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LA Times: Concealed carry reciprocity Ďabsurd and dangerousí
guns.com ^ | Dec. 6, 2016 | Brian Seay

Posted on 12/06/2016 4:08:00 PM PST by PROCON


The Los Angeles Times editorial board says the Donald Trump backed, NRA push for nationwide concealed carry reciprocity is bad for public safety, calling it “absurd and dangerous” in a piece published Saturday.

Lawmakers have four bills drafted that would make concealed carry reciprocity a federal law allowing gun owners licensed to carry in one state, to be able to carry in any other state. The Times calls it an effort to “dismantle state and local gun-control laws,” driving nationwide concealed carry laws “to the lowest common denominator” by allowing people to get carry permits in states with less stringent training requirements, and then lawfully carrying in any other state.

“They could become law,” writes the editorial board. “That would be a disaster for public safety and a cynical usurpation of the long-standing right of states to determine their own gun laws.”

Supporters of reciprocity say such a measure is the ultimate embodiment of Americans’ Second Amendment right.

“The individual right to carry a firearm in defense of our lives and our families does not and should not end at any state line,” said NRA CEO Wayne LaPierre in a video after the Nov. 8 election.

“A driver’s license works in every state, so it’s common sense that a concealed carry permit should work in every state,” reads an outline of Trump’s Second Amendment platform.

But the Times refuted that point, saying, “all states follow similar standards for issuing driver’s licenses, and basic vehicle and traffic laws are largely standardized. That’s not so for gun laws, which vary widely by state, not to mention that county and city governments are allowed to enact their own restrictions based on local needs and preferences.”

“It would be ironic to see conservatives who long have professed a belief in states’ rights override states’ choices in this area,” said Erwin Chemerinsky, dean of the University of California Irvine School of Law, according to the Associated Press.

Chemerinsky says Congress likely doesn’t have the constitutional authority to order states to honor reciprocity, but could encourage compliance by threatening to withhold federal funding.

“Whether a federal reciprocity law could withstand a constitutional challenge will depend on its final wording,” reads the Times editorial. “But we can’t be confident the Supreme Court will continue to defer to the states. Reasonable minds in Congress need to head this off before the NRA and its legislative acolytes make American [sic] even more dangerous by undercutting reasonable gun controls.”


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Government
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; banglist; reciprocity; statesrights
LOL, so when did the L.A. Slimes start being concerned with states rights?

Good comments at link, one in particular:

It's going to happen.

The SCOTUS ruling on gay marriage has set the precedent.

1 posted on 12/06/2016 4:08:00 PM PST by PROCON
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To: PROCON; mylife; Joe Brower; MaxMax; Randy Larsen; waterhill; Envisioning; AZ .44 MAG; umgud; ...

RKBA Ping List

This list is for all things pertaining to the 2nd Amendment.

Please FReepmail me to be added to or deleted from this ping list.

2 posted on 12/06/2016 4:08:52 PM PST by PROCON (Onto the Great American Rebirth!)
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To: PROCON

Concerned with public safety while supporting sanctuary cities....?

BAHAHAHAHAHAHA


3 posted on 12/06/2016 4:09:11 PM PST by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
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To: PROCON

I’m more concerned about illegals with drivers licenses with no driver training and no insurance.


4 posted on 12/06/2016 4:10:29 PM PST by Veggie Todd (The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. TJ)
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To: PROCON

Right - who wants gangs to have licenses to carry when they can just steal what they want? Don’t need no stinkin’ licenses.


5 posted on 12/06/2016 4:10:59 PM PST by SkyDancer (Ambtion Without Talent Is Sad - Talent Without Ambition Is Worse)
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To: 2banana

If we seized all guns, what would the “innocent” aggrieved do? They might resort to using their cars and cooking knives . . . . Wait . . . Some do rather than use guns. I guess I’m going to have to rethink this. In Israel they use mostly knives but in “largely” gun free Europe they mostly use guns?? What am I to believe? We can’t discredit Islam, it’s the religion of piece.


6 posted on 12/06/2016 4:15:23 PM PST by JimSEA
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To: PROCON

It will become dangerous only for the LA Slimes beloved BLMers and LaRaza street thugs.


7 posted on 12/06/2016 4:16:02 PM PST by Grampa Dave (Hey, whining losers,Trump will just go ahead & make things better for us without you!!!!")
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To: Veggie Todd

I’m more concerned about illegals with drivers licenses with no driver training, no insurance and not able to read road signs in English, driving sober or under some influence.


8 posted on 12/06/2016 4:18:00 PM PST by Grampa Dave (Hey, whining losers,Trump will just go ahead & make things better for us without you!!!!")
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To: SkyDancer

The Bill of Rights shall not be abridged without constitutional amendment.


9 posted on 12/06/2016 4:18:24 PM PST by HARRY TUTTLE (Do your duty in all things. You cannot do more. You should never wish to do less. R. E. Lee)
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To: Grampa Dave

Touche’.


10 posted on 12/06/2016 4:19:48 PM PST by Veggie Todd (The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. TJ)
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To: PROCON

The USSC decision on Roe V Wade has been the most deadly Federal Rule ever, and it seems to have crossed all state lines. I guess they don ‘t mind deaths as long as it’s innocents.


11 posted on 12/06/2016 4:23:28 PM PST by Big Giant Head
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To: PROCON
LOL, so when did the L.A. Slimes start being concerned with states rights?

No doubt. And it's the same old tired BS the hoplophobes vomited all over the media about the shall issue CCW laws.

12 posted on 12/06/2016 4:30:13 PM PST by MileHi (Liberalism is an ideology of parasites, hypocrites, grievance mongers, victims, and control freaks.)
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To: PROCON

13 posted on 12/06/2016 4:30:14 PM PST by Boomer
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To: PROCON
“all states follow similar standards for issuing driver’s licenses,

Really? All states issue driver licenses to illegal aliens? And Congress did provide nationwide concealed carry for cops during the Bush administration.

14 posted on 12/06/2016 4:30:41 PM PST by Yogafist
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To: PROCON

Well it figures THEY’D say that,\.

But it doesn’t matter what they say or think.

It’s GOING to happen. We’ll just “Deem it passed” if necessary, just like O-Hole and his dems did with Obamacare.

Karma is going to be a REAL bitch for these snowflakes.


15 posted on 12/06/2016 4:31:03 PM PST by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: HARRY TUTTLE

I don’t understand your point. Gangs do not need licenses only law abiding citizens do.


16 posted on 12/06/2016 4:34:10 PM PST by SkyDancer (Ambtion Without Talent Is Sad - Talent Without Ambition Is Worse)
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To: PROCON

LA Slime tears are sweet and fitting.


17 posted on 12/06/2016 4:48:33 PM PST by backwoods-engineer (It's Morning in America. Again.)
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To: PROCON

I have to get an FBI background check to get a concealed carry license in TX. I don’t see why I suddenly become more dangerous to anyone when I travel to another state.


18 posted on 12/06/2016 4:48:34 PM PST by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: PROCON

LaTimes ruined its amazing franchise —basically ruling the print media for a region of twenty million people) ————— by its perennially extreme leftist slant in it’s “news” - the slant is at least as patent on page 1 as it is on the opinion page. ( Also recall this is the paper there STILL
hiding the tape of O’s strong islamonazi remarks at an islamonazi function he participated in. )


19 posted on 12/06/2016 4:49:15 PM PST by faithhopecharity ("Politicians are not born. They're excreted." Marcus Tullius Cicero)
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To: NFHale

I’m concerned about how the bills I’ve seen are written. I live in NJ and am afraid I will still be screwed because I can’t get a CCW from my home state. I have several others but NJ is No Issue unless you are part of a select political upper class. Any National CCW has to help people like me, NYC, most of CA, HI and maybe a few others I’m missing to be effective.


20 posted on 12/06/2016 4:50:01 PM PST by alephnull (Islam is not a religion of peace. It is a cult of death.)
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To: PROCON

Perhaps the LAT can tell us which jurisdiction in the last 20 years has seen a spike in violent crime AFTER implementing a “shall issue” CCW policy?


21 posted on 12/06/2016 4:52:43 PM PST by G Larry (America has the opportunity to return to God.)
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To: PROCON

I travel across the country by car a lot. It is a pain (not to mention unsafe) to have to change my route or not carry. I live in a state that is totally as issue (no classes needed)but travel to other states that so far don’t have a problem with me carrying without a class.


22 posted on 12/06/2016 5:01:53 PM PST by reaganaut (Yes I am female, yes I love guns, yes I carry and yes I reload and handload my own ammo.)
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To: PROCON
“It would be ironic to see conservatives who long have professed a belief in states’ rights override states’ choices in this area,” said Erwin Chemerinsky, dean of the University of California Irvine School of Law, according to the Associated Press.

It would be entertaining to see a dean of a law school twist himself into a pretzel explaining how the Bill of Rights can be overridden by any state and give examples of any conservatives claim that any Amendment to the BoR could be overridden by state's rights. I don't know of any.

23 posted on 12/06/2016 5:02:07 PM PST by TigersEye (Congratulations, President Donald J. Trump! - Let's MAGA!!!)
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To: reaganaut
You make a very good point, and there are many who share your concern.

It's why National reciprocity is important.

Heck, if I want to travel from my home state of Washington into Oregon to visit friends, I have to unload and store my handgun as Oregon doesn't have reciprocity with adjoining state Washington.

It's insane!

24 posted on 12/06/2016 5:16:26 PM PST by PROCON (Onto the Great American Rebirth!)
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To: PROCON

It’s actually part of the Fed job to ensure the bill of rights is protected in the States. They’ve been asleep at the wheel for a long while on that per 2nd A.

The only reason the states copied bill of rights elements into their own constitutions was to doubly ensure there wouldn’t be a problem.

Lot of good that did.


25 posted on 12/06/2016 5:22:12 PM PST by fruser1
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To: PROCON

the 2a is national.

yet we are infringed.

yet people with drivers licenses - a prvilege - kill way more people than law abiding gun owners do a year, and all states recognize a non-right privilege.

yet marriage is nationally recognizes across states.

it is hardly absurd to permit ah explicitly guaranteed constitutinl right.

ifthey go this way stop recognizing sodomite and lesbian marriages, the state laws are still there.


26 posted on 12/06/2016 5:28:01 PM PST by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: 2banana

The LA Slimes is a fifth-column leftist media rag giving aid and comfort to the enemy.


27 posted on 12/06/2016 5:28:21 PM PST by Carl Vehse
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To: PROCON

“But the Times refuted that point, saying, “all states follow similar standards for issuing driver’s licenses, and basic vehicle and traffic laws are largely standardized. That’s not so for gun laws, which vary widely by state, not to mention that county and city governments are allowed to enact their own restrictions based on local needs and preferences.”

The Times refuted nothing. The Times is making our case. Just substitute “gun laws” with “free speech rights” and try the same rationale.

This will put a spotlight on $hitholes like NJ which has some of the most abusive and unconstitutional gun restrictions in the nation. A State does not have the right to infringe on any of our constitutional rights. It can hardly be argued that NJ’s laws are reasonable when NJ is surrounded by states that allow concealed carry, Class III permits, etc.


28 posted on 12/06/2016 5:29:10 PM PST by Constitutional Patriot (Socialism is the cancer of humanity.)
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To: PROCON

Liberals don’t trust what they cannot control.


29 posted on 12/06/2016 5:32:22 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (Conservatives love America for what it is. Liberals hate America for the same reason.)
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To: PROCON

Freedom? Or no Freedom? If gays can marry in states that don’t want them to, then we should be allowed to carry in states that don’t want us to.


30 posted on 12/06/2016 5:33:18 PM PST by Yaelle
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To: PROCON
LOL, so when did the L.A. Slimes start being concerned with states rights?

...or laws?

31 posted on 12/06/2016 5:46:50 PM PST by BookmanTheJanitor
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To: PROCON

We spend winters in CA (I inherited the ranch out there and capital gains are worth more than I can get for it if I sold it) and every trip there is a stop at either Mesquite, NV or Eherenberg, AZ to unload and store. I hate it.


32 posted on 12/06/2016 6:03:38 PM PST by reaganaut (Yes I am female, yes I love guns, yes I carry and yes I reload and handload my own ammo.)
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To: alephnull; Constitutional Patriot

alephnull...perhaps the best bet in your current situation would be to obtain Utah CCW credentials in the meantime? It couldn't hurt and could only serve to help in your New Jersey case.

33 posted on 12/06/2016 6:18:04 PM PST by Blue Jays ( Rock hard ~ Ride free)
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To: PROCON

The LA Times has a point. Concealed carry is specifically intended to be used against violent criminals - Obama’s and Hillary’s constituents. The biggest threat to the safety of democrats engaged in robbery, rape, and other mayhem (their work and their recreation) is an armed citizenry. Of course a liberal newspaper has to oppose the ability of law abiding Americans to defend ourselves.


34 posted on 12/06/2016 6:25:09 PM PST by Pollster1 ("Governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed")
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To: PROCON
“It would be ironic to see conservatives who long have professed a belief in states’ rights override states’ choices in this area,”

They confuse the 2nd and 10th Amendments.

35 posted on 12/06/2016 7:38:39 PM PST by UnwashedPeasant (I told you so)
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To: Pollster1

“The LA Times has a point. Concealed carry is specifically intended to be used against violent criminals - Obama’s and Hillary’s constituents. The biggest threat to the safety of democrats engaged in robbery, rape, and other mayhem (their work and their recreation) is an armed citizenry. Of course a liberal newspaper has to oppose the ability of law abiding Americans to defend ourselves.”

Scott Adams says that Democrats use guns to kill other Democrats. Republicans use guns to defend themselves from Democrats.


36 posted on 12/06/2016 11:40:52 PM PST by ModelBreaker
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To: PROCON

Funny, I think Non Citizens Illegally Voting is pretty much the most dangerous thing to our Republic.


37 posted on 12/06/2016 11:45:12 PM PST by Kickass Conservative (One Man's Mainstream Media is another Man's Ministry of Propoganda.)
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To: Grampa Dave

I have carried for many years in my state of Texas an all states that honor my right to carry. I have and never will use my weapon in an illegal manor.

The laws in California suck!


38 posted on 12/07/2016 1:33:50 AM PST by cpdiii (DECKHAND, ROUGHNECK, GEOLOGIST, PILOT, PHARMACIST, LIBERTARIAN The Constitution is worth dying for.)
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To: cpdiii

The laws in California suck!

Unfortunately, they will get worse as our moonbats will be in full revenge mode.


39 posted on 12/07/2016 7:10:57 AM PST by Grampa Dave (Hey, whining losers,Trump will just go ahead & make things better for us without you!!!!")
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To: PROCON

Yea, dangerous for the criminals...


40 posted on 12/07/2016 10:41:48 AM PST by Envisioning (Before we get started, does anyone want to get out?)
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