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What Is the Future of Conservatism?
Commentary Magazine ^ | Jan 2013 | Mark Steyn

Posted on 01/16/2013 5:07:51 AM PST by Sir Napsalot

(Note: This same topic was posted by Jeff Jacoby, and discussed here. Now we get to read from Steyn)

Not to be too pedantic, but for there to be a “future of conservatism in America” there first has to be a future in America. And that’s a more open question than my more optimistic comrades like to admit. The Brokest Nation in History has just told the rest of the world that it is incapable of serious course correction–and around the planet prudent friends and enemies will begin planning for a post-American order. So at some point reality will intervene–either in the form of total societal collapse or, one hopes, something marginally less convulsive. The first responsibility of conservatives between now and 2016 is to have an adult conversation with the citizenry–the one that Mitt Romney chose to eschew in favor of vague jobs promises punctuated by bold assertions that “I believe in America.” So what? What matters is whether reality still believes in America.

And, when reality strikes, will Americans turn to conservatism? The evidence from November is not reassuring. .....(Read the rest, it gets better)

(Excerpt) Read more at commentarymagazine.com ...


TOPICS: Issues; Parties
KEYWORDS:

1 posted on 01/16/2013 5:07:56 AM PST by Sir Napsalot
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To: Sir Napsalot
I think we may be down to two options:


2 posted on 01/16/2013 5:16:49 AM PST by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: Sir Napsalot
“The Brokest Nation in History has just told the rest of the world that it is incapable of serious course correction...”

“O” campaigned and won with his broadsides against American exceptional ism and everything else American.

NOW he wants to ‘lead’ this 'worst' and most 'vile' nation on earth and complains that he can't get bipartisan support!

Really?

THIS is exactly the reason that we absolutely MUST have a functioning 2 PARTY system...and a 2 Party system which is not perpetually and summarily invalidated by a biased and out of control MSM.

If anyone cares to look for one, the MSM and the NEA ARE the culprits here!

THEY are supposed to keep leadership honest and of course, they CANNOT if they abandon their objectivity.

3 posted on 01/16/2013 5:20:02 AM PST by SMARTY ("The man who has no inner-life is a slave to his surroundings. "Henri Frederic Amiel)
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To: Sir Napsalot

Steyn’s still thinking the political system will save us, if only we can convert more to the conservative thinking.

I just thought “THINGS” (even if the Left has to engineer one) will come to a head well before 2016.


4 posted on 01/16/2013 5:20:10 AM PST by Sir Napsalot (Pravda + Useful Idiots = CCCP; JournOList + Useful Idiots = DopeyChangey!)
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To: Sir Napsalot

I do not think that the Republican party should even have a candidate in 2016. Let the Dems run unopposed. Then all the people will have to stop and ask themselves the question they have not in many many years: “What kind of country DO I want? What system of government would work best for America and why?” We are either going to return to founding principles or we will eventually return to them by exigenxy (but there is no guarantee that this will happen).

The questions faced by American now is NOT “Who should I vote for?” but “What system of government do I wnat to live under and why?” They should know though that time is running out for even making that choice. Once we re-establish government by tyranny, the only way to dislodge it is by force of arms.


5 posted on 01/16/2013 5:21:29 AM PST by veritas2002
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To: Sir Napsalot

I see the USA going the way of other large countries that have since have gone their seperate ways, along red/blue states lines.


6 posted on 01/16/2013 5:21:38 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Sir Napsalot

I see a second civil war by 2016, with the red states and blue states calling it quits, just like a divorce.


7 posted on 01/16/2013 5:24:25 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: veritas2002

I believe by 2016 we could very well have a hot “civil war”.


8 posted on 01/16/2013 5:30:17 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl

I would tend to agree — although one very interesting aspect of that will be some of the “blue” states that are really “red” states. I’m thinking of PA or some others. If the country fractures, I know that Philadelphia will want to line up with NYC, Hartford and Boston, etc. Fine. But the rest of PA? Is western PA filled with metrosexual Liberals who hate guns? I don’t think so. PA is a blue state because of Philadelphia. If push comes to shove, states like that will not simply opt to join into some Blue Federation. I don’t know what will happen to the Liberal cities. They cannot survive without the surrounding countryside, and the countryside doesn’t want to be on their team anymore.


9 posted on 01/16/2013 5:31:09 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Nothing will change until after the war.)
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To: ClearCase_guy

Also do not forget Pittsburgh, that must also be a LIBERAL city, on the level of Philadelphia. The rest of PA, minus those two cities are pretty much conservative.


10 posted on 01/16/2013 5:36:59 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Sir Napsalot

What we know for sure:

The Republican Party has no viable answers or will to fix any of the problems faced by this country.

The Democrat Party is the major driving force behind most of the problems faced by this country.

So political solutions are a dead end.


11 posted on 01/16/2013 5:48:49 AM PST by EricT. (The GOP's sole purpose is to serve as an ineffective alternative to the Democrat Party.)
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To: Sir Napsalot

What we know for sure:

The Republican Party has no viable answers or will to fix any of the problems faced by this country.

The Democrat Party is the major driving force behind most of the problems faced by this country.

So political solutions are a dead end.


12 posted on 01/16/2013 5:48:49 AM PST by EricT. (The GOP's sole purpose is to serve as an ineffective alternative to the Democrat Party.)
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To: ClearCase_guy
Most of us agree then the political system is broken beyond repair??? Fractured states then, I see the major metro areas link up (from NE to NYC, Philly, DC, to ???) to form a “Coastal State(s)”. They have to because they don't have any one else.

Conservatives’ mission should be ‘Be vigilant, Be prepared, Preserve and Restore’. There is no way avoiding the upcoming conflict.

The Left had been clamoring for one civil war, but we all know it won't be started by ‘rightwing extremists’. Just be vigilant about Obama(Left/Media)’s "Reichstag Fire".

13 posted on 01/16/2013 5:50:30 AM PST by Sir Napsalot (Pravda + Useful Idiots = CCCP; JournOList + Useful Idiots = DopeyChangey!)
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To: Biggirl

You may be right, and I’m thinking in this day and age this red/blue line does not have to be geogrpahical....it could almost be virtual secession.

You are in one of two tax/benefit systems/political systems - a nanny system or an opportunity system. Among other things, the opportunity system would show that private charities, religious organizations and insurances would form a far superior safety net than does government....not to mention the obvious business advantages...


14 posted on 01/16/2013 5:52:18 AM PST by C. Edmund Wright
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To: Sir Napsalot

Conservatism will NOT be with the GOP,
which attacked Gov. Palin for Obama and Soros,
and then put up as candidate the origial author
of ObamaCARE/RomneyCARE and gay marriage,
after savaging EVERY SINGLE conservative.

The GOP is the party of Powell and Bloomberg. Adios.


15 posted on 01/16/2013 5:54:44 AM PST by Diogenesis (Vi veri veniversum vivus vici)
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To: ClearCase_guy

Let’s not forget “blue” Pittsburgh. Liberals like to say that Pennsylvania is Pittsburgh and Philadelphia, with Alabama in between. I’m proud to be in the “Alabama” in between. Locals call it the Republican “T”, which it is if you look at a map.

I think that civil war will be more complicated than state against state. More likely, it will be tax consumers vs. taxpayers, law abiding vs gangsters, and warlord vs warlord, city vs. suburb. Gangs, militias, armies, etc. It will be chaos. Civil order is breaking down. It will be completely gone.

Whoever can command the loyalty of the best and biggest armies will win, and if nobody can command a winning share, the civil war will go on indefinitely, and maybe result in a foreign conquest of part or all of the late, great, USA.


16 posted on 01/16/2013 5:54:51 AM PST by Daveinyork (."Trusting government with power and money is like trusting teenaged boys with whiskey and car keys,)
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To: ClearCase_guy
"If push comes to shove, states like that will not simply opt to join into some Blue Federation. I don’t know what will happen to the Liberal cities."

You bring up an interesting point. There are situations like that in a lot of states. Georgia, for instance is a red state, but in the city of Atlanta you have a huge blue population.

I think that a dire economic collapse (which more than likely would be one of the forerunners of a civil war) would sort out that problem, as there would be a huge inner city population die-off from starvation and riots.

17 posted on 01/16/2013 5:59:40 AM PST by Apple Pan Dowdy (... as American as Apple Pie mmm mmm mmm)
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To: Biggirl

I think you’re right and I HOPE you’re right. I’m packing
up my house these last few weeks and am moving south,FL
panhandle, an the end of the month. Still have to sell the
house though,ugh,found a good renter for the short-term.

When the SHTF, i prefer to be surrounded by like-minded
folk. I often wonder when the real upheaval will begin.
5 years,10 years,20 years...any thoughts??


18 posted on 01/16/2013 6:08:01 AM PST by americas.best.days... ( I think we can now say that they are behind us.)
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To: Apple Pan Dowdy
Yes. I see significant die-off as inevitable in the urban centers.

But also, in an old-style civil war, you might possibly have big states bully smaller states. MA wants to be blue. CT wants to be blue. If, by any chance, Rhode Island had any doubts, I think their bigger enighbors would just send them a memo: "You're blue." And the Blue Federation gets a little bigger and stronger.

But in a present-day civil war, it's not like that. Phildelphia wants to be Blue? Pittsburgh wants to be Blue? Well, how are they going to link up? They are both behind enemy lines. They are besieged. Supplies are not going to get through, and they cannot reinforce each other.

In an electoral system, large population centers can sway the results very effectively. In a military situation, the urban centers are practically dead on their feet at the very start.

19 posted on 01/16/2013 6:08:17 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Nothing will change until after the war.)
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To: Sir Napsalot

“Just be vigilant about Obama(Left/Media)’s “Reichstag Fire”.

Could today’s presser by Obama with a group of children be just that?


20 posted on 01/16/2013 6:13:16 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: americas.best.days...

On the average, a country lasts 250 years. This country is how old, 233 years old?


21 posted on 01/16/2013 6:20:27 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl
So far, “they” can not make the Colorado, CT cases to rightwing extremists, not that they haven't tried.

But the next horrendous ‘mass shooting’ might be manufactured, or the next one ...... I just know not to trust all what you hear or read, esp. within the 48 hrs of “Breaking News”.

I don't know the sign or if the trigger had been pulled (there are way wiser folks than me).

22 posted on 01/16/2013 6:20:27 AM PST by Sir Napsalot (Pravda + Useful Idiots = CCCP; JournOList + Useful Idiots = DopeyChangey!)
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To: Sir Napsalot

What took place in both CO and CT is to the present time as “bleeding KS” was in the years just before the civil war.


23 posted on 01/16/2013 6:26:11 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: ClearCase_guy; Biggirl; Daveinyork

24 posted on 01/16/2013 6:27:05 AM PST by Rodamala
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To: Sir Napsalot

The future is to spend the next 20 years building a REAL opposition party. One that accurately reflects the values of the American people. That way we’ll be ready to start picking up the pieces after the Dems have taken the ship into the iceberg (by which time the GOP will be relegated to a historical footnote).


25 posted on 01/16/2013 6:32:22 AM PST by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Biggirl
Also do not forget Pittsburgh, that must also be a LIBERAL city, on the level of Philadelphia.

Not even close. Philly is more liberal by several orders of magnitude. The average Pittsburgher is an Economic Liberal (having had it drilled into their heads for generations since the Homestead Strike of the 1890's that Rich Robber Barons are EEEEEEEVIL, Unions are GOOD! Democrats and Big Government bring pensions, public services, and FAIRNESS to life for the WORKIN' MAN and the LITTLE GUY.)

But once you move beyond economics, their views are quite Conservative. Most are traditional Catholics who are Pro Life and espouse a lot of those traditional views. And MANY, MANY of them have guns and carry permits.

Philly on the other hand is liberal to the core in just about every area. At the risk of sounding RAAAACIST, one reason for this I think is that Pittsburgh's minority population is a small fraction of Philly's. Our major problem here is with White Trash suckling up to Big Government.


26 posted on 01/16/2013 6:58:58 AM PST by Buckeye McFrog
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To: All

Socialists control the culture now.

There is no turning back.

Next step is realization that we are in a Cold Civil War.


27 posted on 01/16/2013 7:12:46 AM PST by rbmillerjr (We have No Opposition to Obama's Socialist Agenda)
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To: Buckeye McFrog

Got to remember that it goes all the way back to the days of the belching smoke stake still mills.

In regards to the Catholic faith, not just Latin rite Catholics but also Eastern rite Catholics as well.


28 posted on 01/16/2013 7:28:52 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: rbmillerjr

.....Which will down the road, get “hot” the civil war.


29 posted on 01/16/2013 7:30:22 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl

Yep, it’s etched in the history around here going back to the late 19th. century. A kind of soft class warfare directed at the wealthy and the employers. Despite all of his philanthropy....the museums, libraries, being a major employer who put this town on the map....I remember a number of adults who would have gladly bought a ticket to Scotland to go take a p*ss on Andrew Carnegie’s grave.


30 posted on 01/16/2013 9:02:43 AM PST by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Sir Napsalot; All

” culture trumps politics, and not just in the movies and pop songs, grade schools and mainline churches, but increasingly in the boardrooms..., conservatives need to start fighting on the turf that matters. “

Sounds like we need to invade the liberal’s turf. That’s where the hearts and minds are.


31 posted on 01/19/2013 4:57:40 AM PST by TheRobb7 ("Patriots don't negotiate the terms of our enslavement"--JimRob)
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