such person in the state.
I read Obama was cutting a trip short to my home state to Mississippi this week where he was seeking campaign money. It seems to me if you can speak to people outside your state you are running in, outsiders can run also.
Come on church. "Everybody does it" is exactly what we fought against in the Clinton years. Let's not do it now. This is wrong, wrong, wrong. You know it, I know it, and Keyes better know it.
You know that doesn't wash. Let me rephrase: seems to me that Bill Clinton was having oral sex in the White House. If he can do it, we can too.
EXCELLENT point.
The point is this:
IT AINT CARBETBAGGING IF YOU ARE INVITED BY THE LOCALS!
What Keyes is doing is at the behest of Illinois republicans.
I like the analogy - this IS a rescue mission.
"I've never seen you argue for invading Cuba. So I guess you're pro-Castro, an "appeaser" of the communists in Cuba. Sheesh."
hmmm (starts rubbing chin) ... it is tempting ...
Anyway. God Speed Alan Keyes!
If you support him, send him money so he has a shot.
-- Alan Keyes, March 2000
I would think such strongly held philosophical beliefs would apply regardless of the differences between Hillary's decision to run in New York and this one. It's obvious Keyes has sold himself out.
Look, Obama is a Socialist.
Keyes is a conservative.
If you care a *whit* about Federalism, the choice is trivial.
saying 'oh, I'm a federalist, so I can't vote for a pro-Constitution candidate who happens to have been in a different state before he got drafted by my state's party to run for office ... well, that's beyond nitpicky'.
Get over it, let's support Keyes in unity and try to win.
Obama is a leftist, and is wrong for the USA and Illinois.
Obama could be the deciding vote that votes down a judicial conservative to the US Supreme Court.
He could be the 50th vote to stop tax cuts, to support amnesty for illegals, to gut tort reform, and to further ruin education with liberal policies on education and an anti-school-choice agenda.
Residency is in the noise compared to the real issues at stake here.
Main Entry: car·pet·bag·ger
Pronunciation: -"ba-g&r
Function: noun
Etymology: from their carrying all their belongings in carpetbags
1 : a Northerner in the South after the American Civil War usually seeking private gain under the reconstruction governments
2 : OUTSIDER; especially : a nonresident or new resident who meddles in politics
It doesn't how you "dress it up," it is what it is.
The only way to stop this silly parsing on Keyes' behalf is to cop to it.
Haven't seen this mentioned, but at the very least, whether Keyes wins or not, he will engage Obama in debate and keep Obama from gliding in to the Senate. I'm all for making the candidates pop a sweat gland instead of enjoying a coronation.
So who do you propose? This says nothing about there not being other intelligent people, good republicans, black conservatives, whatever, in Illinois. This is about the Illinois Republican party saying this is the best candidate.
It's a choice for Illinois.
Look, the play's been made, the call has gone out. your complaints are a day late and dollar short.
There is nothing inherently wrong with Illinois GOP choosing Keyes. The question is one of representation:
Can he represent the people of Illinois.
Fact is that he can do it better than Obama, but will
have to make that case.
residency is a small issue compared with the larger question of political philosophy etc.
I'm for winning within the rules. The rules in this case were devised by the FOUNDERS who had NO INTENTION that outsiders come in and "run" to "represent" people of another state.
Do you realize what you are opening the door to? Any sports icon/Hollywood celebrity who has 10 years' worth of free advertising descending on, say, Montana and "rescuing" the state. Nope, it's wrong.
Agreed. I'm the first one to attack "one issue" people in order to win, but this is flaunting the very essence of the Constitution. And it sets a VERY dangerous precedent.
I'm not FROM Illinois, so I would not presume to tell Illinois Republicans who to nominate . . . EXCEPT that it be one of their own. Is Illinois really so bankrupt of good candidates of ANY color that they cannot find one person to run against Obama? And if he's so "out there," it should be easy to find an opponent.
As I am sure you know, I am accused on a daily basis of being a BushBot and of making excuses for everything Bush does, a charge I probably deserve.
That being said, I cannot tell you how much I have enjoyed watching THIS issue progress; the parsing and spinning done by Keyes' defenders on this issue has been such a joy to watch.
Keyes' statement about Hillary wasn't a rhetorical question; it was a declarative statement. He needs to cop to his change of policy and move on.
It greatly lowers my estimation of Keyes. Previously I have argued that he would never run for any position he could actually WIN, because that would force him to ACT---to vote, and, more important, to make compromises (as every politician has to do). This would destroy his "sainted" image in the minds of many people. Hence, for him, this is a completely safe move. He doesn't need to worry about winning.
Exactly. I am a firm believer that people from other states shouldn't tell people who to select as their candidate; I certainly wouldn't want anybody messing around in North Carolina (although I wish somebody had warned us about Edwards......LOL)
All that being said, don't try to get us to go along with this "it's not the same." It is.
We had this same thing with Elizabeth Dole; and it was a little different with her; she was actually born and lived in North Carolina, and owns a home and property here; she came and stayed here with her mother in Salisbury at least twice a year. We just had to accept the fact that she hadn't lived here in years and go on from there; we didn't try to say she WASN'T a carpetbagger.
Well, my thoughts are along those lines, too, but that's not what this is about.
It's up to the Illinois people to decide what to do.
But they can't force us to ignore what he's done.
Carpetbagging I agree with but how is it racial tokenism. I voted for keys in the primary most conservatives would pick him over most of the candidates in either party..
Yes, the difference between Ambassador Keyes and The Beast are legitimate. He was asked by the state's party to run, whereas she was not. But there is also another legitimate comparison to make: Keyes is entering the race without special court decisions overturning state election laws, unlike what the Dem'Rats did in New Jersey with Torricelli. But who are we to inject truth and historical fact into the 'Rat Media's hatchet job?
Just can't make you purists happy.
LOL...
I think I stepped into parallel dimension or something. ;-)
But seriously, these arguments are amazingly parochial and petty.
I hope the Dems base their hopes on the same thin reed.
No. Ambassador Keyes was asked by the state GOP to run, unlike Hillary. Also, no court decisions overturning election laws are necessary, as was in New Jersey when Torricelli was replaced after the deadline. Illinois' election laws state that a candidate must have a residence by election day; therefore, they don't seem too picky about outsiders moving in and running for office.
Regarding racial tokenism, that's your opinion. There is no doubt, however, that Keyes has the intelligence and experience to serve in the Senate. What is Obama-nation's experience? State senator! Usually that is not the normal stepping stone to the U.S. Senate, unless the state 'Rat party wanted a light-skinned, sorta-black guy who was passable to whites to be its candidate.
Every case is different: In this case, Keyes didnt come in and run, he was drafted by the party. They are saying he is their man to represent them, and I think we should support that. I am sure they took the residency question into account, and truly it is only an issue if the voters say it is an issue.
And besides, 'carpetbagger' is a pejorative used by racist southerners against people coming into their states to help blacks, improve things and engage in entrepreneurship. It's like the iraqi 'resistance' talking about 'occupiers'.
Is there really a problem with an 'outsider' coming in to help in a case where the locals ASK FOR HELP?!?
I for one have no problem with where people grew up or came from, so long as they COME TO HELP.
KEYES IS COMING TO HELP. JMHO.
"Is Illinois really so bankrupt of good candidates of ANY color that they cannot find one person to run against Obama?"
What a dumb question! have you been following their travials and troubles?!? have you not noticed them flailing about looking for a viable candidate?
If you know a better candidate, name him/her. I am just releived they picked a real conservative republican and not that Democrat Barthwell, that would have been a real farce.
Now, I for one think Oberweis, the runnerup in the primary, should have been given the nod. But there were some issues there, claims he was demanding $$$ to jump in that the party didnt have ... and Ditka would have been great, sad that didnt click ...
but here we are 90 days, clock is ticking.
They made their call. It's done.
LET'S SUPPORT THEM. LET'S SUPPORT KEYES. HE'S A BETTER CHOICE THAN OBAMA.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.