GOP FINALLY MAY HAVE A CHUCK RIVAL

New York Post ^ | 11/03/03 | FREDRIC U. DICKER

[HitmanLV]

I don't think Pataki has what it takes to beat Hill. HE can beat Schumer though, I think.

Rudy for NY Gov? Why not? I prefer he moves right to national politics though.

[Sabertooth]

No one's getting onstage with Bush at prime time in New York without Karl Rove's green light.

If you don't think Rove's well aware of this "promise" to Spencer, then we see things differently. He's no less a student of Machiavelli than was Dick Morris.

After Schwarzenegger survived the last-minute smears here in California, the bar has been lowered considerably on the personal conduct of GOP candidates. This is a probe of the waters to see how low.

[JohnnyZ]

Every other race in America would sink to puny insignficance.

Maybe. It depends on how a couple other races shape up: Ted Kennedy, Schwarzenegger, Nelson-Bush in Florida, Harold Ford, JC Watts, and Michael Steele. Plus Trent Lott.

Could be a very busy year, and that's not including the key races that no one will care about, like Dayton in Minnesota, Stabenow/Cantwell/WV/WI, and Jumpin' Jim Jeffords. Plus the possible Texas GOP primary for governor.

[republicanwizard]

Actually, I'd prefer he run against her. Pataki is calm, quiet, uncontroversial but tough and determined. I'd prefer steady calm over rock star glitz when running against Hildebeast.

As far as Giuliani is concerned, my preference against Spitzer is someone who can outshine the little twerp, and Giuliani is one of the most brilliant stars in the GOP galaxy.

[republicanwizard]

Actually, I'd prefer he run against her. Pataki is calm, quiet, uncontroversial but tough and determined. I'd prefer steady calm over rock star glitz when running against Hildebeast.

As far as Giuliani is concerned, my preference against Spitzer is someone who can outshine the little twerp, and Giuliani is one of the most brilliant stars in the GOP galaxy.

[JohnnyZ]

No one's getting onstage with Bush at prime time in New York without Karl Rove's green light. If you don't think Rove's well aware of this "promise" to Spencer, then we see things differently.

Yeah, we do see things differently, you're ignorant.

WHOEVER THE NOMINEE IS will get high billing in the convention. It's in New York. This is the umpteenth mention of the senate nominee getting high billing at the convention. It just goes along with whoever the nominee is. There's no special promise to Spencer; get real! This has been part of the inducement for every potential candidate.

To revise my earlier comment, even a monkey in diapers might get high billing at the convention if he was the NY Senate nominee.

[Owen]

The Schumer seat is unwinnable. Period.

The focus, the absolute 100% focus of possibly national consequence, is the defeat of Hillary in 2006. She cannot run for prez in 2008 if she isn't even in the Senate and she is up in 2006. If she's repudiated by even her own state (sic) NY, the Clintons will finally be erased from national politics. There are few goals the party should have of higher priority.

The way to do that is Guilliani. He is the Hillary stopper. Probably no one else in the NY GOP can be. His post 9/11 efforts will be remembered. He can beat her. He must be persuaded to try.

[republicanwizard]

Oh I'm blissfully unconcerned about the GOP in 2006. If the seat was vulnerable at all, we lost it in 2000.

In 2006, it's our chance to take down Cantwell, Dayton, Stabenow, and Nelson while taking Clinton, Corzine, etc. down with them. Perhaps we could pick up a seat in California or North Dakota.

[HitmanLV]

As far as Giuliani is concerned, my preference against Spitzer is someone who can outshine the little twerp, and Giuliani is one of the most brilliant stars in the GOP galaxy.

No argument there. I find it amazing that Spitzer (who reminds me of the smartest kid in the 6th grade who won't shut up) could be elected to any position higher than Dog Catcher. It was a sad day when Vacco lost in 1998, though he didn't do much with the position.

The thought of an annoying twerp like Spitzer being Governor of the Empire State is sickening - it helps validate my decision to leave NYC/NYS even more. If he is the future of NY, I'll stay in the past, or just get as far away as I can (I live 2500 miles away in Las Vegas now, having moved in April 2002)!

[republicanwizard]

I'm telling you that you are wrong. Against Hillary, it would rapidly turn into a guerrilla war. I'm more concerned that Giuliani run for the Governorship and rack up a 60%+ majority which will assist Pataki against Hillary.

The Pataki machine in the suburbs and the upstate would be well-complemented by the Giuliani machine in NYC.

[republicanwizard]

Please! Don't leave the Empire State. I'll be leaving the Commonwealth of PA in a couple years to head to the city by the crystal waters.

[capt. norm]

"If Hitlery decides to run in '04...does she have to give up her senate seat??? "

You just painted a horrible picture in my mind: "Hillary's seat". I'm picturing her physical seat in D.C.

If you were elected as her replacement in the senate, would you not want that 'seat' that she parked her 'wide load' in to be ripped out and recycled or something?

If that can't be done I guess there's always 'Saran Wrap'.

[JohnnyZ]

It was a sad day when Vacco lost in 1998, though he didn't do much with the position.

Dennis Vacco refused the NY Right-to-life nomination, and lost by a smaller margin than the RTL candidate got, IIRC. His name is a stain on my alma mater. What a loser.

[Sabertooth]

What is your continuing obsession with Karl Rove? Is it safer for you to blast him rather than the President?

I don't like Rove, or the direction in which he believes the GOP should go.

I'm more than willing to criticize the President where I think he should be criticized, and support him where I think he should be supported. I don't need Rove as a proxy for either.

This is an insult to Pres. Bush as you make him out to be some marionette dangling from Rove's Machiavellian strings (which I think is your purpose in actuality).

Nonsense. I do think Rove is Machiavellian, but that doesn't make Bush a marionette. There are plenty of accounts of Bush riding Rove hard in staff meetings.

However, I don't subscribe to the notion that Presidents know what all of their advisors are doing at all times, nor do I believe that they should try to micromanage in that way. Sometimes, and Ollie North is an example that comes to mind, Presidents are not well-served by their staffs on this or that matter. In such cases, I don't automatically hold the President responsible.

Another possible example would be some of the intelligence failures we might have had in the Iraq War (the jury's still out, as far as I'm concerned). Even if it should turn out that the case for Saddam's WMD's was overstated, or in error in some way, that wouldn't be grounds to criticize Bush for his conduct of the Iraq War, since he was using the best information available to him at the time, and there were other reasons for fighting in any case.

I realize that there's a temptation in this forum to view those who don't abjectly praise President Bush, Karl Rove, or all Republicans in all cases as somehow having ulterior agendas, but one ought to at least consider that the criticism might actually be sincere, even if one doesn't agree with it.

[Teacher317]

Rove is the genius behind our ascendence to national power.

Rove was behind the 1994 Republican Revolution? The Contract with America? The nation's disgust with Democrat filibustering, obstruction, and pandering to America's enemies? The GOP was not a national party until he hit the scene?

Wow, he gets around.

[HitmanLV]

Sorry pallie, I ditched NYC back in 2002. I wouldn't move back to NYC for anything. I was born and raised in Manhattan and the city turns my stomach now.

For the longest time people said I didn't belong. When I finally agreed and left, they looked at me in wide eyed wonder. Go figure.

(Come out West, you will love it!)

[republicanwizard]

I'm not a Western kinda guy. I love the city. However, we're all Freepers. Hooray!

[hosepipe]

Observing New York politics is like watching worms writhing in a cow pie... not as much boring as disgusting..

[HitmanLV]

Best wishes there. If you need any advice or insight into manhattantown (I'm born and raised and left at age 34) drop a line! Hooray! ;-)

[Sabertooth]

Yeah, we do see things differently, you're ignorant.

I didn't know that, but I guess it would be expected that I wouldn't.

WHOEVER THE NOMINEE IS will get high billing in the convention. It's in New York. This is the umpteenth mention of the senate nominee getting high billing at the convention.

So, everyone knows, right? So when I read this...

Republican sources told The Post yesterday that Gov. Pataki, at a private meeting last week, offered Yonkers Mayor John Spencer, an anti-abortion conservative with a controversial personal life, the chance to run against Schumer next year.

Am I supposed to conclude that Pataki, who knows the nominee would get high billing at the convention, is courting Spencer without Rove's knowledge, and is either ingorant, unaware, or recklessly cavalier that he's making an implicit promise that Karl Rove would rather not keep?