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Is Tiger Woods facing disqualification at Masters?
CBS Sports ^ | 4-12-13 | Kyle Porter

Posted on 04/12/2013 11:09:13 PM PDT by FlJoePa

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To: 11Bush
By not enforcing their own rules, the USGS has chosen tv revenue over fairness and honor of the game.

By not disqualifying himself, Woods has chosen money and self-interest over honor and integrity (both of which he is in desperate need of)

51 posted on 04/13/2013 8:28:29 AM PDT by glennaro
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To: Wyatt's Torch
Tiger was saved by the “HD Replay” rule.

But then done in by the "post-match television interview" rule.

52 posted on 04/13/2013 8:35:11 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: noexcuses

Right. The rules committee told him after he got off 18 that they reviewed his drop and it was legal.

************

Where are you getting that info. No where have I seen they talked to him after the round and before his signing his card. The committee reviewed the tapes while Woods was playing the 18th and made a decision everything was okay and that didn’t require meeting with Woods.

It was only after turning in the scorecard and while in his interview with the media that he indicated he dropped some two yards behind his original lie. After hearing that the rules committee began another review and met with Woods this morning.

Or that is my understanding.


53 posted on 04/13/2013 8:43:58 AM PDT by deport
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To: deport

sounds like Woods definitely dropped too far back
(not trying to break the rules just doing the wrong thing)
but the committee reviewed video evidence before he finished and decided the drop was “eh, close enough”.
but then they hear him describe his intent on TV
and at this point the assess a penalty?

so he’s getting punished for TRYING to violate a rule that the committee already decided he didn’t violate.


54 posted on 04/13/2013 8:53:45 AM PDT by fnord (My life is like the movie Willard, except with hummingbirds)
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To: FlJoePa

I'd like to hear what Dr Rice has to say about this...
but we'll probably only hear from Bob Costas.

55 posted on 04/13/2013 8:54:23 AM PDT by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life :o)
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To: deport
From the rules committee explanation of their ruling:

In preparation for his fifth shot, the player dropped his ball in close proximity to where he had played his third shot in apparent conformance with Rule 26. After being prompted by a television viewer, the Rules Committee reviewed a video of the shot while he was playing the 18th hole. At that moment and based on that evidence, the Committee determined he had complied with the Rules.

After he signed his scorecard, and in a television interview subsequent to the round, the player stated that he played farther from the point than where he had played his third shot. Such action would constitute playing from the wrong place.

56 posted on 04/13/2013 8:55:33 AM PDT by noexcuses
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To: noexcuses
On reflection you are correct that it appears the rules committee didn't indicate to Tiger that his drop was legal.

On the other hand if they or Tiger thought it was illegal he would have not signed the scorecard.

Just my opinion of course.

57 posted on 04/13/2013 8:59:15 AM PDT by noexcuses
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To: fnord; anyone
I have a question for anybody regarding this rule that Tiger Woods violated:

"Proceed under the stroke and distance provision of Rule 27-1 by playing a ball as nearly as possible at the spot from which the original ball was last played."

Since the nearest possible place in all cases is the divot left by the previous shot, how many golfers then go back, drop the ball in the divot and play it form there???

58 posted on 04/13/2013 9:19:10 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: noexcuses
I was referring to "told him after he got off 18 that they reviewed his drop and it was legal."

No where have I seen they met or talked to Woods after he got off 18. In fact Woods says they met this morning not yesterday.


59 posted on 04/13/2013 9:23:16 AM PDT by deport
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To: Uncle Chip
Hmmm. Whewn I was still playing, my fellow players would comment that I hit so close tot he middle of fairways that I porobably have to play out of my own divots day after day. But I don't see how someone can drop in their own divot since a golf ball tends to bounce a little when you drop it at arms length from your body and at shoulder height.

Seriesly, Woods would do well to DQ himself and honor the Rule of Golf. Be a leader, Tiger, not an obamaroid (the rules aren't for me but for thee).

60 posted on 04/13/2013 9:27:23 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: glennaro
Woods has chosen money and self-interest

If you take your own personal bias against Woods out of the equation, you will find that everything worked out fairly for both the officials and Woods.

The officials saw the tape, they saw the divot and they saw where he dropped the ball, just like the rest of the world did. Based on what they saw, they told Woods before he signed the scorecard that was no rules infraction. Had they said there was and assessed him the two stroke penalty, Woods would have signed a correct scorecard and we would never be having this discussion..

THEY SCREWED UP

61 posted on 04/13/2013 9:45:51 AM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: Uncle Chip
how many golfers then go back, drop the ball in the divot and play it form there???

Actually the divot is closer to the hole than where the ball originally was, so the player would drop it again or place it after a failed 2nd drop...

62 posted on 04/13/2013 10:04:05 AM PDT by EVO X
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To: FlJoePa

This “sport” is about signing a correct scorecard. Is the speed of signing measured, or height?


63 posted on 04/13/2013 10:07:45 AM PDT by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: MHGinTN
But I don't see how someone can drop in their own divot

I agree but the rule doesn't say "drop" the ball. It says "play" the ball -- "play the ball as nearly as possible at the spot from which the original ball was last played."

The nearest spot is not where the ball comes to rest after a drop but where your divot was. The divot marks the nearest spot.

64 posted on 04/13/2013 10:08:31 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Kenny Bunk; All
"Tiger has another pal who was a lawyer, a Mr. Obama."
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65 posted on 04/13/2013 10:21:08 AM PDT by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: noexcuses

There is some confusion. Now they’re saying he wasn’t advised by the committee before he signed the score card. It’s Tiger... he’ll have a different set of rules and expectations.


66 posted on 04/13/2013 10:26:22 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: Uncle Chip
Woods needs to appeal this decision as a violation of his 5th Amendment rights that protect him against double jeopardy and being a witness against himself. Did anyone before that post match interview read him his rights???

Forwarded upon receipt to Mr. Algonquin J. Calhoun, Esq.

CC:
The Very Reverend Al Sharpton
The Extremely Reverend Jesse Jackson

67 posted on 04/13/2013 10:30:39 AM PDT by Kenny Bunk (The Obama Molecule: Teflon binds with Melanin = No Criminal Charges Stick)
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To: Hot Tabasco

The rules guy just said on ESPN that they didn’t advise Tiger his drop was legal before he signed the score card. I like Nick Faldo’s opinion. Ultimately... its your score card and you’re suppose to know the rules and follow the rules. Its black and white and if he continues to play it will be a stain on his career. (as if his career doesn’t already have a stain or two)


68 posted on 04/13/2013 10:33:36 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: Wyatt's Torch

I disagree. The HD tv rule explanation, from the USGA’s website, is below:

“This revision to Decision 33-7/4.5 addresses the situation where a player is not aware he has breached a Rule because of facts that he did not know and could not reasonably have discovered prior to returning his score card.”

According to the USGA, the rule only applies if the player is not aware of certain facts. What fact was Tiger not aware of here? Ignorance of the rule is not an excuse. He took the drop, he deliberately dropped two yards away. That is a rule violation. How is he saved by the HD TV rule? That explanation makes no sense.


69 posted on 04/13/2013 10:38:06 AM PDT by Publius Valerius
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To: Kenny Bunk
Forwarded upon receipt to Mr. Algonquin J. Calhoun, Esq.

Please advise as to the pay scale, locations, and schedule for the riots and demonstrations.

70 posted on 04/13/2013 10:40:38 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Publius Valerius

And... he admitted he dropped 2 yards back to gain an advantage. Now if he hit a wedge like I do two yards wouldn’t make a difference :)


71 posted on 04/13/2013 10:43:06 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: Wyatt's Torch

In fact, the illustration of why this is a wrong decision comes from the USGA’s website. As an explanation for the rules, the USGA gives the following example:

As a player’s ball is in motion, he moves several loose impediments in the area in which the ball will likely come to rest.  Unaware that this action is a breach of Rule 23-1, the player fails to include the two-stroke penalty in his score for the hole.  As the player was aware of the facts that resulted in his breaching the Rules, he should be disqualified under Rule 6-6d for failing to include the two-stroke penalty under Rule 23-1.

This is precisely the situation here. Woods was aware of the facts of his violation and he didn’t take the penalty. He should have been DQ’d. It seems pretty apparent that they are ignoring the rules to keep woods in the field. That’s embarrassing.


72 posted on 04/13/2013 10:45:44 AM PDT by Publius Valerius
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To: FlJoePa

This is BS!


73 posted on 04/13/2013 10:48:00 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: kjam22
And... he admitted he dropped 2 yards back to gain an advantage.

That is what the committee must have seized upon -- gaining an advantage from a penalty.

But the fact that he did it so casually at the Masters and was so open about it in the postmatch interview tells me that he has been doing that for quite a while and so have all the other golfers.

74 posted on 04/13/2013 10:49:49 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: kjam22
The rules guy just said on ESPN that they didn’t advise Tiger his drop was legal before he signed the score card

That is true and I was mistaken on that point. However, he also went on to say that the reason he did not speak with Woods was because he and the rules committee, after reviewing the drop on video while Woods was still playing, determined that no infraction had occured.......meaning of course, there was no need to discuss anything with Woods.

While he didn't specifically say so, he certainly implied that if they had determined that Woods had made an improper drop, they would have brought it to his attention so he could take the two stroke penalty and change the scorecard accordingly before it was eventually signed.

As far as knowing the rules and following the rules, that's what the tournament rules committee and on course judges are for when rules issues arise. So fault the committee, not Woods.......

75 posted on 04/13/2013 11:01:52 AM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: Hot Tabasco

I don’t agree. This is Tiger’s fault. Where I fault the committee is they didn’t have the guts to penalize Tiger Woods until people started emailing them and tweeting about it. Tiger is the one who took the illegal drop to gain an advantage.


76 posted on 04/13/2013 11:04:49 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: Uncle Chip

In a perfect world he’ll shoot 78 to day and we won’t see him on television :) I’m semi-retired and play 5 days a week btw. But you won’t see me on television either :)


77 posted on 04/13/2013 11:09:58 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: kjam22
Where I fault the committee is they didn’t have the guts to penalize Tiger Woods until people started emailing them and tweeting about it.

You're now letting your personal bias against Tiger distort your view of the facts........

78 posted on 04/13/2013 11:19:49 AM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: Hot Tabasco

Not at all... if you’re watching the news unfold... they stated that once they started getting emails and tweets about the illegal drop they went back and looked again and gave him the two stroke penalty.


79 posted on 04/13/2013 11:25:25 AM PDT by kjam22 (my newest music video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7gNI9bWO3s)
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To: Publius Valerius

Wrong. He was not aware. Not only that but the Masters made the decision that there was NOT a violation BEFORE he finished his round. Absolutely everyone believed at the time he signed his scorecard that it was correct. Fred Ridley in the interview with Jim Nantz said that precisely because the committee ruled that there was no violation is exactly why a DQ was never in question. Watch the interview. It’s exceptionally clear why they made the correct decision.


80 posted on 04/13/2013 12:25:36 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: FlJoePa

Absolutely fantastic interview with Fred Ridley at the beginning of the CBS broadcast. Surprisingly to me Nantz asked all the tough and right questions. Ridley methodically went through the process the competition committee went through. It’s very clear why he was not DQ’d and also why the two stroke penalty was imposed. Really a great interview by Nantz.


81 posted on 04/13/2013 12:28:32 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: kjam22
they stated that once they started getting emails and tweets about the illegal drop they went back and looked again and gave him the two stroke penalty.

So what's your point?

Nobody, especially me, is arguing against the issuing of the two penalty strokes, that discussion was never held by Fred Ridley and the tournament rules committee until after the 10:00 p.m. phone call from CBS........Here's the transcript.

Master rules chief Fred Ridley tries to explain complicated Tiger Woods penalty

"Ridley said the committee looked at the video while Woods was still on the course but initially decided there had been no rules violation. But when Woods was interviewed by CBS after his round, he admitted that he had made his drop “about 2 yards” behind the original spot, which violated Rule 26-1 regarding playing from the wrong spot. Ridley said he got a call from CBS officials at about 10 p.m. Friday informing of Woods’ comments."

The point I'm trying to make here, and I think I have done it very well, is that prior to the end of Woods's round, the rules committee had determined that his drop was within the rules and thus they had no reason to discuss his action with him and allowed him to submit his card without any penalty.

Who the hell cares about tweets and twitters and emails, they have nothing to do with the lack of action on the part of the rules committee at the time they determined Woods had not violated any rules.

And as I said before, had the rules committee determined from the video that Woods had committed a penalty, they would have told him and Woods would have changed his card accordingly..........and we wouldn't even be discussing this.

82 posted on 04/13/2013 1:41:40 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: Uncle Chip
Please advise as to the pay scale, locations, and schedule for the riots and demonstrations.

Please stand by for a few days as this has driven me back to my law books. Before any street action, we must decide whether Tiger should go home with the Swedish cutie or the skier gal.

83 posted on 04/13/2013 2:24:59 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (The Obama Molecule: Teflon binds with Melanin = No Criminal Charges Stick)
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To: Kenny Bunk

or Rory McIlroy’s girlfriend??? It all has to be by the book.


84 posted on 04/13/2013 2:32:13 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Kenny Bunk

Dennis Miller: “To think the Masters has turned into the Warren Commission over a couch potato in his undies bitching about a foot and a half is hilarious.”


85 posted on 04/13/2013 2:34:24 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: jjotto; Uncle Chip

Jotto, I do not think you are taking this grave situation respectfully. Why a fortnight has not passed since our POTUS and Reggie were with Mr. Woods, giving this ball drop international significance.


86 posted on 04/13/2013 2:40:11 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (The Obama Molecule: Teflon binds with Melanin = No Criminal Charges Stick)
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To: Kenny Bunk
...our POTUS and Reggie were with Mr. Woods...

I'll bet they were!

87 posted on 04/13/2013 2:42:41 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: EVO X

Thats a shame too, because it bounced OFF THE PIN!!! on the shot before


88 posted on 04/13/2013 8:28:43 PM PDT by Mr. K (There are lies, damned lies, statistics, and democrat talking points.)
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Adding link to video from CBS of Woods two shots into the green on 15 which cause the penalty and confusion.

Video CBS - Woods two shots in the 15th green


89 posted on 04/15/2013 6:05:21 AM PDT by deport
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