Posted on 08/11/2008 7:48:29 AM PDT by Robbin
I saw the local police are angry about the swat team going into the Mayors house. Not only are they Friends of the mayor, the local Police Chief said that if one of his guys had been driving by when 5 heavily armed men in plain clothes and masks were kicking in the Mayor’s front door, they would have been fired on them thinking they were terrorists attacking the mayor’s home.
Besides the shooting of dogs for no reason, which is bad enough, why do they have masks over their faces? Bad guys were masks so they can’t be identified after they rape and kill. How is a home owner suppose to know they are cops? No uniforms and Masks on their faces???? So I’m suppose to take their word for it when they yell “Police Officer” over the sound of gun fire in my house while they kill my dogs?
Now I expect an excuse that only a cop, protecting another cops actions could believe, but there has to be SOME logic behind wearing masks while serving a KNOCK warrant. I mean surly the average citizen would throw open the door to five armed men in plain cloths wearing masks because they said they had a warrant wouldn’t they??? There are a lot of cops on the board, So what is it? Why would cops serving a warrant wear MASKS?
Robbin
So you can’t identify them...................after the fact ..........
Private camera film that could get out to the public.
I suspect that the excuse offered will be something along the line of “we can’t be revealing the faces and identities of our undercover agents” or some claptrap like that.
You raise a good question here. If it looks like a thug, walks and talks like a thug, and wears a mask and/or bandana like a thug?
Forget the steeeenkin’ badge they might be carrying, it’s a THUG!
Have you considered writing to them and asking?
So no one can retaliate.
Can’t really blame them.
Switch to a language you know.
“Bad guys were masks so they can’t be identified after they rape and kill.”
“Why would cops serving a warrant wear MASKS?”
For the same reason, more or less; USUALLY without the “rape”, though...
Shame.
I think the excuse used was that these were undercover plainclothes guys. Having their faces show up in the newspaper or being seen by drug dealers would end their undercover usefulness. Note---I do NOT agree with the preceding. "Dynamic entry" raids are simply unacceptable for any reason other than an active hostage situation.
They shouldn't.
Period.
Caveat: Unless there is some reasonable suspicion that they'll be dealing with noxious substances. In that case a properly trainedHaz-Mat team should be wearing protective breathing gear. That's it.
There's no other justification for this crap. If there are 'undercover' officers involved, they should be just that; 'undercover'.
Let the guys in blue suits with plainly visible badges serve the Warrants.
L
>>There has to be some excuse for wearing masks, I want to know what it is...
In case they kill a lot of innocent people...
This city seems to have a militarize your police mentality not a community policing policy. The cops delivered the drugs there an hour earlier so should have been aware of the circumstances in the home.
When I trained for this 20yrs ago, here are the reason they gave us for wearing masks: (ultimatly, higher-up ruled out masks for us.)
Shock and Awe.
Some members of the entry team may be undercover/or need to be again, so all members wear masks.
To avoid photographs/video appearances.
I think the excuse used was that these were undercover plainclothes guys.
______
So these guys were both undercover plainclothes and members of their “dynamic entry” team? Does that sound right to any of the LEOs on the forum? Are there not completely different skillsets involved?
However, the need for such measures is now long past, and modern SWAT teams just like to dress up in their nifty Ninja outfits and show off their "kewl" toys, if for anything to maintain their annual budgets and justifiy their continuing existence.
No excuse for it now.
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Because sometimes the cops are the bad guys? (Remember that the American conservative skepticism of the goodness state power has to take in not just the courts, our elected branches of government, and the permanent bureacracy of the executive, but the police as well.)
First off let me say I do not condone or approve of ne knock raids but to answer your question, it makes for a les discerable target. Ablob coming through the door of all the same color is just that, a blob. Without the mask theface provides contrast and..a target. In other words face mask would result in fewer head shots by an armed home owner.
Let’s see. Wearing a mask so that one might avoid prosecution is a valid excuse, but wearing a mask so as not to compromise the identity of an undercover officer is claptrap. And the officer is a thug as well as the perp. My, what a thrilling journey into the land of moral relativism! Next time you’re in trouble I suggest you call a Libertarian or the ACLU. Then you can kiss your ass good-bye with a warm and fuzzy feeling.
They wear masks so you cannot identify them and sue them for their Nazi SS actions. Or bring them up on charges for that matter.
Were they masks or just the typical face shields?
The face shields are normal.
Masks, not so much...
Sorry about misspellings and lack of spaces, keyboard not working right and didn’t proof read.
I always poof read.
I certainly don't expect the police to protect me. Thats a pipe dream. Arm and protect yourself if you want to live.
Tactical entry teams are mostly made up of sworn personnel throughout the agency. In smaller agencies, many tactical teams are made up of representatives of several agencies. Few police departments have full time tactical. Even the Michigan State Police use officers from around the State that are normally assigned other duties until a call out.
So, in light of the above, it is not unusual to have someone on the tactical team also be on a drug team. It happens all the time. Few agencies are big enough to allow this level of specialization.
However, since this was a drug related arrest most likely the masks were worn to conceal the identity of the undercover officers. My confusion to this entire event is that this was intially reported as a tactical team entry.
By the way, the masks do protect the face from flying glass and other things that can go wrong on a dynamic entry.
I do agree with the one poster that suggests that the tactical team entry flies in the face of the community policing concept.
I was raised to believe and support local law enforcement because it is only at this level that any community control can exist. We are rapidly headed towards more regional law enforcement. As this happens, incidents like this will occur. The locals know where the mayor lives out of towners do not.
My hubby was part of a swat team years ago and I believe they wear masks for two reasons. To protect their faces from flying debris and intimidation.
There is no good excuse for wearing a mask while enforcing the law. None. Yes, there needs to be some safeguards for informants (properly vetted) and narcotics officers but very strict safeguards. Nobody said that it was gonna be easy guys... Masked LEOs look and act like terrorists, one day that will backfire especially in today’s climate.
PDs and SOs need to get back to tried and true civilian law enforcement techniques. Body armor? Well sure, under uniforms that are clearly marked, faces unmasked. Warrants served properly, above board. Now “dynamic entries” are used for the least excuse instead of major incidents such as hostage situations.
High-powered weaponry? Sure, but in the cruiser, handy and ready (not locked in the trunk like LAPD policy) in case of situations like the Bank of America shootout. And of course, only with proper and certifiable (plus minimum bi-annual) training with those weapons.
Meanwhile Mr. Mayor and family are terrorized, family pets shot down in their own house in front of them, at the very least in this situation, these were folks that all LEOs of that town ARE SUPPOSED TO KNOW and there were many, many opportunities to make their case without terror tactics—if they had a case...
Their peace of mind and feeling of security is no more, a very heavy price to pay and for what?
If that is true, why isn't he dead?
I think your post represents 98.5% of America.
Thats quite a stretch. Keep it simple. They wear masks because they think they are Lone Rangers. Only they don’t just shoot the gun out of the bad guys hand.
A lot of the ‘masks” you see are actually flash hoods. They are cotton, wool, or Nomex hoods that protect the wearer from being burned by the flash from an explosion. Flash Bangs, booby traps, a weapons discharge, drug labs are all dangers that are faced by officers making a dynamic entry.
You answered your own question right there.
Because thats what the cops in all the cool tv shows and action movies do.
Nope, they wear full body armor during an entry and wearing a mask creates one solid target where someone would aim center of mass, a bare face creates a vulnerable target.
The libertarian can give you the gun training you need and the ACLU man knows all the good lawyers. The cops are too busy seizing people's cash to concern themselves with your penny-ante robbery call.
Yes, and as we all know, when a rapist/murderer is inside your house, a call to 911 will bring the police to your house in time to save you and/or your life.
Or, not.
How fast they arrive depends upon just how fresh the coffee and donuts are at the local hangout.
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Because he was out of sight when the initial break-in occurred?
The proof that they were trigger-happy is that they killed the dogs that weren't attacking
This is a SWAT team from Prince Georges County MD- they probably got their training by watching reruns of “The A Team” (Don’t you look at me, FOOL!”
Was the mask made of cotton or of bulletproof aramid?
http://www.diytrade.com/china/4/products/2851219/bulletproof_ballistic_mask_visor_face_shield.html
Great idea - then the poster can then experience the thugs beating in his door and shooting his dogs, all while wearing a face cover...
>My hubby was part of a swat team years ago and I believe they wear masks for two reasons. To protect their faces from flying debris and intimidation.<
Someone breaking into my home wearing a mask will immediately intimidate me into firing 12 guage slugs at their head.
I realize this isn’t the desired response but it’s how Uncle Sam taught me to respond to threats. I didn’t have any left leaning professors guiding me during my younger years.
Great thinking! Look how well that approach worked for David Koresh!
If someone calls a cop to get them out of trouble then the effect will be the same.
You're right. It's so much smarter to lie down and curl into the fetal position while whimpering "Please don't hurt me!" when people in masks break down your door. Home invasions go so much more smoothly that way, don't you think?
I don't call anybody.
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