State Department finds Israel negligent in 1967 ship attack that killed 34 Americans (USS Liberty)

Bakersfield Californian ^ | 1/12/04 | Barry Schweid - AP

[NormsRevenge]

WASHINGTON (AP) - Reviewing documents covering 36 years, the State Department concluded Monday that Israel's attack on the U.S. spy ship Liberty during the 1967 Six Day War was an act of Israeli negligence.

The United States also was negligent, a State Department official said, for failing to notify Israel that the electronic intelligence-gathering ship was cruising international waters off the Egyptian coast and for failing to withdraw the Liberty from the war zone.

A daylong conference that studied fresh documents as well as the established record failed to produce a consensus for any of three views voiced most often: Israel intentionally attacked what it knew to be a ship of the U.S. Navy, the attack was accidental, or the attack resulted from faulty judgment.

Thirty-four Americans were killed in the June 8, 1967, attack, and more than 170 were wounded.

Israel long has maintained that the attack was a case of mistaken identity, an explanation the Johnson administration did not challenge formally. Israel said its forces thought the Liberty was an Egyptian horse carrier, apologized to the United States and paid almost $13 million in compensation, some to victims or their families.

Since the United States did not intercept the order to attack the ship with cannon fire and napalm, precise facts of the attack remain elusive, the State Department official said Monday, speaking on condition of anonymity.

He called the Israeli attack and the U.S. actions a classic example of Murphy's law: "If anything can go wrong, it will."

David Hatch, a technical director at the National Security Agency, said, "The good news is that information long sought by researchers is now out, and the bad news is that it does not settle it."

The occasion for the State Department conference was the release of historical documents about the 1967 war in which Israel defeated the combined forces of Egypt, Syria, Jordan and other Arab countries in six days.

Charles Smith, a professor at the University of Arizona, said in his presentation that Israel should have known the Liberty was an American ship.

"If they didn't know, they didn't try hard enough to find out," he said.

James Bamford, an investigative journalist who has written about the incident, demanded further investigation "instead of people getting up here and giving their opinions."

"There were cover-ups," Bamford said, citing a signed affidavit by retired Navy Capt. Ward Boston, who was a leader of a military investigation into the incident.

Boston said in the affidavit in October that then-President Johnson and Defense Secretary Robert McNamara had told those heading the Navy's inquiry to "conclude that the attack was a case of 'mistaken identity' despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary."

Boston, 80, who did not attend Monday's conference, said the Navy investigators were given only one week but still were able to amass "a vast amount of evidence, including heartbreaking testimony from young survivors."

Accusing Israel of a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and kill its crew, Boston said in a legal declaration in Coronado, Calif., that he was certain the Israeli pilots knew the Liberty, which clearly displayed American flags and had markings in English instead of Arabic, was a U.S. Navy ship.

Additionally, Boston said, "Israeli torpedo boats machine-gunned three lifeboats that had been launched in an attempt by the crew to save the most seriously wounded - a war crime."

Jay Cristol, a U.S. bankruptcy court judge who has written about the incident, cited the finding of the Navy's inquiry as proof the attack was a mistake. "There was no indication they had any knowledge they were attacking a U.S. ship," Cristol told the conference.

[Old Sarge]

Will the Left yell for reparations?

(sounds of crickets)

[HiJinx]

Ties in with your thread on the Liberty late last year...

[Inyokern]

James Bamford, an investigative journalist

James Bamford, a certified idiot.

Bamford was a close friend of Robert Hanssen and claims that he never had any inkling that Hanssen might be a spy.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Israel long has maintained that the attack was a case of mistaken identity, an explanation the Johnson administration did not challenge formally. Israel said its forces thought the Liberty was an Egyptian horse carrier, apologized to the United States and paid almost $13 million in compensation, some to victims or their families.

[mr.pink]

Israel long has maintained that the attack was a case of mistaken identity

I don't know what else they could possibly claim.

Machine gunning the life rafts was a particularly naughty touch.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

True, I was just pointing out that they had paid comp.

[SAMWolf]

Thanks for the ping HiJinx. IMHO, it's still debatable. Too many unanswered questions.

[snippy_about_it]

Thanks Jinxy.

That was a two part series, so many unanswered questions.

The FReeper Foxhole Remembers Attack on the USS LIBERTY - Part I (6/8/1967) - Sep. 8th, 2003

The FReeper Foxhole Remembers Attack on the USS LIBERTY - Part II (6/8/1967) - Sep. 9th, 2003

[FreePaul]

Machine gunning the life rafts was a particularly naughty touch.

They must have mistaken them for landing craft. They thought that the Egyptians were landing horses from the "Horse Carrier."

[Criminal Number 18F]

Bamford was a close friend of Robert Hanssen and claims that he never had any inkling that Hanssen might be a spy.

Well, neither did anybody at the FBI. The CIA figured out that the mole was in the FBI, but the FBI would not believe them, and kept turning the Agency upside down.

d.o.l.

Criminal Number 18F

[novacation]

"Israel had on choice" So you disagree with the claim of the article and claim that it was intentional and justified? That's a comment I've never heard here.

[John H K]

You don't strafe and use napalm on a SHIP for a premeditated, planned attack, btw.

You do if it's a spur of the moment unplanned decision and use whatever aircraft are avaliable with whatever ordnance they happen to be carrying.

[AmericanVictory]

I was very negligent as I strafed them in the water on the return passes, the Israeli pilot said aimlessly.

Ever know a naval aviator that didn't know what kind of ship he was attacking in clear weather?

We predict this extension of the cover-up will fool very few except those who don't want to see the truth.

[albee]

Israel long has maintained that the attack was a case of mistaken identity, an explanation the Johnson administration did not challenge formally. Israel said its forces thought the Liberty was an Egyptian horse carrier, apologized to the United States and paid almost $13 million in compensation, some to victims or their families."

BFD!!! We give the Israelis $2 Billion a year and they pay "reparations" of $13 Million, probably from the welfare dollars we give them!

[cookcounty]

" You don't strafe and use napalm on a SHIP for a premeditated, planned attack, btw."

The NSA drove this boat smack into the middle of a war while the US was telling the Israelis they had no ships in the area. Yes, they charged too hard, but if the innocent wander through a battle, the fact is they are likely to get creamed, as more than a few Iraqis discovered the hard way this past year.

[novacation]

I was referring to your comment. You made a claim the the US ship was giving the Arabs information and the attack on it by Israel was justified. Isn't that what you meant?

[Senator Pardek]

Exposing a "mental fumble" is not allowed here. NO soup for you!

[Thumper1960]

"Negligent" my a$$!

[Thumper1960]

"This incident is closed!! "

This incident is not closed, no matter how much you'll bluster and 'demand' it be so. It will also, never be forgotten.

Count on it. Memories are long and revenge is a dish best served cold.

[novacation]

I was just going out for soup. Damn!

[nkycincinnatikid]

In a further finding by the state department, had the Pacific Fleet been at Myrtle Beach instead of Pearl Harbor in December 1941 a tragic misunderstanding might have been prevented. Specific American regrets to the Chrysanthemum Throne are not however anticipated at this time.

[Inyokern]

Me: "Bamford was a close friend of Robert Hanssen and claims that he never had any inkling that Hanssen might be a spy."

You: "Well, neither did anybody at the FBI. "

Be that as it may, it does not enhance Bamford's credibility as an "investigative journalist."

[John Beresford Tipton]

"It does not enhance Bamford's credibility as an "investigative journalist."

Perhaps, you would like to provide us with a list of all investigative journalists who ever uncovered a US spy ring?

[Inyokern]

Perhaps, you would like to provide us with a list of all investigative journalists who ever uncovered a US spy ring?

Perhaps you would provide a list of investigative journalists who were close friends with spies.

[John H K]

Ever know a naval aviator that didn't know what kind of ship he was attacking in clear weather?

EXACTLY the above happened literally dozens and dozens of times in World War II.

Total misidentifications were routine by reconnaissance aircraft; destroyers as battleships, cargo vessels as aircraft carriers.

And on multiple occasions there aircraft attacked their own countries' ships.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

How much were we giving in 1967?

[Oztrich Boy]

Ever know a naval aviator that didn't know what kind of ship he was attacking in clear weather?

EXACTLY the above happened literally dozens and dozens of times in World War II.
Total misidentifications were routine by reconnaissance aircraft; destroyers as battleships, cargo vessels as aircraft carriers.

And those misidentifications were made by actual experienced naval aviators, unlike Israel where shipping attack was low on the priority list of the IAF in 1967.

[Benjo]

The first sentence of this story by AP reporter Barry Schweid says that the state department "concluded" after its conference on Monday that the Liberty attack was due to "Israeli negligence."

The third sentence of his story says the conference "failed to produce a consensus for any of three views voiced most often: Israel intentionally attacked what it knew to be a ship of the U.S. Navy, the attack was accidental, or the attack resulted from faulty judgment."

So which was it? It sounds from this story that the State Department didn't conclude anything. An earlier version of this same story called the facts "elusive" and said the particpants argued "heatedly".

Despite what Schweib says in his lead, the rest of the story seems to suggest that the conference didn't reach any conclusions at all. Schweib ought to reread his stories for internal consistancy before sending them off around the world. (To be fair to Schweib, a ham-handed editor--or one with an agenda--may have rewritten his lead after Schweib filed his story, turned off his cell phone and went out for beer.)

[mr.pink]

According to Jim Ennis who is a Class One anti semite. I wouldn't believe a word that guy said.

And Jay Cristol is a class one pro-semite. I wouldn't believe a word that guy said (on this particular issue).

Again, machine gunning life rafts is a major no-no.

[mr.pink]

This incident is closed!!

Huh?...you may need new reading glasses.

A daylong conference that studied fresh documents as well as the established record failed to produce a consensus for any of three views voiced most often:

So despite your ham handed attempt to halt debate and label the matter "closed"....it none the less reamins wide open for debate and analysis.

[CIBGUY]

If you were aware of the facts that there was an American AWACS plane in the air recording the Israeli pilots comments, you'd see that they knew exactly who they were killing, and that they were having a good time at it. I don't trust the Israeli's. this country will do anything to make life easy for the Israeli's, even to letting them get away with murder. We're still doing it! "A "mistake", yeah, the "mistake" we make with those people has so far cost Americans thousands of American lives, all because of our inability to acknowledge the truth.

[CIBGUY]

Try reading the sworn testimony of the people who were on the ship!

[CIBGUY]

It's very simple. The Jews intended to sink this ship with no survivors in an effort to blame the Ababs, which they thought would bring the U.S. into the war against the Arabs.

[nkycincinnatikid]

"Israel is America's greatest ally." "What the hell is 34 Americans" Nuff said..

[Inyokern]

It's very simple. The Jews intended to sink this ship with no survivors in an effort to blame the Ababs,

If that were true, then the Israelis would have flown planes with the markings of an Arab nation. Otherwise, there would be no expectation that they could get away with it because it would have to be assumed that the ship would notify US Naval Command of the attack by radio.

Try again.

[Inyokern]

If you were aware of the facts that there was an American AWACS plane in the air recording the Israeli pilots comments, you'd see that they knew exactly who they were killing, and that they were having a good time at it.

I was under the impression that the AWACS was first deployed in 1977, 10 years after this incident.

[mr.pink]

An Accurate and Timely Account of the Truth

Where exactly is this sourced from?...sounds like it's from the J Cristol cheering section to me.

Lots of folks aren't thrilled by the Judge, count me among them....and again, please provide your source for this piece....thanks.

[mr.pink]

Israel is America's greatest ally.

BS...Isreal is our highest maintenance dependent.

The Brits are our greatest ally, and to use you own words "case closed".

[mr.pink]

I guess for whatever reason you are unwilling to post the source for your cut and pasted article supporting the Cristol position. If the matter is "case closed"...why not include the source?

You sound like a complete religious bigot to me and a very frustrated one at that.

[mr.pink]

ROTFLMAO....Your "source" is the funniest F-in' thing I've ever seen posted here as defense of a position.

You have the audacity to post an anonymous "customer review" as an accredited article?....who wrote it?...Cristol's mommie?...his wife? You're quite a silly fellow, but I certainly understand now why you excluded the source from your intial posting.

No matter how you slice it, machine gunning life rafts is very naughty and a war crime, even if the gunners were just "following orders".

[mr.pink]

Judge Cristol's parents were holocaust survivors...

Big freakin' deal. Being a Holocaust survivor, and having a dollar seventy-five, will get you a ride on the NYC subway.

... and the judge is a first class kind of guy....

Larry Lawrence was a "first class kind of guy" too....right up to the day they dug his sorry lyin' ass out his grave and gave him the ole heave ho from Arlington cemetary.

I think painting swastikas on synagogues is something you would do as it would reinforce your paranoia and keep you confident that your perpetual victim mindset is a sound one.