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Mohammed & Charlemagne Revisited: The Conclusion
New English Review ^ | March 2012 | Emmet Scott

Posted on 03/07/2012 1:39:21 PM PST by wtd

A summary of Emmet Scott's painstakingly detailed and scholarly new book, Mohammed and Charlemagne Revisited: The History of a Controversy is posted at New English Review .


TOPICS: Books/Literature; History; Reference; Religion
KEYWORDS: darkages; fact; fiction; henripirenne; islam
Author Emmet Scott builds upon the controversial work of Belgian historian and scholar Henri Pirene, and presents ample archaeological evidence to question just how coincidental was the expansion of Islam to the utter collapse of classical civilizational and consequent plunge into "The Dark Ages"?

At GatesofVienna co-blogger, Dymphna states:

"His is the best book I've ever read about Islam's initial onslaught against so many countries. The style is superb. It is haunting. So haunting I've read it three times now. This is the first book which has managed to make me see how our whole heritage was skewed, annihilated, and buried from the very beginning."

"His work is impeccable; it will be totally ignored by the consensus media."

This is a book every Westerner should have.

Couldn't agree more!

1 posted on 03/07/2012 1:39:26 PM PST by wtd
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To: wtd
A quote from an 1899 book by Winston Churchill, "The River War", in which he describes Muslims he apparently observed during Kitchener's campaign in the Sudan

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the Queen; all know how to die; but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science - the science against which it had vainly struggled - the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome."

2 posted on 03/07/2012 1:45:54 PM PST by FatherofFive (Islam is evil and must be eradicated)
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To: wtd
A quote from an 1899 book by Winston Churchill, "The River War", in which he describes Muslims he apparently observed during Kitchener's campaign in the Sudan

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the Queen; all know how to die; but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science - the science against which it had vainly struggled - the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome."

3 posted on 03/07/2012 1:53:48 PM PST by FatherofFive (Islam is evil and must be eradicated)
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To: FatherofFive

I am reading Colonel Roosevelt by Edmund Morris. This is the third of his three volume biography of Teddy Roosevelt. If you want to read about one of the most interesting of American men, then take the time to read this three volume set.

In this the last volume, Morris reports about Roosevelt’s nearly one year African safari after his presidency. His trip takes up to the Sudan and Egypt. His thoughts on Islam were quite similar to Churchill’s. It is interesting that 100 years ago. Teddy Roosevelt, Churchill and other great leaders were expressing their disdain of the so-called “religion of peace” as it is anything but, both then and now.


4 posted on 03/07/2012 1:54:49 PM PST by CdMGuy
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To: wtd

After reading the review I understand the basic premise of the author but I guess that without reading the book I won’t understand the tie between Mohammed and Charlemagne. I could see a direct relation between Mo and Charlemagne’s grandfather but other than a time shift of key events it still doesn’t seem to exactly fit. Given the politics and power structures of that millenia the crusades would have probably still failed even 400 years earlier.


5 posted on 03/07/2012 2:08:13 PM PST by RJS1950 (The democrats are the "enemies foreign and domestic" cited in the federal oath)
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To: CdMGuy
Interesting. I looked up the set and Amazon provides an audio podcast interview with the author, Edmund Morris, who 02:11 reveals
"He [Roosevelt] left for depths of British East Africa which is my own ancestral country."
This authors ancestral perspective provides added interest to this work. Thanks for the heads up.
6 posted on 03/07/2012 2:15:07 PM PST by wtd
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To: CdMGuy

I’m reading The Rise of Theodore Roosevelt right now. It is an incredible book.

I’m no fan of Teddy, but the book is amazingly well written and enjoyable to read. Can’t wait to get into the next two.


7 posted on 03/07/2012 2:19:44 PM PST by Retired Greyhound (.)
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To: RJS1950

which crusades?

there were five.

they all failed?

BullShiite


8 posted on 03/07/2012 2:23:25 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: LurkingSince'98

I believe there were at least nine Crusades.


9 posted on 03/07/2012 2:32:42 PM PST by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: wtd

Ping for later


10 posted on 03/07/2012 2:54:04 PM PST by Chainmail
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To: wtd

Ping for later


11 posted on 03/07/2012 2:54:09 PM PST by Chainmail
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To: Let's Roll

BTTT !


12 posted on 03/07/2012 3:06:09 PM PST by Let's Roll (Save the world's best healthcare - REPEAL, DEFUND Obamacare!)
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To: RJS1950
Belgian scholar Henri Pirenne offered a new and revolutionary interpretation of the evolution of Europe from the time of Constantine to that of Charlemagne. Pirenne’s major thesis is that it was the advance of Islam rather than the Germanic invasions that caused the break with antiquity and the consequent decline of Western civilization in the Middle Ages.”

He argues that in the Merovingian period (500-751) and the years from the success of the Germanic invasion until Charlemagne that the empire survived in an uneasy union of the original peoples and the invaders and that only very gradually was there any noticeable decline in economy. Charlemagne, son of Pippin, became king in 768 upon the death of his father and inherited his father’s Roman policy. In 774 he not only again defeated a rising Lombard threat but declared himself their king. Charlemagne remained in northern Europe and gave the Lombards a significant degree of home rule. The Carolingian world gravitated toward the north and west, though it included Italy, and away from the (lost) Mediterranean.

On Dec. 25, 800 Charlemagne was crowned emperor of Christianity. This crowning was not quite on the Byzantine model. There the emperor was acclaimed by the people. Charlemagne was acclaimed by Rome. It was in the church’s acclamation, not the people of Europe in which his power rested.

By 812 Charlemagne concluded peace with Byzantium and he ceded Venice and Sicily, thus effectively creating an empire with no access to the Mediterranean.

“The Empire of Charlemagne was the critical point of the rupture by Islam, of the European equilibrium.”

“The Carolingian Empire, or rather, the Empire of Charlemagne, was the scaffolding of the Middle Ages. The State upon which it was founded was extremely weak and would presently crumble. But the Empire would survive as the higher unity of Western Christendom.” link

13 posted on 03/07/2012 3:19:21 PM PST by wtd
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To: wtd

Interesting article.

And then the author has to drag in some idea about three centuries having just been “inserted” into the calendar around 1000.

It is difficult for me to express how ludicrous this notion is. We have Chinese, Indian, Mayan calendars and historical records from these “missing centuries.” Seems to me there are also real problems with astronomical calculations if this is taken to be a fact.

I guess the author was serious in this claim, but I find it quite difficult to believe he was.


14 posted on 03/07/2012 7:48:44 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: wtd

it makes sense. The “barbarians” who invaded may have ended the Emperor’s rule but they did not touch the existing structures — after all they needed those to rule. Alaric was heavily Romanized for instance...


15 posted on 03/07/2012 11:41:23 PM PST by Cronos (Party like it's 12 20, 2012)
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To: Sherman Logan

He inserted those ideas - not his own and not because he advocated them, but to accentuate the fact that the current politically driven (PC)historic record leaves open too many questions that do not jibe with evidence at hand.

His book makes his argument in an entertaining and captivating manner. I highly recommend it.


16 posted on 03/08/2012 8:07:29 AM PST by wtd
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To: wtd

Always interested in new ways of looking at things.

It is always good, however, to remember that absence of evidence does not always constitute evidence of absence.


17 posted on 03/08/2012 8:10:40 AM PST by Sherman Logan
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