Ft. Hood heroine and daughters
Posted on 11/06/2009 9:44:43 PM PST by Minn
If I heard Mark Levin correctly, a civilian policewoman, that wasn't even on the scene when the rampage started, is the one that brought down Hasan with four shots, while getting shot herself. So a military base is incapable of of defending itself, and waits helplessly until a 911 call brings the cops? A brave woman is defends dozens unarmed and helpless soldiers and takes a bullet doing so? No MPs nearby? No side arms on anybody? Gun control at an Army base?
And this surprises you, why? Do you think we all run around armed to the teeth?
Yep.
Oh, and the Air Force has bases.
The Army has Forts and Posts.
Large bases will use civilian police on base. It’s normal. I don’t know why.
For some reason, this reminds me of the barracks attack in Beirut.
Shut up now, before you say something even more ignorant than you have.
Kim Munley is a hero. I just went on her twitter page, she has over 2,000 followers now. I posted a message to her so that when she recovers, she can see all the well wishes that have been sent to her
1: My understanding is that firearms are VERY tightly controlled on miltary bases. Only the MPs are *supposed* to have them, outside of (obviously) firearms training.
2: So what if it was a woman?
3: I thought I heard she was a civvy cop doing some kind of aux duty there, meaning, she was already there, didn’t have to wait for a 911 call to the “regular” police.
Corrections welcomed.
IIRC, this woman patriot was off duty but on base. Heard the call on her radio, and went to the scene. She was retired military, married to military man and had joined the civ police force for the base.
We need people like her...desperately.
Part of the why is manpower decisions made back in the 90s. An installation may have needed a battalion of MPs to do everything that needed doing; but they were only authorized a company and often an understrength one at that.
Some bean-counter somewhere convinced someone in Alexandria that DoD cops were cheaper in the long run.
Big time. I so look forward to her interviews. She IS an amazing lady, I'm sure. Rest well, Ms. Munley. Best of care.....
You know I was thinking that also, but I think tact is still a virtue.
this is her twitter page
http://twitter.com/hope2forget30
Normally I would not post someone’s twitter page but since Kim is an American hero and is recovering from her injuries, I think we should bombard her twitter page with messages of support and prayers so that when she is able to go on twitter she can see the thousands of wonderful messages to her. I think it will brighten her day
Thank you so much for bringing this up. It makes me crazy when people refer to an “Army base”.
MAJ, USA(Ret)
There is a large civilian police force on the base. She was on the scene in a matter of minutes - 3 minutes according to one report. That’s not too shabby. However, what worries me is they assumed the monster was dead because he was lying still. Imagine if he’d started firing again.
Because soldiers on training posts such as Fort Hood are there to train to fight in combat, not as cops.
Minn..
You do realize that there are strict controls on carrying loaded weapons on a stateside military installations. Weapons are typically kept in secure locations and must be signed in and signed out for specific purposes such as training on firing ranges.
A soldier would quickly be questioned by base authorities if they were seen with a weapon in an unusual area such as an office facility.
Plus Minn..do you realize just how big Fort Hood is? Its basically a small city, with over 33,000 people living there...
Civilian police work hand in hand with military police on these installations and provide valuable backup in dangerous situations such as this.
The police officer involved here that stopped the shooter is no less a hero than the troops who responded to the tragedy.
Job well done to save lives, Officer.
Yep. The same bean-counters convinced DoD to outsource base operations such as consolidated mess facilities (no more KP for troops), maintenance facilities, engineering, housing maintenance, etc.
I don't know. I know absolutely nothing about the logistics of an army fort, but it seems that, given that it's a military installation, it wouldn't take three or four minutes for somebody to get their hands on a weapon. Of all the dozens of people caught in this storm, nobody had a side arm? Is that a result of policy? Is this only on domestic installations?
Maybe I've just watched too many war movies with officers with guns on their hips. Maybe that's not reality. Still, isn't every collection of soldiers always a potential target of somebody? And since they are, shouldn't there be some protocol that prevents mass groups of them in uniform finding themselves defenseless, whether in Iraq or Texas?
On war zone bases, almost everyone is armed.
Not always the case on the domestic bases.
With respect to the "disarming of the base", it has been a policy for decades - predating WWII at least - that soldiers in garrison and not on duty, or working as MPs, not be armed. It's nothing new.
You've watched WAY too many movies. Military weapons are secured - completely - when not in use for duty or training. They are stored in on-base armories that are high-security areas where deadly force is authorized, and are guarded with armed sentries 24/7. It's virtually impossible to "get your hands on a weapon within minutes".
Actually, it was my experience that it took well over 3-4 minutes to have a weapon issued. The first question would be why? There would have to be a reason for that weapon to leave an arms room, and my recollection is that weapons would be drawn for training exercises or for military drill and ceremonies.
Yeah, you probably have watched a lot of movies with officers “six shooters ablazin” or .45 cal. Makes it kinda glamorous really! Even when I was overseas, I was never issued my sidearm unless I was doing my annual marksmanship qualification, going on a field training exercise, if I had Staff Duty Officer duty, or responding to an readiness alert situation.
It is presumed that soldiers, sailors, airmen, and marines are safe in the United States, and thus don’t need to be armed to the gills. Sadly, that’s not reality all the time. Some Army posts do not allow troops to go off-post in military uniform simply because some communities are touchy about it. Which really sucks if you think about it, since we’re there to train to defend their right to be touchy about it!
Mass groupings in a combat zone are a different story. In a combat zone, or a “hot” area, troops are armed and not defenseless. However, that doesn’t mean they get to take their weapon on a joy ride through downtown bumf—k Egypt! :)
I hope this clarifies it a bit for you. Please fire away if you still have questions.
I suppose that makes sense; for protection of valuable property, and keeping weapons off the civilian market, if nothing else.
It'll be interesting to see what security changes will be made domestically. Going to work on a base will be like going to the airport.
The base has a civilian police department. Guards at most bases are civilians these days
It depends on what base, or what area of the base you're in, but right now it can very much be like going to an airport. Try to get into Fr. Deitrick in MD. It's unbelievable security.
Sadly, base violence isn't anything new, just something that's been forgotten. During the 60's, there were several incidents where anti-war extremists and Black Panthers and other social malcontents literally attacked bases and reserve centers actually trying to gain access to ammo/explosive depots as well as armories. Which is one reason that equipment and those commodities are so tightly secured today.
Heads should roll over this utter embarrassment of a military installation unable to defend itself, but under the Obama administration, I don’t expect anything much to come of this in terms of disciplinary actions.
I understand these policies to a point, but if Muslims have turned on fellow soldiers in war zones, why would anyone think that couldn’t happen at a base or post stateside?
Most of the MPs are overseas!
She was a civilian employed at the base.
Haven’t been able to carry privately owned weapons on post for awhile.
Matter of fact I had a friend get “busted” for having a few .38 rounds in his desk drawer in the barracks. No weapon, just the ammo. Pretty stupid but these are the times we live in.
When I was with the French one officer told me about his American Marine friend that could not go to parts of the ship during the black power period (black racism), I said of course I remember those days and the French officer pointed out that in the French army the NCOs and Officers carry loaded sidearms even in garrison ( I checked, his pistol was loaded, in France, during peacetime), and they can shoot to kill, he could not understand how a Marine officer could be made so impotent among his rebellious underlings on his own ship.
Even our NCOs and officers are unarmed on base.
Save the ammo for the bad guys.
Because Police and Military are trained differently. Sending cops to battle makes as much sense as sending an infantry battalion to police a city. Why there were no MPs? Beats me. Sounds pretty slack.
It also sounds like a bad idea to start shuffling M4s out of storage as soon as you hear gunshots.
ditto - doing homework before putting a mouth in gear saves face...
ah, clearly civilian ignorance is rampant when it comes to all things military.
our msm is the first offender
maybe we need a tutorial on life in the military and life on a military post.
Stupidity is highly underrated .....
I mean overrated........
Im not sure what I mean
Thanks for the explanation. It still doesn't make any sense to me, but thanks.
Ft. Hood heroine and daughters
God Bless her.
Lord, keep her healthy.
Amen to that!
All arguments used to explain this serious issue that rendered our troops vulnerable Wednesday sound exactly like those used by the anti-Second Amendment folk.
She could not possibly have been off duty, or she’d have been unarmed.
I don’t think you get the full gist of it yet. Even PRIVATE weapons can not be kept on your person or in your vehicle.
Keyboard Kommando
Where were the Base MPs?
The Base Commander has some splaining to do about the lack of security.
LOL Not really. It’s just that if there was one place in the country where this massacre SHOULDN’T have happened, it’s on a military base/post. It’s incongruent. While it might make sense to some of you current or former military people for 95% of the base populaton to be unarmed, it’s incomprehensible to the rest of us.
I worked on a post in Germany a while back, so I’m not a completely ignorant civilian. That particular post was a training post for younger soldiers, and I understand the one comment about not wanting every 18 year-old having a loaded firearm. OTOH, I’ve spent time in Israel where it’s SOP for those on active duty to go about their daily business in town carrying an Uzi.
How about....."Stupidity is highly undereducated."..?
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