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Less than a third of NY's public school students passed math, reading exams last year
New York Post ^ | August 7, 2013 | YOAV GONEN

Posted on 08/08/2013 6:21:31 PM PDT by metmom

City results on state math and reading tests plummeted last year – confirming warnings that testing kids on tougher educational standards would shock the school systems from New York to Buffalo.

Fewer than 30 percent of public school kids in grades 3 to 8 passed the state math exams last year, while roughly 26 percent passed the exams in reading, according to the Wall Street Journal.

That’s down from pass rates of 60 percent in math in 2011 and 47 percent in reading.

The poor results were prompted by New York’s adoption of higher learning standards known as Common Core, which was embraced by 44 other states and Washington D.C.

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Education
KEYWORDS: arth; education; ny

1 posted on 08/08/2013 6:21:31 PM PDT by metmom
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To: neverdem; The Mayor; 2Jedismom; 6amgelsmama; AAABEST; aberaussie; AccountantMom; Aggie Mama; ...

ANOTHER REASON TO HOMESCHOOL

This ping list is for the “other” articles of interest to homeschoolers about education and public school. This can occasionally be a fairly high volume list. Articles pinged to the Another Reason to Homeschool List will be given the keyword of ARTH. (If I remember. If I forget, please feel free to add it yourself)

The main Homeschool Ping List handles the homeschool-specific articles. I hold both the Homeschool Ping List and the Another Reason to Homeschool Ping list. Please freepmail me to let me know if you would like to be added to or removed from either list, or both.

2 posted on 08/08/2013 6:22:32 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

What a rousing success the leftists have had in dumbing down America


3 posted on 08/08/2013 6:23:19 PM PDT by GeronL
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To: metmom

And with the adoption of Common Core it won’t matter if they can read or not, creative guessing will be enough.


4 posted on 08/08/2013 6:23:55 PM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: metmom

Wow, this is the place where all the SMARTEST PEOPLE ON EARTH LIVE!


5 posted on 08/08/2013 6:24:36 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: metmom

If they made the standards even tougher, the high school diploma might finally mean something, meaning employers can skip using the college diploma as a sorting mechanism and hire kids right out of high school. Heck, grade levels short of a high school diploma would actually mean something, too.


6 posted on 08/08/2013 6:26:42 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: metmom

Hmmm...30% passed the math while only 26% passed the reading? Sounds to me like they need to make the math tests harder ;-)


7 posted on 08/08/2013 6:30:08 PM PDT by JoeDetweiler
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To: metmom

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0923110.html

Scroll down to find USA ...way down ...And we spend a LOT more dough on Ed. than these countries at the top inc. Japan where I live .


8 posted on 08/08/2013 6:30:40 PM PDT by sushiman ( .)
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To: metmom

Schools don’t fail. Students fail.


9 posted on 08/08/2013 6:32:49 PM PDT by umgud (2A can't survive dem majorities)
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To: metmom

Don’t worry about it.
Education Secretary Arne Duncan warns not to ‘be alarmed’ by lower test scores

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/secretary-arne-duncan-don-alarmed-test-scores-article-1.1419683#ixzz2bQpOPgJ1


10 posted on 08/08/2013 6:37:13 PM PDT by SMGFan (SMGfan is not "Sub Machine Gun" fan)
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To: metmom

11 posted on 08/08/2013 6:38:53 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

How many of those “smartest people on earth” send their kids to public school?


12 posted on 08/08/2013 6:45:17 PM PDT by EDINVA
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To: metmom

How do you ad up GIVE ME GIVE ME?


13 posted on 08/08/2013 6:48:36 PM PDT by maddog55 (America Rising.... Civil War II)
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To: metmom
Separate the statistics by racial groups, and it gets even worse.
14 posted on 08/08/2013 6:56:08 PM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: metmom

Saw Bloomberg on the nearly news tonight trying to convince everyone that the test scores were lower because the test was harder. But it they were teaching using Common Core methods and material, the test scores should have been at least equal or even higher because the Common Core methods and materials are superior. Telling them the truth won’t work .... sort of like telling a new mother that her baby is one ugly creature ... drawing disbelief and ire.


15 posted on 08/08/2013 6:56:31 PM PDT by RetiredTexasVet (The only growth industries left under Progressives are government and poverty.)
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To: metmom

Bet the the pass results for “China Town” are 99%. Some groups value education more than others


16 posted on 08/08/2013 7:10:30 PM PDT by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters of Freedom, Committee of Correspondence)
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To: RetiredTexasVet

Full damage control mode.


17 posted on 08/08/2013 7:37:48 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: 3Fingas

I would not be surprised.


18 posted on 08/08/2013 7:38:09 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: umgud
Schools don’t fail. Students fail.

The schools have failed the students.

19 posted on 08/08/2013 7:38:57 PM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

We’ll have to agree to disagree on that one. Lots of problems with public schools and no doubt minority schools are the crappiest, yet I still blame the parent(S) and students first.


20 posted on 08/08/2013 7:44:27 PM PDT by umgud (2A can't survive dem majorities)
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To: umgud

The NYC schools start at 11 with mandatory classes to encourage kids to have rampant sex. They are not interested in teaching math and reading.

I blame the schools and teachers for this crap.


21 posted on 08/08/2013 7:45:32 PM PDT by GeronL
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Plenty of blame to go around to all parties: the schools, the parents, and the students


22 posted on 08/08/2013 7:49:44 PM PDT by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters of Freedom, Committee of Correspondence)
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To: metmom

The commies in the education dept. are doing their jobs well, i.e., creating more and more future Democratic voters.


23 posted on 08/08/2013 8:19:09 PM PDT by ReformationFan
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To: GeronL
HUH???

NYC schools start at 11? Only if you're on the late session, thanks to the extreme overcrowding. I'm talking 4,000 kids in buildings built for 2,500. They run 3 shifts of teachers and 2 shifts of students.

Not interested in teaching math and reading? Where did you get this absurd idea? And, BTW, the kids in High School don't NEED any classes to have rampant sex. They get that from their loose-moral "parents", listening to crap music, watching movies with anything and everything going on in them, and endless "E.D." commercials on the radio. Sex, sex, sex. Have more sex. Have better sex.

The "students" don't listen to much of anything their teachers say. Those test scores prove it. Why would they listen to them about sex?

24 posted on 08/08/2013 10:05:58 PM PDT by EinNYC
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To: EinNYC

Schools start with 11 year old kids and tell them its okay to have random sex, its a mandatory course, printing uut a route to the nearest abortion clinic is the first thing they are taught,

It is a pro-sex sex ed class.

No opt outs.


25 posted on 08/08/2013 10:35:03 PM PDT by GeronL
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To: GeronL

And you know this for an absolute fact, eh? Have you been in these classes? Taught them? Seen the curriculum? Because I know people who have taught the class “Health” and what you claim they teach is not on the curriculum and they never taught. They would certainly NOT tell their students, “It’s okay to have random sex” nor would they point out any abortion clinics. In fact, if word got back to parents or the administration that they indeed were saying such things, they would be up on charges. Stop spreading irresponsible rumors.


26 posted on 08/08/2013 11:15:46 PM PDT by EinNYC
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To: EinNYC

Going my media accounts from various sources


27 posted on 08/09/2013 1:35:51 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: GeronL
And where did those particular media get THEIR info? I am IN the system. They are OUTSIDE looking in. No way would a teacher advocate having unmarried sex and no way would a teacher advocate abortion. Abortion might be presented as one choice as to what might be done if an unmarried student gets pregnant, perhaps as part of a debate, but no teacher would stand up in front of a classroom and say, "If you get pregnant, you should have an abortion." Absolutely not. I totally hate how information gets twisted and filtered by people who have an agenda to give out misinformation or slant the information to lend credence to their particular views.

There are plenty of religious people teaching in public schools--Catholics, Orthodox Jews, etc. They would certainly not advocate abortion! So you can't make a blanket condemnation based on what perhaps an individual teacher or a couple of teachers said or did. That would not be valid in any situation, would it?

28 posted on 08/09/2013 1:55:49 AM PDT by EinNYC
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To: EinNYC

It is the pro-sex agenda of the leftwing in NYC

There is no denying the new program exists. It sure made PLANNED PARENTHOOD happy.

The same Planned Parenthood that tells kids and youths with HIV-AIDS to not tell their partners if this would deny them sex. I believe it is a felony in every state, but Planned Parenthood tells them it is their “RIGHT”

http://ippf.org/resource/Healthy-Happy-and-Hot-young-peoples-guide-rights

NY TIMES:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/10/nyregion/in-new-york-city-a-new-mandate-on-sex-education.html?_r=0

“City officials said that while there would be frank discussions with students as young as 11 on topics like anatomy, puberty, pregnancy and the risks of unprotected sex...”

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/25/us/new-york-sex-ed

http://www.wnyc.org/blogs/schoolbook/2012/jan/30/new-sex-education-mandate-takes-effect/

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2011/10/24/does-graphic-nyc-sex-ed-curriculum-program-infringe-on-parental-rights/

assignments include: finding stores that sell condoms and how much they cost; researching where how to get to a clinic that provides birth control and tests for STDs; and “risk” cards that allow the children to learn the relative safety of varying degrees of sexual activity.

refers students to a Columbia University website called “Go Ask Alice” — which details sexual positions, types of sex that don’t include intercourse and more — the Department of Education maintains it is promoting abstinence first.

An op-ed in The New York Times last week calls this opt-out “very limited” in terms of parental control. The op-ed contributors Robert P. George and Melissa Morchella state that it is undeniable the curriculum is “sexualizing children” a younger and younger ages and that mandates such as this “violate parents’ rights”:

But no one can plausibly claim that teaching middle-schoolers about mutual masturbation is “neutral” between competing views of morality; the idea of “value free” sex education was exploded as a myth long ago.

..............

MA and CA now allow self-proclaimed “tranny” kids shower and share bathrooms with the opposite sex. The original MA bll would have punished girls who resisted sharing bathrooms with a “tranny” boy as a hate crime.

.............

Teachers call for leniency to pedophile
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/3052265/posts

those teachers should be fired!!

...............

You say no teacher would ever do that, but its not true


29 posted on 08/09/2013 2:36:33 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: metmom
This thread, on the Obama failure in education, appeared on FR, but the discussion was about something different. Seemed like people hadn't read the full op-ed in Wednesday's WSJ.

Seems it all has to do with deemphasizing the testing that was the heart of No Child Left Behind.

I remember Bush standing on the stage at a Harlem charter school and saying, in that emphatic way he had, "If you don't care about something, why measure it?" The absolute crux of the issue: accountability.

30 posted on 08/09/2013 3:12:02 AM PDT by firebrand
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To: GeronL

“What a rousing success the leftists have had in dumbing down America”

I got the impression from the people making billions from this school system that the test was expected to produce horrible results so they could claim improvement over the next 20 years by inching higher annually; they had to get away from “No Child Left Behind” provisions because those billions (including the large portion directly funneled to the Dems) would disappear if those students could simply switch out of their failing schools.


31 posted on 08/09/2013 4:13:32 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: GeronL

New York really is the next Detroit...


32 posted on 08/09/2013 5:05:48 AM PDT by Hotlanta Mike ("Governing a great nation is like cooking a small fish - too much handling will spoil it." Lao Tzu)
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To: metmom

Schools don’t fail. Students fail.

The schools have failed the students.


That’s crap. The parents have failed their children.


33 posted on 08/09/2013 5:07:12 AM PDT by Hotlanta Mike ("Governing a great nation is like cooking a small fish - too much handling will spoil it." Lao Tzu)
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To: Hotlanta Mike

Well, then, if the parents have failed the children, why aren’t the children getting an education?

It’s supposed to be the teachers who teach, not the parents. After all, they’re the *trained professionals*, right?

If the public education system worked, it would work with or without parental involvement. The fact that it doesn’t work without parental involvement proves that it doesn’t work at all. What works is the parents doing it.

Parents *helping their kids with homework* = homeschooling.

Public school kids who succeed do so in spite of the public education system, not because of it.


34 posted on 08/09/2013 5:29:17 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: GeronL; EinNYC

EinNYC, as my kids would say.

You’ve been PWND.

You simply have no case. What Geron is stating is too widespread, too well known, and too well documented.

Stop while you’re ahead.


35 posted on 08/09/2013 5:32:10 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

I”m a bit surprised at your response, metmom, knowing how you feel about education. You said, “It’s supposed to be the teachers who teach, not the parents.” I have to disagree with this statement somewhat. Teachers ought to be assisting the parent in the training of their children. It’s the very notion that this is fully the teacher’s job that is at the heart of what’s wrong in public education today, is it not?

You also said, “The fact that it doesn’t work without parental involvement proves that it doesn’t work at all.” Again, think about this statement for a moment and the “training up” you’ve done with your own children. The message the parent sends to his/her children about anything, directly informs the values a child has, the decision a child makes. A lack of involvement in a child’s education will send a clear signal to that child about the level of importance the activity of learning ought to receive.

Finally, you said, “Public school kids who succeed do so in spite of the public education system, not because of it.” How do you think they do this? By their own strivings? Well, to a large degree, yes. These students succeed amidst all manner of things that run contrary to learning. But I guarantee you, GUARANTEE YOU, that they do it with the advantage of having a significant adult presence at home exhorting, admonishing, reproving, and, occasionally rebuking them toward the finish line.

No. The role of parents in education is critical. Look in Deuteronomy 6:4-9

Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:
And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:
And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.
And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.
And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.

Parents’ abdication of their responsibility for their children’s education (a responsibility that we, as homeschoolers take to the fullest degree) is an important component (but by no means the only component) of what makes America’s public schools the abysmal failure they are today.


36 posted on 08/09/2013 5:53:37 AM PDT by MarDav
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To: MarDav
I”m a bit surprised at your response, metmom, knowing how you feel about education. You said, “It’s supposed to be the teachers who teach, not the parents.” I have to disagree with this statement somewhat. Teachers ought to be assisting the parent in the training of their children. It’s the very notion that this is fully the teacher’s job that is at the heart of what’s wrong in public education today, is it not?

Yes, but I think you read it wrong.

I was using the argument which educators use. I have heard far too often how parents are not *qualified* to teach because fill in the blank...., as an argument against homeschooling.

I've certainly seen far too often the education establishment take credit for its success. I've seen enough bumper stickers which say *If you (your child) can read this, thank a teacher*.

If they're going to take credit for the success of education, they need to accept responsibility for its failure as well.

If the education establishment worked, it would work without the parents involvement. The fact that the parents are critical to a child's successful education shows that it doesn't do what is claimed, IOW, it doesn't work.

37 posted on 08/09/2013 6:14:44 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: MarDav
Parents’ abdication of their responsibility for their children’s education (a responsibility that we, as homeschoolers take to the fullest degree) is an important component (but by no means the only component) of what makes America’s public schools the abysmal failure they are today.

I see it differently.

The way I see it is that the public education system is an abysmal failure not because of lack of parental involvement, but because it is an abysmal failure inherently, and the only reason it is not universally an abysmal failure is because of parental involvement.

The product is broken, it doesn't work.

38 posted on 08/09/2013 6:17:23 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

I guess I was putting the emphasis on the wrong phrases in your post, just as someone could do with mine insofar as, by citing Deuteronomy, I am suggesting that it falls [solely] to parents to educate (not so sure I disagree with that, by the way), while seeming to go to bat for public schools.

My original notion for engaging this thread was to bemoan all the hand-wringing we here at FR do over what we all know is an institution that, well, needs to be “institutionalized!” Public education in America today is doing great, great harm to our nation. Period. That said, I am a public school teacher. I go in, in David vs. Goliath fashion and hope to hurl a few stones at the giant’s eyes and maybe encourage a few “Israelites” watching from the sidelines along the way. I know my efforts are feeble as compared to what is called for—and that might be, for me, the greatest source of frustration I have with my conservative brethren.

Given that we know how important ideas are, why aren’t we doing whatever we can in trying to “infiltrate” and overthrow liberalism in this stronghold? Where are the conservative teachers, professors, school board members, principals, superintendents? Where’s the engagement of this enemy? Writing articles and blogs—hurling stones through already broken windows might make one feel better for a time, but these “efforts” are the easier ones to engage in and do little to achieve the desired goals. We’ve been reading recently about how failure to reject amnesty, when it comes to illegal immigration will ensure perpetual electoral defeat, how ignoring this issue will deliver a boat-load of like-minded voters over to the democrats. Well, I say conservatives have already been involved in such voter “shipments by fully ceding the ground of education in America to the liberal mindset, where liberal foundations are being laid every year...generation after generation.

I know the more “nationalized” public education becomes, the more difficult the job will be, but simply bemoaning the failure of public education, sitting on the sidelines while all things liberal continue apace in the “American Schoolhouse of ideas”, and then wondering how our nation’s slide can be prevented is, to me, an example of some pretty bad math (not putting two and two together.)


39 posted on 08/09/2013 6:45:54 AM PDT by MarDav
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To: metmom

I think you and I are talking about two distinct groups of parents. There is no question that, to the degree parents are involved, there is a measure of success. The students that I have who are motivated, self-monitoring, industrious when it comes to their learning all have involved, concerned parents. The majority of students in the school where I work, however, do not have such parents. And it is this group that, by and large, abdicate some, most, all (depending on the parent) responsibility when it comes to their children’s learning.

Some of these parents are beyond help. Some of them need a kick in the back-side. Some of these parents need a break. Some of these parents feel trapped and helpless. All of these parents live in/near the neighborhoods where we (you and I and all other Freepers) live. And, they all send their kids to public schools. What to do?

They don’t have the homeschool option (through their own bad choices, lack of knowledge, lack of will—for whatever reason) and they avail themselves of the public school system which, we all know, is doing them no great service. What to do?

Their kids’ learning is diminishing more and more with each passing year. Basic skills are jettisoned in exchange for advanced socialization. They are on the fast track headed toward a lifetime of dependency, misery, poverty. Their limitations will guarantee that they will never be able to function in a society that requires functionality. Eventually, candidates will come along to grant them victimization status/an endless menu of hand-outs (oops—this is already happening). What to do?

At some point, these under-educated masses will comprise the majority (or a near-majority) of our population. Our government apparatus will have to increase to meet the demands of the resulting burgeoning need. The flight from these areas will increase, the degradation of these areas will increase in direct proportion. Cities and large towns will die (lack of skilled workers, too much need, too many taxes). Oops, again. Already happening. What to do?

At some point, we’ll all be asking (somewhere just before the final great collapse), “What could we have done?”


40 posted on 08/09/2013 7:02:34 AM PDT by MarDav
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To: metmom

Well, then, if the parents have failed the children, why aren’t the children getting an education?


Excuse me? Half of all marriages end in divorce, leading to single parent households. Fatherless households among blacks is even higher. Parents failing their children.

Asians including children of immigrants from India stress education for their children. Many of these parents do not speak English very well but their kids excel at school. My wife is from China and we have a 4th and 5th grader. My kids watch NO tv during the week and only a few hours per day on the weekend. Most kids left unsupervised lack the motivation and discipline to practice a healthy routine of learning thereby leaving themselves at a serious disadvantage (look at what is being discussed in the metro Charlotte, NC area as an answer to black males failing in the system). Once again parents failing their children.

All politics are local. School boards. PTA. Parents vote for local political offices and the majority of their property tax is contributed towards the public school. If the parents aren’t involved and active in local politics particularly if their local schools are not making the grade then the parents have failed their children.

Children are the victims, victims of the system and in some cases victims of their parent(s) lack of involvement and not establishing standards, routines and expectations for their kids.


41 posted on 08/09/2013 7:45:03 AM PDT by Hotlanta Mike ("Governing a great nation is like cooking a small fish - too much handling will spoil it." Lao Tzu)
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To: metmom
I question your "documentation". Lies and misinformation can also be "widespread, "well known" and "well documented".

I am speaking from my personal experience of having been in several schools over years. I never saw anyone telling their students to go out and have sex and I never saw anyone advocating their students to have abortions. Perhaps other school systems have that sort of thing going on, but kids would have gotten back to the administration about teachers saying stuff like that and word would have gotten around. In the hundreds of faculty meetings I've attended, no mention of "do not suggest having an abortion in class" was made, nor "do not tell your students it's OK to go out and have sex". Perhaps some of the new young amoral teachers they're hiring now would say stuff like that, but no one that I personally know would. Matter of fact, the people that I know would most assuredly tell the students quite the opposite, in an effort for them to develop some self-esteem. "Don't feel like you have to give in when your boyfriend tells you that if you loved him, you'd let him have sex with you" or any of those other oldie but goodie lines. "Have some respect for yourself and tell a guy like that to hit the road" would be more in line with what my colleagues would say.

42 posted on 08/09/2013 9:29:00 AM PDT by EinNYC
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To: metmom

I hate to sound prejudiced, but some (probably many) kids just aren’t academic material. They belong in farms or factories.

The real problem is the ongoing social revolution, which seems to favor the creative or analytical over the manual or physical. While college is obsessively pushed as the path to a higher-paying job, not everyone has the level intelligence or ability.


43 posted on 08/09/2013 9:46:32 AM PDT by MoochPooch (I'm a compassionate cynic.)
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To: MarDav

I don’t disagree with anything in either of your posts.

My main point is that the system doesn’t work as purported by the eduction establishment. Which does not include those elements, like you, who are trying to do something about it.


44 posted on 08/09/2013 10:06:09 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: MoochPooch

Absolutely.

And some kids can earn some pretty good money at some of those more *menial* tasks.

I had a car mechanic tell me that a good mechanic can earn a six figure salary and there is no shortage of work.


45 posted on 08/09/2013 11:53:59 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: EinNYC

There’s a world of difference between what an individual teacher may tell some students and what official policy is.


46 posted on 08/09/2013 11:55:28 AM PDT by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: MarDav; metmom

Given that we know how important ideas are, why aren’t we doing whatever we can in trying to “infiltrate” and overthrow liberalism in this stronghold?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The best action would be to shut these abominations DOWN!

In many counties and a fair number of states, if conservatives and Christians removed their children from the government schools, the entire evil system would immediately collapse! That is what needs to be done. Then education should be rebuilt on a non-Prussian model that is private and conservative.

If Christians and conservatives teachers are truly conservative and Christian they are warning every parent they meet about the danger government K-12 schooling poses for their child and our nation’s continuing freedom. They are urging these parents to remove their precious children...immediately!

Hopefully, you are doing the right thing.

The problem with Christians and conservatives working in the government schools is that naive parents are beguilled. Hey! If Mrs. Honey Bun, the minister’s wife,( who loves her cat and directs the church’s bell choir), teaches in the godless and Marxist driven government schools, they can’t be **that** bad.. Yes! it is **that* bad to send a child into Marxist controlled schools where they **will** learn to think and reason godlessly just to cooperate in the godless school.


47 posted on 08/10/2013 5:03:52 PM PDT by wintertime
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To: Hotlanta Mike; metmom

Personally, throughout my two careers I have likely had contact with thousands of families.

Anecdotal observation:

There is **NO** difference between the amount of time spent IN THE HOME studying between academically successful institutionalized children and successful homeschoolers.

There is **NO** difference in home habits, either regarding sleep, exercise, and control of electronic entertainment.

My conclusion;

Successful institutionalized kids are being **AFTERSCHOOLED**. This is true even if their parents are immigrants. Someone in the family has been recruited as a tutor.

My conclusion:

Metmom is absolutely correct. If government schools were effective they would work **regardless** of parental imput!

MY conclusion:

The **only ** thing government schools do is send home curriculum for the parents and child to follow IN THE HOME ( at great expense to the taxpayer.)


48 posted on 08/10/2013 5:12:19 PM PDT by wintertime
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To: metmom

I do not think that ANY official entity would sanction teachers to advocate going out and having sex or having an abortion. Unless they have very deep pockets to pay for lawsuits.


49 posted on 08/10/2013 7:21:04 PM PDT by EinNYC
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To: wintertime

“The best action would be to shut these abominations DOWN!”

Sure. Now, let’s deal in reality. Millions and millions of families are sending their kids to public schools. That includes all kinds of Christian parents. Many, many people simply do not have the means or opportunity to either homeschool or send their kids to private schools. While there are all sorts of reasons for that, the fact of the matter is, their kids, along with the millions and millions of non-religious students are in the public schools...and that’s where they will be. We don’t have to like it, but it is reality.

And what that means is that millions and millions of kids are being indoctrinated/saturated with liberalism for 13 of the most important years of their lives...with virtually no exposure whatsoever to the alternative of conservative thought (and we know the power and persuasiveness of group-think—especially on the young.) Well, what kind of voters do you think will emerge from such an education? Will these students be more or less likely to challenge, say, a college professor as they seek further education? What about the ideas they receive from the MSM—will they be looking sideways at the TV when they hear the folks at MSNBC spout the liberal line...or will they give a loud “Amen” and a strong nod of approval? And all for want of a nail, so to speak, the nail being a sufficient number of conservative voices/teachers to temper the liberal line with an equal measure of truth, common sense, wisdom.

Wintertime, you can wish and dream and hope all you want that these schools will shut down. Fact of the matter is, they aren’t about to and this hoped-for expectation, however right-headed in goal, achieves nothing in reality. The education system of America will not die because too many have come to rely on it (however misguided that might be). Conservatives need to look at this as the first step in the ground campaign of any election (I assure you, the liberals view it that way—or no?) Christians need to realize that this is where the sinners are, where the sin is being papered over made to look like reasonable choices (or whatever), and recognize that if you want a society that more strongly reflects Godly values, you had better make sure that those Godly values are properly introduced at an early age into the “conversation” of our next generation of citizens. If you’ve ever raised any children you probably have come to realize that it is easier to shape a child’s tastes/ideas/attitudes/values than it is to change them.

We all agree that America’s public education system must be changed. I say that change will be better accomplished from within.


50 posted on 08/11/2013 5:00:13 PM PDT by MarDav
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