Posted on 09/14/2017 4:28:05 PM PDT by Elderberry
Sorry, but most of those bootlickers are too blind to see the truth. To them, the DA and prosecutors are righteous and can do no wrong...and certainly not try to railroad people or cover up governmental wrongdoings.
Read the story. Both lawyer and perp were notified call was being recorded before call took place.
Read the story again.
It was not the fact that the call was recorded. It was the fact that the Hunt County jail turned the call recording over to the prosecution. That was a no-no.
And this was so wrong that this happened.
“In short, in the face of a serious breach of the attorney-client privilege, the Hunt County District Attorney’s Office in Woodruff ultimately did the honorable thing and recused itself from Woodruff’s prosecution,” Broden’s motion states. “The district judge even recused himself from presiding over Woodruff’s case to ensure that the attorney-client privilege remained sacrosanct.
But the case prosecutor ignored all this.
bookmark
Sorry, but you are wrong. Atty/Clt communications are privileged if and only both have an expectation they are privileged.
The notification at the outset of the call removed any such expectation.
You are reading a Def lawyer’s motion.
There is no prohibition against jail’s/Sheriff’s use of recordings in any way they saw fit. In the cited case, SA recused. There will be dozens of cases cited in the reply to the motion where SA did not recuse, as he has no duty to do so.
Notice Def counsel said SA “did the honorable thing.” He did not claim the SA was under any obligation to do so.
Def lawyer and Def stupidly spoke on an unsecured line. Now they are paying the penalty for such stupidity.
BTW, these are far from “jerkwater Texans.”
They are Law and Order lawyers and LEOs putting drug-dealing motorcycle gang punk murderers behind bars for a very long time.
Do you have a problem with such a sentence?
Legally, that does *not* apply to calls to attorneys. That is, Federally, illegal. They are to turn off the monitoring equipment on phone calls between attorneys and clients.
Yes, such law-and-order LEOs that they actually did form letter warrants. They didn’t even bother filling them out individually and charged everyone they apprehended with the same thing, having filled them out ahead of time. No matter what they had or hadn’t done, they got all the same charges.
There are several people who were arrested at the site that were on the other side of the building having nothing whatsoever to do with the fight. They were also hit with the boilerplate charges.
It took Waco literal *years* to drop charges they knew were baseless and disproven by site security video.
From my above linked article:
“A Brenham couple and about three dozen other bikers arrested after the deadly melee at the Twin Peaks restaurant in Waco last May may avoid prosecution.”
“Of those who are not facing charges so far, none was a member of the Bandidos or Cossacks. All were in the vicinity of Twin Peaks for a regional motorcycle club meeting that was supposed to be about safety and changes in the law.”
So, about 40 people were arrested and charged with murder that weren’t in a gang, just happened to be at a motorcycle gathering. And the cops just blanket-arrested everyone around.
So you’re basically saying that the Hunt County DA and the district court judge just recused themselves for the fun of it?
That they didn’t have anything better to do that day?
Or did they realize they screwed up?
No, that is not correct. There is no turn on - turn off. There are special procedures to ensure client - counsel confidentiality, but in order to avail themselves of that, there are certain verification procedures that have to be followed.
If that was not in place, defs could simply say each call was to a lawyer.
Finally, all moot here, as both parties were advised call was being recorded.
No. Read what I wrote. I am saying they had no legal obligation to do so.
The issue here is the legality of the instant matter, and the locals have no legal requirement to do anything other then (re) disclose the existence of the recording to the def.
Yes, there was a huge screw-up, on the part of the def and atty who had been informed they were speaking on a recorded line, and still discussed the case!
Our Constitution protects criminals rights, not their stupidity.
I do. You're spouting facts not in evidence concerning the massacre at the Twin Peaks eatery that day. It has nothing to do with dealing drugs. You want to bust them for those crimes? Then do it when and where they are dealing but it has nothing to do with the clusterf$$k the law did that day. I'm not talking about the ground troops; I'm talking about the leadership of those who clearly broke the law and civil rights of those who where there that day; most of whom were there to talk and listen to issues pertaining to bikers rights. This wasn't even a party; it was a political action meeting in the general public. The undercover cop(s) and cop bosses thought they were gonna win the big kewpie doll that day but instead stomped on a burning paper bag full of dog shit.
The warring clubs and law enforcement both turned that political action meeting into something ugly. There's plenty of blame to go around but arresting 190 people on a blanket charge of the same thing and have it ruin some of their lives and certainly is a hardship financially on all of those arrested is unacceptable. Someone needs to pay for that and be accountable. Blue politics will likely prevent key LEO and prosecutor players from being fired but it doesn't protect them from civil suits (to my knowledge).
In the end the civil suits, which may take ten years to finally settle, will tell the true story but they will be confidential most likely so we won't even get to know just how bad the citizens of Whacko are taking it up the poop chute in higher taxes from all the payouts.
It's obvious the wrong doers in the AG's office are trying to run out the clock which is why this should have been tried somewhere else to begin with once the clear violation of civil rights were made known. Texas is Texas. I know justice will never be served on those who work for the system there. The best we can hope for is dropped charges or acquittals of all those who were wrongly charged and the financial gain they will get from the following civil suits.
For the bikers who are guilty, yep, they need to pay for their crimes as well. Some already paid the ultimate price right there that day when their bodies went to the morgue.
Legal education item #3
Many were arrested on a charge of “Conspiracy”
In criminal law, a conspiracy is a combination or confederacy between two or more persons formed for the purpose of committing, by their joint efforts, some unlawful or criminal act, or some act which is innocent in itself, but becomes unlawful when done by the concerted action of the conspirators, or for the purpose of using criminal or unlawful means to the commission of an act not in itself unlawful.
Because of that, because of the requirement of “joint acts” (everybody doing the same thing), all the indictments charging members with conspiracy MUST be the same. The Straw Man that the indictments are defective because they are all the same is simply PR BS.
Regarding those on the other side of the building, that is no absolution of the conspiracy charge.
As far as the BS that it was all a set up and all the defs are innocent, ask anyone in prison, they will all tell you the same thing.
With all respect, you are paying way too much attention to the table-pounding of the Def lawyers.
Regarding innocence of some gang members, the drug dealing and the conspiracy charge, read TX Statures on criminal street gangs. It’s PC 71 and following.
For those there on the conspiracy charge, if they can’t do the time, they should have not done the crime.
Finally, DA is doing the very smart thing of NOT making his agreements on the Courthouse steps. He is waiting until he is before the jury.
Please do not insult us with claims that this is all some LEO-induced action. A claim that this was some “political action meeting”..... Pleeeeze.
Some punks got together, shot some other punks, some punks died, and now some punks are going on trial for it, and will go to jail for a very long time, as murderers such as them should. Period.
If you don’t understand and accept this was a regular political action meeting, the kind that happens all the time all over the country, then we have nothing to talk about. All conversation must start with that premise otherwise additional facts can’t be discussed. That was the starting point of this event.
I bet you believe in unicorns and global warming too...
At any rate - any evidence gotten like that needs to be disqualified and the whole DA office should be reprimanded and the venue changed.
The issue is not what layer of Antifa-type BS excuse you want to make that this started as a simple “political action meeting.” Even if that pipe dream were true, it is meaningless.
The real issue is how it ended. It ended when these drug-dealing scum took out guns and began to murder each other.
It could have started as a Quaker meeting, open air surgery or a Earnest Ainsley Revival, but when it ended with people being murdered, as it did here, the excuse of how it started is meaningless.
It’s very simple: These scum murdered people. Their friends will roll over on them at trial, and the murderers will go to jail for a very long time.
Of course, you will now tell us it was all a plot by the LEO to kill these poor, peace-loving Banditos, etc.
As to the end-game, it is a legal scenario that is played out time and again every day. There is enough physical evidence to charge some of these defendants in these cases with killing other people. A jury will decide their guilt or innocence. Their lawyers obviously believe there is enough evidence to convict their clients, because they are doing everything they can to prevent the juries from hearing any of that evidence.
Please stop trying to distort the realities of this case for FReepers. And thank you for the Ad Hominem attack. FReepers recognize them as the last resort of a failed debater.
If you were truly looking for justice you would at least admit there are guilty party’s on both sides of this; the AG’s office and law enforcement leadership as well as the club members who started killing people. How many were killed by LEO fire? Were they warranted? We still don’t know the answer to those questions.
You seem to think this is all on the bikers, it isn’t, there’s plenty of blame to go around. If you can’t accept that; too bad.
There’s simply no way to justify arresting 190 people on a blanket charge; many of whom were there simply for the political action meeting. If your ignorance doesn’t allow you to accept that; too bad.
It’s clear some club members were there to rumble or a show of force in numbers. There’s no question about that. Those who are guilty of a crime should pay but so should those in the AG’s office and LE leadership; even that just means they lose their job in disgrace and are disbarred.
A lot of wrongs don’t make a right no matter how biased you are for the AG’s office and bad police leadership.
I no longer have much faith in the courts since they are so corrupted these days. Heck; an honest judge seems to be the exception rather than the rule. The Texas good old boy network is world renown.
By the way, I don’t have a dog in this hunt, I just want to see true justice across the board.
As someone who was involved in these political action meetings in my younger days when the LEO’s of the day used to harass anyone riding a Harley before the brand went mainstream with business owners, lawyers, and even police riding them; I know how important these meetings can be.
They did evolve after my time to include a kind of neutral grounds for club leadership or their representatives to be heard or just kept aware of changing laws or political action needed to protect the rights of riders everywhere. It was also a time and place (not part of the meeting) two or more club reps could talk things out. It offered that opportunity as a perk to being a member of the coalition of clubs. They have their inner politics that I know nothing about but this is the general gist of what these meetings are all about.
There was nothing sinister about it. If two clubs or their members made the mistake of turning it into something it was never intended to be, a war zone like in this case, it isn’t because of the political action leadership. This was the kind of thing it was supposed to prevent along with political action. Again; a neutral ground place to talk things out between clubs having a problem. Not the place to engage in what happened. That was extremely stupid and caused a good business to shut down which the police had a hand in too.
I wasn’t there but my guess is being surrounded by the police like that was akin to pouring gas on a flame near a stick of dynamite. It created a heightened sense of adrenalin pumping anxiety. The rest is history.
I’d be one of the first to admit some of the hardcore club members do have a gang mentality and frankly; they aren’t very bright. All bully and balls; no brain or wisdom. On the other hand some are quite bright and don’t want war with other clubs if it can be avoided.
These meetings are not rocket science and it isn’t something sinister like you and your girl friend TG like to make it out to be. I don’t know what’s in the water there in Waco, TX but something is very wrong with the law enforcement culture there. A lot of corruption. A lot. I know you and your girl friend will never admit it so I won’t hold my breath but it’s true and I think you know it at some level.
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