Posted on 04/21/2013 9:53:57 AM PDT by Future Snake Eater
A fun conversation I had with some Facebook liberals (and one conservative, I guess). Enjoy!
The names have been abbreviated to protect the guilty, and I'll use "FSE" for me:
ORIGINAL POST:
"The actions of a few individuals are not a valid justification for hatred and prejudice against an entire race."--CM
FSE (me): lol...when I see people say that about gun owners, maybe I'll give it a second's thought.
JR: I didn't know gun owners are a race.
FSE (me): I didn't know Muslims were either.
VL: I hope you were joking, [FSE]. That isn't even close to a valid comparison. And she didn't say anything about Muslims.
BA: Except when that race preaches doctrines that basically call for the extinction of your race.
FSE: Not joking in the slightest. And of course that's what she means. Even our venerable president has said the same thing.
CM (Original Poster): I didn't know doctrines were race-based, [BA]. I was actually referring to the statements I'd seen about the Boston bombers, and generalizations being made about their race based on their actions. But I think my statement is blanket enough to cover xenophobia in general.
FSE: Race is irrelevant. Arabs, Chechens, Afghanis, Persians are just people. It's the culture they embrace that's the problem. You can't choose your race, but you can choose your culture.
BA: Doctrines can be race-based, when the majority religion asks its followers to work towards eliminating religious 'infidels' (Americans/Christians).
JSB: Some people just need to get out there and stop being scared of people they do not know. There have been a shit ton of serial killers in the past that are white americans... Do you classify all white americans as serial killers? NO, because you are a white american. Dont you think there are middle eastern people out there that deserve that same respect?
FSE: Strawman argument. Useless.
VL: Cultural superiority is a dangerous mindset to adopt. Americans aren't the morality gods of the world. There will always be extremists who want to eliminate a certain race/religion/culture.
FSE: Western Christian culture built the world. I've seen what Islam has done to its neck of the woods. You are welcome to exist over there, but I'll take what we built any day of the week.
BA: If a culture, religion or whatever is training its followers to murder you, your spouse, your kids, etc, I think its in our best interest to eliminate them first.
VL: I'm assuming you mean "kill them first". Its amusing to me when people think killing everyone who doesn't agree with you solves anything.
JSB: Eliminate them first? Doesnt that put you in the same EXTREMIST category as them? Doesnt that make you no better than what they preach?
FSE: I've killed Muslims. They damn sure tried to kill me first. I recognize who the enemy is. That's very frowned upon here in the U.S. for some reason.
JSB: So, walking down the street, if it was legal, you would just start shooting everyone that looked Muslim to you?
VL: It's frowned upon because cultural prejudice isn't even close to justification for taking someone's life. There are different rules for direct conflict with an enemy unit in a war zone, which is a debate I don't care to address here. We're getting off topic.
FSE: It's called "combat." You're referring to indiscriminate murder. Quite different.
I am curious, though, does anyone really think that when your head is on the chopping block, all you have to do is tell the jihadi how multicultural in your thinking you are and they'll let you go? Do you think they fret over this nonsense?
FSE: "Cultural prejudice" doesn't justify murder, but it does justify itself. Some cultures are most certainly inferior to others.
VL: If I were to make a baseless assumption, I'd have to assume they don't. However, I also think us asking questions about the morality of our actions is an admirable trait, rather than one that makes us weak.
FSE: Not when those questions inevitably lead to weakness and hesitation in the face of a ruthless enemy.
VL: I assume you're referring to direct conflict (I'm also assuming you've been in combat from your statements). I don't have expertise in combat, where I also assume the rules are different. From a societal standpoint, however, I think that adopting an attitude of tolerance and consideration is in our best interest. Assuming an entire culture/race/religion (and any person we meet from it) is "bad" or "evil" is too closed-minded of a viewpoint for the civilized world.
FSE: Do you fear violence from Muslims or Christians more? Why?
JR: I've gotten more death threats from Christians than from Muslims.
FSE: That doesn't answer my question.
VL: Perhaps you could clarify your question a bit. I don't fear violence based on a particular group of people, but I'm not sure if this viewpoint is in the majority.
FSE: Would you fear being beaten/killed more outside a mosque in Mosul or outside a church in Texas?
JO: Jumping in here, but I don't think fear of violence (by anyone) is justification for anything, because fear is subjective, and can be cultivated by news media, propaganda, etc.
JR: Texas, definitely.
FSE: So you believe Christians are "definitely" more inherently violent as a culture than Muslims? Based upon what evidence?
FSE: Take a walk through East St. Louis around midnight some time and tell me how "subjective" and even unwarranted your fear is.
JR: When did I say that?
FSE: "Texas, definitely"
MA: That's what happens when people are under educated in cultural diversity.
FSE: Or maybe it's the place? How about a church in Canada?
JR: Which you then expanded into something I didn't say.
JR: My impression of Texans is certainly worse than my impression of Canadians, sure.
JR: But generally I don't think I have to fear anyone.
FSE: Should you be aware of the threat they pose? Awareness does not equal "fear."
FSE: OK, so it's a geographical issue. Fine, church in Canada or mosque in Mosul?
JR: I disagree with your claim that "the muslims" pose a threat to me and mine.
FSE: Then you fundamentally don't understand what's happening.
JR: good to know this whole conversation was worthless.
FSE: I can't understand it for you, sorry.
AJ: All the questions to just say you don't understand what he understands. Someone's on a high horse of some sort.
FSE: Yet no one has answered the question.
NM: The crusades...yeah. I'd say Christian extremists can be JUST as violent as other...EXTREMISTS. They (extremists) have no problem with the harm and death of gays because they think they are evil. However I know many Christians who don't care. So I wouldn't say every Christian is evil and should be killed in case they try to beat my loved one to death for being gay. So I don't think everyone who is or looks Muslim should be..murdered..because they MIGHT have a bomb in their backpack.
JR: it's not really a useful question to answer, [FSE]. It presupposes its own reality, much like "Have you stopped beating your wife?"
DO: Personally, you're allowed to hate whoever you want, but as a society I think it's irresponsible to generalize ANY group (religious, cultural, etc). It also displays a lack of societal intelligence.
FSE: Hardly.
FSE: How about a church in Africa vs. a mosque in Mosul? This way you can't be seen as "racist" whichever way you go. I know that makes people afraid these days.
AJ: i find it uncivilized to hate an entire group solely based on the actions of a few, but hey at one time, the Romans thought they were the most civilized people on the planet, while at the same time, condoning slavery and taking whatever land they wanted.
AJ: Now you're just fishing for argument. You should probably go do something else.
JR: You haven't answered my question, [FSE]. Have you stopped beating your wife?
FSE: lol...I find it highly amusing that the high-minded multicultural folks around here can't answer my simple question.
AJ: While you're at it, have you ever masturbated in church [FSE]?
FSE: Now we're getting to the level of argument I expect from liberals. Good job
AJ: I'm not even a liberal, so are you going to answer my question?
FSE: Sure you aren't. Declaring questions to be equal doesn't make it so. Besides, I asked mine first.
AJ: I see you're a white supremacists. That explains the white uniform.
FSE: Race card!
FSE: It's official, I just won.
FSE: Nice playing
So, overall, I was very pleased with how this whole thing went. I even got hit with the race card, I can't believe it! I always hear about it happening, but it's never happened to me--not this directly, at least.
I haven't had this much fun on Facebook in a while!
;-)
FSE. If you just have tolerance and understanding, there is no threat. Why can’t you see that?
/liberalism
Priceless. Should be a master card commercial.
bump
LOL! That reads like the script from one of those liberal/conservative “discussion” cartoon videos on YouTube.
Too easy to trip them up when you “conversate” with them. Typical tolerance level for radical left wing extremist demokkkrat scumbag socialists. “We will not tolerate people who are intolerant.” Heck they won’t even agree that we have ANY valid points so we must just shut up.
They always bring up “The Crusades” as if it was evil Christians bent on attacking Muslims for no reason.
The Crusades were IN RESPONSE to what the same thin that is happening right now. But back then they had the courage to do something about it
Ha! It really does, doesn’t it? It was like fishing with dynamite. All they had was some misplaced sense of “fairness” in their heads and they didn’t know how to process anything else.
Even if The Crusades was a valid example of Christian violence, you’re talking 750-900 years ago or so. 9-11-2001/Last week are a tad more current.
Great fun to see their panties get so twisted!
The libs were doing their typical thing:
1) Use straw man arguments
2) Bring up different, but seemingly related topics (to confuse the real argument).
3) Ignore relevant posts/questions.
Muslims contribute nothing to the USA but death and destruction. Saul Alinsky tactics to point out a few Christians here or there who did NOT BEHAVE LIKE CHRISTIANS is not a winning argument.
Muslims however, killing, beheading, attempting world domination IS DOING WHAT IT IS TO BE A MUSLIM.
Janet the bull dyke Reno killed a bunch of Branch Davidians who made no threat against the USA but liberals labeled them a cult so there was no problem in the government’s mind with that mass extinction.
However, now in 2013 (and for the last few decades) have a scourge on the earth known as the death cult of Islam who’s goal is our death or domination and scum like you were debating on FB will be the death of us all by giving these inferior maggots the false cover of religion.
It is imperative they all be excised from the USA and no more allowed in. Their factories for weapons of mass destruction aka mosques must be destroyed and the ground purified with pig blood.
So I wouldn't say every Christian is evil and should be killed in case they try to beat my loved one to death for being gay.
I think this sums up the conversation: we have very real, overwhelming world-wide violence perpetrated by a specific culture in the name of Allah, yet there are those that are fixated on stereotypes such as the fabled "gay-bashing Christian", or the elusive "Tea Party Terrorist". I think that people (and not necessarily liberals) want validation of their worldview (which in turn leads to security) even if it means making up fairy tales to support such a view.
I was honestly surprised no one would answer my “church or mosque” question. I figured, at minimum, I would get “church is more dangerous b/c [insert liberal “logic” here]”, but no one would answer! That told me they know exactly what the problem is, but they can’t bear to say it out loud. So very, very odd.
The Japanese had a culture and ideology that was destructive to the US and other countries. .It had fanatical adherents to that ideology who were willing to die in the service of it.
Ultimately the only thing the US could do was destroy enough of Japan that the culture and ideology was forced to change.
Hating Christians for what happened a century ago is like Christians hating Italians for what happened 2 centuries ago.
It’s fun when you see indoctrinated skulls full of mush get hit with reality and reason. They fold up like a cheap suit and start name calling.
They need more briefing from their college professors “to make it all better”. LOL
I missed that comment during the conversation; I discovered it while copying/pasting over to FR.
There’s some real mental illness in that train of thought. People like her will welcome mass killings of Christians, there’s no doubt in my mind.
Even with the race card eventually tossed in, that is still the most civilized conversation with a “progressive” I’ve ever seen.
Glad to see some of them taking their meds ;-)
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