Rumsfeld defends general who commented on war, Satan. (Rumsfeld shows courage)

CNN ^ | Thursday, October 16, 2003 | Associated Press

[.cnI redruM]

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff are defending a new deputy undersecretary of defense "who has reportedly cast the war on terror" in religious terms.

Lt. Gen. William G. Boykin, whose promotion and appointment was confirmed by the Senate in June, has said publicly that he sees the war on terrorism as a clash between Judeo-Christian values and Satan, the Los Angeles Times reported Thursday.

[.cnI redruM]

That quote by Lincoln Chafee, was that a drive-by mischaracterization, or what the man really feels?

If someone needs to be repalced over this, it's Senator Rhino. Boykin was chosen to win wars, not to be PC.

[KellyAdmirer]

he sees the war on terrorism as a clash between Judeo-Christian values and Satan, the Los Angeles Times reported Thursday.

Appearing in dress uniform before a religious group in Oregon in June, Boykin said Islamic extremists hate the United States "because we're a Christian nation, because our foundation and our roots are Judeo-Christians. ... And the enemy is a guy named Satan."

If that is the actual quote, it looks like the general is saying that the OTHER guys see US as Satan, not the other way around. Which is not news to anyone except the LA Times, since they have called us the Great Satan for almost 25 years.

But then, the LA Times would never micharacterize anyone on the Right, now would they....

[Rockitz]

Actually, what the general says is quite true. Unfortunately, in his position, similarly as with our president, it is essential for him to publicly express that the current ongoing conflict is a war against terrorism and NOT a holy war. From that perspective, I have to agree with the Times, as much as that pains me. As a retired general, he would no longer be in an official capacity and would be completely within his rights to speak in this manner. As a leader of all Americans of all faiths, his speech is diplomatically provocative and not in our nation's best interests in dealing with the substantial threat we now face; especially when we are seeking the aid of other Muslim nations to counter the terrorist threat.

[Semper Paratus]

Patton said and did a lot more than that.

[.cnI redruM]

George S. Patton used to proclaim he was Hannibal reincarnated and stated that God put him on Earth to win WW II. His genuinely eccentric, no flat-out whacked religious views, in no way inhibited his ability to organize and lead soldiers to victory. With no personal disrespect intended, I heartily disagree with your eloquently stated point of view.

[KellyAdmirer]

Patton came darn close to losing his job to the PC police, too, in Sicily. Thank goodness he survived that particular battle.

[DainBramage]

I think this guy is head over Delta, or once was.

[RJCogburn]

And the enemy is a guy named Satan."

Uh,oh...a nutcase alert.

The enemy is more concrete than a theoretical construct.

[DainBramage]

Prayer breakfast mixes faith with food

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Spc. Eugena Roaché

444th MPAD/ Fort Dix PAO

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width="260" height="186">

Spec. Shawn Morris

FAITH IN WORDS -- Maj. Gen. William G. Boykin, above, commander of the U.S. Army John F. Kennedy Special Warfare Center and School delivered a powerful message at the Installation Prayer Breakfast.  Staff Sgt. Alvy Powell, of the U.S. Army Chorus gave a solo performance at the Club Dix event.

“I have spent 32 years fighting so that every American can believe whatever they please.”

Maj. Gen. William G. Boykin, commander of the U.S. Army John F. Kennedy Special Warfare Center and School delivered a powerful message on the importance of faith at the Installation Prayer Breakfast Feb. 6 at Club Dix.

“What I tell you this morning represents my faith,” he clarified, so as not to reject the beliefs of others.

Boykin began his career in special operations and - in his 32 years of service - has held positions of leadership during many of the nation’s military engagements. Though wounded serially and seriously through the years, he continues to serve his nation in body and mind. He attributes his survival and his successes to his faith.

Boykin portrayed his intense message in words and posture, leaning slightly toward the audience to capture his listeners. He spoke of the beginning of the Global War on Terrorism and the attacks that prompted it. “These buildings were assembled of American might and American power,” Boykin said of the World Trade Center. “We all watched in horror as they began to crumble. We watched in disbelief as we saw people around the world rejoicing in our agony and misery.”

Reflecting on the current condition of the world, Boykin proclaimed, “The enemy is not the terrorists.” He spoke of  the Bible’s reference to Principalities of Darkness. “The enemy has come against us in a spiritual realm.”

Boykin compared the radical Islamic fundamentalists to the radical “hooded Christians” of the United States. “There are Muslims who worship here and support the United States,” he said, pointing out that those who act violently in the name of their religion do not reflect the principles of Islam.

Nor do they reflect the principles of the Judeo-Chrisitan roots of the United States, he said.

“We will never walk away from Israel,” Boykin declared. He quoted Ben Franklin’s conclusion: Rebellion to tyrants, is obedience to God. “Many of us are worried about heaven,” he speculated. “Heaven is your reward. You are here as soldiers to take on the enemy.”

He went on to quote Isaiah 40:31, words which hang on a wall in his office. “But those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles; they will run and not grow weary, they will walk and not be faint.” In summation, and in reference to the current situation, Boykin said, “If there is no God, there is no hope. Don’t let the media, the liberals, sway you in your faith. Pray for America, and we will be victorious. He’ll (Lord) never give more than you can take.”

“No matter how strong we are, it all depends on God. Despite our strength and our might, it is God who will make the final decisions,” affirmed Chap. (Lt. Col.) Ira Kronenberg, of the Installation Support Battalion.

Installation Chap. (Col.) Tom Vann said that with the condition of the nation today, it is important that we gather and think about spiritual things. He led the audience as it stood to sing “America The Beautiful.”

The audience applauded warmly to the selections sung by Staff Sgt. Alvy Powell, of the U.S. Army Chorus. Powell certified “You Gave Me Love’’ —  a song introduced to him by Vann in 1983— as his testimony.

Col. David Lowry, installation commander, presented Boykin and Powell with renditions of the Fort Dix Main Chapel.

The program concluded with a prayer led by Charlie Dreyer, President of the Catholic Congregation. Many remained close to meet Boykin and shake his hand. The strength of his faith and the spirituality of his message touched the entire audience.

[.cnI redruM]

http://au.news.yahoo.com/031016/11/m41u.html

No, the link above offers a prime example of a nut-case alert.

[Sunshine Sister]

Anything that even hints of religion is "deplorable" to these jerks!

[rdb3]

Uh,oh...a nutcase alert. The enemy is more concrete than a theoretical construct.

How is what you said not calling Christians "nutcase(s)?"

[Rockitz]

That's the stark difference between political leaders, such as the general, and religious leaders and other idealogues. While a politician's private thoughts may be quite different than what he says, he must speak for all and in his nation's best interests on the world stage. A religious leader, on the other hand, can and should speak from his most deep-seated convictions.

I am a born-again Christian, yet I realize that this distinction is necessary to operate in the real world. Pragmatism is not a sell out of principle, rather it is the ultimate use of our God-given wisdom.

[Old Sarge]

President Bush has often said the view of the administration is that the United States is in a war against terrorism, "not a war against a religion," Rumsfeld said, but rather a war against people who "have tried to hijack a religion."

SECDEF and the C-IN-C have to say that to appease the Left. We in the ranks agree with the general.

It's refreshing (actually, stunning) to see a flag-rank officer not quoting the PC line.

[been_lurking]

As a leader of all Americans of all faiths, his speech is diplomatically provocative and not in our nation's best interests in dealing with the substantial threat we now face; especially when we are seeking the aid of other Muslim nations to counter the terrorist threat.

What is, is. No matter what you call it, how you describe it, or what words you chose to use or not use.

I am so tired of "parsing" and "diplomatic language" and "PC-isms". I for one consider it a breath of fresh air when a member of our government speaks in plain terms.

[tubavil]

...Boykin said Islamic extremists hate the United States "because we're a Christian nation, because our foundation and our roots are Judeo-Christians. ... And the enemy is a guy named Satan."

Exactly correct.

[Rockitz]

See post #13. ;o)

That's why they call it politically correct. To even enter dialog as one must do in the political environment, a modicum of respect must be demonstrated. It is simply not wise to call a man a fool prior to entering serious negotiation with him.

[CarolAnn]

"It's refreshing (actually, stunning) to see a flag-rank officer not quoting the PC line."

I agree wholeheartedly! The people who view this as his saying something wrong don't understand his statement in the biblical context. I'm a Baptist, and if the terrorists were some kind of radical baptists, a similar statement would still be correct. The enemy is Satan, and it always will be.

[keats5]

First, Generals have the right to offer their testimonys, especially to religious groups. Why wouldn't they? Generals have invoked the Almighty for hundreds of years in this country. Our own President continues to do so to this day. We're not completey communist yet. Personally, I prefer that our Generals fear God, more than they fear the PC crowd.

Offering one's testimony in a group setting is a common practice in many churches. In my church, we take turns doing this in our Adult Bible Studies. Eventually, every one in the group takes their turn to tell their story. It's part of our belief that we should be prepared to give a testimony for the reson for the faith within us. To forbid Generals from doing so would indeed infringe on their right to practice their own religion. Just as Generals are allowed to worship in a church in this country, they are allowed to speak of their beliefs.

Second, this guy never undermined the "party line." He didn't say we were at war with Islam. He said we were at war with Satan. One could be intellectually honest, and yet say that "those who hijacked Islam" sided with Satan. This would leave room for the administration to say that loyal Islamic American citizens are not in the same category. Neither does Satan specifically represent any religion. Satan works in Judeo-Christian congregations, as well as he works in mosques.

Finally, I think his statement was, in fact, correct.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Unfortunately, Satan is working quite effectively from within many churches in the US and elsewhere maybe even mine. His work has always found many helpers some witting some unwitting and never had to wait for the relatively new religion of Islam. It is only 1400 yrs old while he is ageless.

[judicial meanz]

Bravo Zulu to General Boykin.

[semaj]

"It is only 1400 yrs old while he is ageless."

Agree with everything you said in your last up to this point. Satan was created by God, therefore he has a beginning which negates the last part of your statement.

[justshutupandtakeit]

I didn't mean eternal merely his age is beyond our knowing.
Certainly his role as ordained by the Lord is to test mankind and he does that from within and very well.

Now I can resist anything but temptation.

[bluelowrider57]

I read about this b4. Thank God for an awesome government.

[bluelowrider57]

I believe the nutcases are the people who know that Satan is the real enemy but dont stand up and say it.

Boykin is a very strong man.

[bboop]

Boytkin IS a breath of fresh air. For heaven's sake, he was speaking to a Catholic group, not to the UN. He gets to have his own opinions, as do we ALL. They are out to bring him down because you can't believe in God in this country without offending someone's tender sensibilities. They forget, unfortunately, that there is NO right in the Bill of Rights protecting someone from being 'offended.' Good GRIEF!

[SerpentDove]

My, it's refreshing to hear the truth spoken so loudly, plainly and publicly.

Religion of peace, my foot.

[asmith92008]

We are told that we must be careful not to inflame the Muslims - though one wonders why this should be such a worry, if they are so peaceful - by making them think that we are "crusaders."
Yet we must consider the Crusades. We always hear that Christians set out to conquer "Muslim" lands, such as Jerusalem. Yet these were Christian lands that had been conquered by Muslims. Europeans set out to liberate Christians who had been relegated to, at best, second-class citizenship under Muslim rule.
Islam started out as a warrior religion that spread by the sword. Muslims tasted victory in Christendom when conquering the Byzantine Empire and Spain but were finally defeated.
Today, the so-called "religion of peace" seeks to reclaim its former glory.
America is a nation founded on Judeo-Christian values. Indeed, our freedoms are based on the truth that all men are created equally in God's image and dignity and thus possess inviolable rights. It is beyond the authority of any government to take away what God has given us.
Muslim law is a tyranny that denies our God given rights. So long as America stands proud in its Judeo-Christian heritage, we are a bulwark against Islamic tyrants.
It fills me with pride and relief that Gen. Boykin will carry this knowledge in his heart as he hunts the animals who murder Americans.

[RJCogburn]

“Heaven is your reward. You are here as soldiers to take on the enemy.”

The guy's version of '72 virgins' I guess.

[Callahan]

RICE-BOYKIN '08!!!!

[been_lurking]

To even enter dialog as one must do in the political environment, a modicum of respect must be demonstrated.

Respect does not require a lack of clear and concise language.

I'd have more respect for a person who flat out tells me he thinks I'm an idiot, than I would for some two-faced, diplo-speaking, used car salesman who wants to say the same thing, but doesn't have the cojones.

[Rockitz]

In this country, both of you would be protected under our constitution, but out in the real world, where literally anything goes, they might stick a gun in your face and blow it off; vis a vi 9/11.

How many people have you bought anything from that called you a fool? Get real.

[been_lurking]

We will simply have to agree to disagee.

I prefer plain language, straight talk, and simple honesty. You find merit in weasel language, thinly veiled lies, and other "diplomatic" nonsense.

[ImpBill]

I'm with you. I am not by any means a religious person, so zealotry is not my aim, but the sooner we get this war accurately defined, as the General puts it, the sooner and with less casualites we are going to win it.

This is not a religious war, but it is a war between the fanatical and insidious philosphy of Islam at its fundamental core and the rest of the civilized world.

Until our leadership both recognizes that and places total victory as our goal we will fight the thing piecemeal and take un-necessary casualties.

[Rockitz]

In a world where everything said publicly is known almost immediately by everyone else on the planet, political correctness is essential to maintain diplomatic relations. Unless one is willing to pick up arms and stand on the front lines of battle in defense of this nation, one should not be so quick to throw down the glove of confrontation without attempting diplomacy, merely to parade one's principles.

If I am a leader responsible for both my country's sovereignty and the lives of soldiers sworn to die for my country, I'm going to do the best I can to sacrifice any ego trip I get from expressing my principles in order to save the lives of those soldiers.

How's that for plain language?

[AmericanVictory]

It's winning that their against.