Libertarian Party worries over tally (Pedophile Rights Candidate May Win)

San Jose Mercury News ^ | Thu, Mar. 11, 2004 | Dan Stober

[nickcarraway]

Personal liberties are the hallmark of the Libertarian Party, but party leaders are fretting that a Mountain View man convicted of a sex-related crime is just a few votes from becoming their candidate for a state Senate seat this fall.

[NYCVirago]

Webster, also a software engineer, has been long active in local Libertarian politics, where he is tolerated, despite his 1990 conviction and his beliefs about children and sex. ``He has his exotic opinions. That's his privilege as an American. I'm not inclined to blackball him on the basis of that,'' said Allen Rice, the Libertarian candidate in another state Senate race, District 11. Rice added that he did not always agree with Webster.

Disgusting.

[Mr. Mojo]

I don't know who's sicker, the Libertarian pedophile (Webster) or the other Libertarian candidate (Rice) who called Webster's opinions "exotic."

The 1% (at best) party just keeps a-rollin' on.

[Texasforever]

Well he isn't blue.

[samtheman]

Big step up for the Libertarian party. They can get the NAMBLA vote.

[nopardons]

btt

[Catspaw]

Yup, it could be worse. At least he's not The Blue Guy.

[jim_trent]

From the description, it looks like he is a typical Libertarian (totally nuts and a danger to others).

[FierceDraka]

Oh, Lord.

It's because of lunacy like this that made me drop the Libertarian Party in favor of the Republicans.

REAL Republicans, that is, as opposed to the RINO variety.

[sharktrager]

Libertarian Party worries over tally

MAN JAILED FOR CRIME CLOSE IN SENATE PRIMARY VOTE

By Dan Stober

Mercury News


Personal liberties are the hallmark of the Libertarian Party, but party leaders are fretting that a Mountain View man convicted of a sex-related crime is just a few votes from becoming their candidate for a state Senate seat this fall.

With absentee ballots still being counted nine days after the primary, perennial candidate John Webster -- who told the Mercury News he believes it's beneficial for children to have sex with adults -- is two votes behind software engineer Mike Laursen.

One of the men will carry the Libertarian Party banner Nov. 2 in the Senate District 13 race against the heavily favored Democrat, Elaine Alquist, and Republican Shane Patrick Connolly. The district covers much of Santa Clara County.

Laursen has a 270-268 vote lead with the final absentee and provisional ballots to be counted next week.

``My No. 1 goal: damage control for the party,'' said Laursen, who lives in Mountain View.

He doesn't expect a Libertarian to beat Alquist in November. He simply jumped into the race to keep Webster -- who's already run two unsuccessful campaigns on the Libertarian ticket -- from tainting the party's image. Laursen won the endorsement of local party leaders and is somewhat puzzled by the close race.

Webster, also a software engineer, has been long active in local Libertarian politics, where he is tolerated, despite his 1990 conviction and his beliefs about children and sex.

``He has his exotic opinions. That's his privilege as an American. I'm not inclined to blackball him on the basis of that,'' said Allen Rice, the Libertarian candidate in another state Senate race, District 11. Rice added that he did not always agree with Webster.

Webster, 58, was arrested in 1990 in a sting operation. After he responded to an ad in Swingers Digest magazine, he told an undercover San Jose policewoman that he wanted her to teach one of his young family members about sex while he had sex with another, according to court documents. He pleaded no contest to a felony charge of child pandering and was sentenced to a year in jail, court documents say.

Webster claims he was entrapped and convicted for a ``thought crime.''

Fifteen years later, he remains obsessed with the case and the undercover officer. He maintains an extensive Web site and acknowledged in an interview that he has gone to the officer's home, attempted to photograph her and handed out fliers in her neighborhood.

He has also driven a large truck-mounted sign -- alleging she is a ``bad cop'' -- around the Santa Clara County Hall of Justice and the San Jose Police Department for hours at a time. The city eventually obtained a restraining order that prohibits him from going near the officer.

The Libertarian Party argues for personal freedom and limited government control over drugs, personal property, freedom of speech and sex -- but only among adults.

Webster said that in his eyes a child has the moral right to make personal decisions whenever he or she ``stands up and says I'm going to live the life I want to live.''

He maintained that teenagers should be allowed to engage in sex with parents, adult neighbors or people they've met on the Internet.

``All of that is totally contradicted by our beliefs and our platform,'' said George Getz, director of communications for the national Libertarian Party headquarters in Washington.

``There is a word for what adults do when they have sex with underage children: child molestation. It's a crime and it ought to be. We're very clear on that.''

Twice before, Webster has been the Libertarian candidate in the same Senate district. He lost by large margins both times.

Mark Hinkle, the immediate past state chairman of the Libertarian Party and the coordinator of this weekend's state convention in San Jose, has known Webster for years.

``John's a fairly decent guy,'' Hinkle said. ``But frankly we'd prefer that he not run again

[The Libertarian Dude]

Really? I don't consider myself or any other libertarians I know to be "nuts" or a danger to others. The guy in question? He would've been shown the door by my local party.

EVERY party has their own shameful examples. Look at LaRouche - well, whatever party he CLAIMS to be part of; we don't want him.

[ServesURight]

LOL! The LP is a joke, aren't they?

Don't get me wrong - they got some good ideas. But they keep letting themselves get portrayed as a bunch of dopers and porn lovers. I don't know why they just don't disband and work within the GOP.

[The Libertarian Dude]

I was told once by this moron who said the LP should be forcibly disbanded because we're "a threat to the nation".
With that kind of thinking, one wonders if he was really a liberal in disguise.

But, why should we disband? Why should there be only TWO parties?

This country was founded on, among other things, competition. Politics is a business, as well as a messy, disgusting activity which usually draws out the bottom feeders of society, but that's beside the point.

Suppose we only had two companies in the U.S.: One provides Goods, and the other provides Services. Who are you going to complain to when you receive shoddy Goods or rotten Service? They're the only games in town! They've got it locked up... you have to deal with them, and their "Customer Service Representatives" aren't going to listen; they'll just go through the motions.

The government is employed by us, not the other way around.

[jim_trent]

> Really? I don't consider myself or any other libertarians
> I know to be "nuts" or a danger to others.

You wouldn't, would you.

I am just going by the ones I know. I have posted about them before. One broke off from the local Nebraska Conservatives club because they weren't "pure" enough from him. He then proclaimed himself to be a Libertarian. He sued the local school board for charging is daughter to go to a Friday night football game. He said "edukation is 'possed to be free". Lucky for conservatives he severed ties with us before he was arrested, convicted, and is now serving time for child pornography. The Libertarians on this board defended him and suggested that he was framed by the Government even though he was turned in by his own family.

Another local guy I did not know personally, but read a lot about him and saw the buildings he bought. He was a slumlord. Every building he owned eventually had to be torn down by the City because he did not spend one single penny for maintenance as long as he owned them. If you have ever owned a house you know that maintenance is NOT optional. Anyway, he ran for governor, senator, representative, city councilman, and (several times) mayor as a Libertarian. Again, Libertarians here defended his use of thugs to break arms and legs in order to collect rent from people in condemned buildings.

One thing I have learned here is no matter how venal a person is or how low his actions, all he has to do is say he is a Libertarian and the Libertarians here will defend him.

[sinkspur]

Suppose we only had two companies in the U.S.: One provides Goods, and the other provides Services.

Well, given its effectiveness, and to continue with your analogy, the Libertarians will get the janitorial contract to both companies.

[dighton]

Webster, 58, was arrested in 1990 in a sting operation. After he responded to an ad in Swingers Digest magazine, he told an undercover San Jose policewoman that he wanted her to teach one of his young family members about sex while he had sex with another, according to court documents. He pleaded no contest to a felony charge of child pandering and was sentenced to a year in jail, court documents say.

.....

``He has his exotic opinions. That's his privilege as an American. I'm not inclined to blackball him on the basis of that,'' said Allen Rice, the Libertarian candidate in another state Senate race, District 11.

.....

Mark Hinkle, the immediate past state chairman of the Libertarian Party and the coordinator of this weekend's state convention in San Jose, has known Webster for years.

``John's a fairly decent guy,'' Hinkle said. ``But frankly we'd prefer that he not run again."

[The Libertarian Dude]

Well, at least it won't be at taxpayers' expense, there wouldn't be a need for a government bureaucracy overseeing janitorial procedures, and we wouldn't need a Constitutional amendment to prohibit deviant janitorial activities.

But, by all means, let's just stick with the two-party fiasco. In fact, if more than two parties is bad, why not just have one?

God, I'm feeling cynical today...

[The Libertarian Dude]

Well, *I* wouldn't defend ANY libertarian who does such things. There's twisted, and there's going over the edge.

We're not all freaks. There's enough of those in the major parties to go around. Just look at the drooling masses tagging along behind Kerry, or both of Kucinich's voters.


Or Hillary.

[Conservative til I die]

The Libertarian Party will never become a viable option until they remove the kooks and weirdos from the party. They have to get rid of these folks and the spokespeople who tolerate their "exotic" opinions.

[Conservative til I die]

From the description, it looks like he is a typical Libertarian (totally nuts and a danger to others).

Moderator, please remove this libelous statement. Jim Trent is referring to libertarians as pedophilies.

[Conservative til I die]

But you'd have to admit the libertarians can do more damage as a part of the Republican Party. There are plenty of libertarian Republicans out there already, myself included.

[Conservative til I die]

One thing I have learned here is no matter how venal a person is or how low his actions, all he has to do is say he is a Libertarian and the Libertarians here will defend him.

So basically you know one nut Libertarian and know *of* one other. And that qualifies you to basically equate every libertarian with pedophiles.

You are an absolute tool.

I wonder if you use the same stereotyping when it comes to race.

BTW, no one here is defending the guy.

[tutstar]

It doesn't say a lot for the Libertarians does it?

[tpaine]

One thing I have learned here is no matter how venal a person is or how low his actions, all he has to do is say he is a Libertarian and the Libertarians here will defend him.
14 -trent-


______________________________________

BS.

Although many of us have learned, -- no matter how venal a person is or how low his actions, -- all he has to do is say he is an anti-libertarian and many of the rest of FR's clowns & weirdos will pile on to agree with him.

Works both ways, bozo.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

``John's a fairly decent guy,'' Hinkle said. ``But frankly we'd prefer that he not run again

My Sainted Avacados!

Mark Hinkle is another that you would not want to be associated with. A fairly decent guy? I have to wonder where his line is.

[tpaine]

Better yet, put the thread in the backroom where it belongs.

[jim_trent]

The flip side is, all a person has to do is say something bad about a Libertarian and the other Libertarians will pile on. Even if the Libertarian in question is currently in jail for being a pedophile or (in another case) has spent time in jail for hiring thugs to break arms.

"tpaine"; you are right that I don't know many Libertarians. I doubt that many people do. The ones I do know range from "colorful" (which means that they test the limits of the law, but have not yet stepped over the line) to lawbreakers. The two that ended up in jail are the ones that I have posted about before (including links to news articles) and saw many Libertarians here defend sex with children and hiring thugs to physically harm others. I still believe that those things are unacceptable. You obviously believe otherwise.

"die"; go ahead and run to the moderator like you undoubtedly run to mommy whenever someone disagrees with you. Whether you like it or not, the Libertarian-pedophile I was telling you about is now in jail. That is a fact. Nowhere in any of my posts did I say that ALL Libertarians are pedophiles. They just support them. Now, please don't lie about me in your posts in the future. If you do, I won't run to the moderator like you. I will just invite others to read my posts and judge for themselves which one of us lied.

[The Libertarian Dude]

How could libertarians possibly "damage" the Republican party? By reminding the GOP that they should actually BELIEVE themselves, much less back it up, when they say they're for smaller and more fiscally responsible government?

When GW cuts ONE government program, or vetoes ONE spending bill, I'll believe he's even *interested* in cutting the size, scope, and cost of government.

Having said all that, I'm going to waste my vote on him, but the rest of my choices shall go to the people who I think will be the least criminally-minded once in office.
In the past, I've voted for Dems - well, twice, but NEVER for anything above state level, and only because their opponents were shifty (and there were no Libertarians running for those positions) - and a few Republicans. Hell, I voted for Reagan, but once GW Version 1.0 got his mitts on things, that's when I jumped ship on the GOP.

Now, some folks think that because I voted Libertarian, I *actually* voted for Democrats. "Wasted vote" and all that rot. Well, maybe Bob "I'm Bob Dole" Dole and GW 2.0 didn't get my votes, but by God neither did Clinton or Gore. Those two, I wouldn't trust to mow my yard with kiddie scissors.

[The Libertarian Dude]

If you've witnessed "libertarians" defending sex with children, I'd like to know about it. I'll personally break his arms.

I'm kidding. That's illegal. Too bad, but it's illegal.

Now, much as I loathe to bring this up: I was accused of such a thing by a lowlife bastard. He hid behind the anonymity of Family Services, lied through his teeth, and... well, they found me innocent, because I didn't do it. However, they don't find you "innocent"; it's either "the charges were unsubstantiated" or "your ass is guilty". And, to make matters worse, since they keep the person making the claim anonymous, I can't even take him to court for lying about such a heinous crime.

The child's mother and I have known each other for fifteen years. She told Family Services I didn't do this thing, and so did others, because they know me. The child's "father" did this for revenge because he blames ME for their breakup.

It's been a year, and yes, I'm still pissed. Those kinds of charges should NOT be made for revenge. You don't mess with kids that way. You don't make a three-year-old girl go through a pelvic exam because her bastard father has it in for someone.

[The Libertarian Dude]

Oh, forgot this... that guy who falsely claimed that child-touching misdeed? He told Family Services AND the cops that my 13-year-old son ALSO did wrong things. Imagine how hard it was to explain that to him and keep him from hunting the SOB down himself. Good thing he doesn't drive yet. My boy's got a temper and he's a hulk of a kid. Good thing he doesn't fly off the handle - it takes something this serious to get him mad.

It's amazing... Michael Jackson can get away with molesting kids, but some lowlife nutjob can accuse me of the same thing, and I get slapped with a "do not visit" order. Guess money CAN buy you out of trouble, at least for a while...

[tpaine]

Trent, you are a very weird & nasty clown, and you know damn well that no one here is defending/supporting pedophiles. Take your divisive crap to the back room.

[philetus]

LOL! The LP is a joke, aren't they?"


If they weren't before, they are now.

[Conservative til I die]

I meant that the Libertarians could have more impact working within the GOP.

[The Libertarian Dude]

Well, they COULD, if Republicans actually cared about whittling down government growth and spending.

I know, I know... terrorism. But did Bush need to spend that NEA gimme-away arts money? That's not gonna stop terrorists any more than searching the wrong people at airports will. For that matter, searching those people with government-employee screeners won't stop terrorists, either, but did Bush lift a finger to stop Daschle and his buddies from creating MORE Dem voters by unionizing the screeners?

And if we're gonna monkey around with the Constitution, IF we have to pass an amendment banning gay marriage, I would demand another amendment that keeps eminent domain from being misused. Condemning property to make way for a new Wal-Mart is NOT what eminent domain was intended for. (No, I don't hate Wal-Mart.)

[krb]

I don't know who's sicker, the Libertarian pedophile (Webster) or the other Libertarian candidate (Rice)

If you really can't tell the difference between those two individuals, then you are guilty of what you are implying the libertarians are all about.