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Re:"Mal and Val - not Ann and the Old Man" Any evidence Valerie Sarruf is Obama's mom? (vanity)
Seizethecarp vanity commentary on Dr. Ron J. Polland youtube dated 08/07/11 ^ | August 1, 2012 | Seizethecarp (vanity)

Posted on 08/01/2012 11:18:33 AM PDT by Seizethecarp

"Meet The Parents....of alias Barack Obama. Black Sunni Muslim father and White Lebanese Christian mother. Born in the ME, raised in Indonesia, became BHO II in 1982." Dr. Ron J. Polland

The “Mal-Val” youtube video at the link was posted by FReeper Polarik (Dr. Ron Polland) in August of 2011 and while morphing the image of a woman named “Val” into an image of Obama, he insinuates that “Val” is Obama’s mom. One year later this youtube has only 1,150 views.

In July 2012, two FReepers associated the woman, “Val,” in Polarik’s Youtube with Lebanese actress Valerie Sarruf and have posted multiple images of her at various ages on FR eligibility threads. I am opening this thread to invite discussion of and links to any evidence that either supports or refutes a claim that Valerie Sarruf is Barack Obama’s mother, with or without Malcolm X being his father.

Where could Malcolm X and Valerie Sarruf have been in 1960 when baby Barry would have been conceived? Is there any evidence that Sarruf could have been pregnant and delivered a baby in 1961? In what country could the baby have been delivered? How and when could the alleged Mal-Val baby have been inserted into the identity and life narrative of the person we have come to know as Barack Hussein Obama?

Full disclosure: I refute categorically all of the Mal-Val narrative as wildly speculative and unsupported by any evidence that I have seen so far.

For several years now a shadowy coterie of FReepers styling themselves as “researchers” has gone onto nearly every FR eligibility thread to aggressively refute all evidence that Stanley Ann Dunham was Barack Obama’s mother. They have actually declared flat out that she was never in Hawaii before 1963, contrary to the voluminous evidence including INS FOIA documents!

Requests for links or any evidence that Stanley Ann is NOT the mom have been frequently met with abusive ad hominem attacks and accompanied by claims that ALL documentary evidence showing her to have been in Hawaii in 1960 and 1961 is forged, but no credible evidence of forgery has offered. I make this observation as a retired Certified Fraud Examiner and CPA.

For years the “researchers” had claimed mysteriously to have conclusive evidence that a different woman is Barry’s mom, but refused to reveal her name or any evidence other than her picture because the “researchers” claimed it would disappear from the net and/or from hard copy archives of the records. But this month, the “researchers” appear to have slipped up and revealed that Valerie Sarruf has been the woman whose identity they have been “protecting.” They have since attempted to walk back the revelation, but it is clear, IMO.

The “researchers” claim that they earnestly want to remove Obama from office. But wouldn’t revealing ALL EVIDENCE of a foreign mother and foreign birth (which they also claim) be the most logical approach to removing Obama rather than hiding the identity of this alternative mother for years while attacking FR threads that sincerely attempt to find out where Stanley Ann Dunham was when she gave birth to Barry?

In my opinion, the best evidence that Valerie Sarruf is NOT Barry’s mother is the mountain of evidence that Stanley Ann Dunham IS his mother, which the “researchers” have totally failed to refute.

Again, please use this thread for discussion of and links to any evidence that either supports or refutes a claim that Valerie Sarruf IS Barack Obama’s mother with or without Malcolm X being his father.


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: birther; certifigate; falsescent; fmd; fogbowdisinformation; frankmarshalldavis; fraudexaminer; kingjerkaboo; malcolmx; malval; mikezullo; moonbatbirther; moonbats; naturalborncitizen; obama; obamamama; obamamom; rabbittrails; sado; sarruf; seizethecarp; shinyobjects; valeriesarruf; zullo
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1 posted on 08/01/2012 11:18:43 AM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp; Polarik; LucyT; hoosiermama; Fractal Trader

This was intended to be the link for the thread, the link to Dr. Ron Polland’s youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A3bYdwSsr8


2 posted on 08/01/2012 11:25:43 AM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp

Really? Haven’t FR gotten around to banning “Dr” Polarik and his insane zombies yet?


3 posted on 08/01/2012 11:26:47 AM PDT by Hardraade (http://junipersec.wordpress.com (Obama Kills))
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To: Seizethecarp

I have seen nude pictures of Baby Barry Momma taken by a family friend & pornographer named Frank.


4 posted on 08/01/2012 11:27:39 AM PDT by TexasCajun
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To: Seizethecarp
"I make this observation as a retired Certified Fraud Examiner and CPA. "

And that obvious forged Birth Certificate got right past him?

I am a computer software engineer for a living, not a 'certified fraud examiner'

I have WRITTEN imaging software, and I knew within 10 minutes that Obambi's certificate was a fraud.

5 posted on 08/01/2012 11:29:42 AM PDT by Mr. K ("The spread of evil is the symptom of a vacuum [of good]")
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To: Mr. K
Um...I am the retired CFA and CPA, not Dr. Polland.

My observation is that all evidence to date confirms Stanley Ann as Barry's mom...but I EXCLUDE his forged pdf BC from the evidence I consider to show she is his mom. It is not needed, given all of the other evidence.

6 posted on 08/01/2012 11:41:18 AM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp

He must be related at least to Stanley Dunham, because he looks just like him.


7 posted on 08/01/2012 11:57:28 AM PDT by kabumpo (Kabumpo)
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To: Seizethecarp

Time to get out the potato chips and soda, this is going to be a good show.


8 posted on 08/01/2012 12:32:24 PM PDT by JoeA (JoeA / Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est)
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To: Seizethecarp
For several years now a shadowy coterie of FReepers styling themselves as “researchers” has gone onto nearly every FR eligibility thread to aggressively refute all evidence that Stanley Ann Dunham was Barack Obama’s mother.

I missed that one.

9 posted on 08/01/2012 12:36:42 PM PDT by marron
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To: kabumpo
“He must be related at least to Stanley Dunham, because he looks just like him.”

Pictures of Stanley Armour Dunham flashing his “big smile” look much like Barry flashing his “big smile.” Even though Malcolm X's “big smile is also similar, I prefer to go with Occam's Razor and stick with Grampa Stanley as the source of the smile, although appearance can mean very little when determining paternity it won't hold up in court.

The only resemblance I see between Barry and Malcolm X is the general shape of the head and the teeth, but none of the finer features look very similar to me.

10 posted on 08/01/2012 2:43:30 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Hardraade

Are you kidding? You haven’t gotten the ZOT yet?


11 posted on 08/01/2012 2:45:48 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: TexasCajun
“I have seen nude pictures of Baby Barry Momma taken by a family friend & pornographer named Frank.”

I'm hoping that a facial recognition software analysis will eventually be published comparing the nudie woman and SADO. The woman in the nudie pics weighs much less than Stanley Ann appears to weigh in most pictures at all ages with one exception, that being the apparent Halloween picture of her with little Barry appearing to be age two in a pirate outfit..perhaps in 1963. She appears to be very slender in that picture three years after the nudie pics and to me looks more like the nudie woman than in any other picture.

By my calculations, nine months of gestation before a claimed birth on Aug. 4, 1961 would be Nov. 4, 1960 and then a supposedly knowledgeable FReeper says add another week and push back conception to October 28, 1960, which would be even before Halloween. This would have made her already pregnant by Christmas when the nudie pics were supposedly taken.

So she could have been “involved” with BHO Sr in late October, gotten pregnant, and then posed for FM Davis. If she was “with” both of them the paternity of the baby might have been unknown. FMD being already married in the US vs. BHO Sr. pretending to be unmarried in Hawaii, Sr. might have drawn the short straw.

12 posted on 08/01/2012 3:00:40 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp
I hear you also believe that an indentured servant named John Punch who broke his contract and was sentenced to slavery is an ancestor of Barry because his name rhymes with Bunch.


and btw, don't you also believe that Communist Frank Marshall Davis who was 55 years old when 0bama was born, is his real father?


13 posted on 08/01/2012 3:01:54 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Hardraade
“Haven’t FR gotten around to banning “Dr” Polarik and his insane zombies yet?”

Well, at least some zombies are here and Polarik is still a FReeper, last time I looked.

14 posted on 08/01/2012 3:03:14 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp

Yeah, because each time someone peeled off a layer of “Polarik’s” con man cloak he’d run away for a few months, to have his brigadiers bring his sh*t back on and use FR for a billboard.


15 posted on 08/01/2012 3:09:14 PM PDT by Hardraade (http://junipersec.wordpress.com (Obama Kills))
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To: Seizethecarp
Again, please use this thread for discussion of and links to any evidence that either supports or refutes a claim that Valerie Sarruf IS Barack Obama’s mother with or without Malcolm X being his father.

FMD being already married in the US vs. BHO Sr. pretending to be unmarried in Hawaii, Sr. might have drawn the short straw.

So, now you believe that they had a straw lottery in Hawaii to determine the father of Barry, 52 years ago? Really?

Well, that proves it! Great evidence!!!
16 posted on 08/01/2012 3:10:49 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Hardraade; Admin Moderator

but, you weren’t here then, were you retread?


17 posted on 08/01/2012 3:13:09 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp

The whole face shape and body is the same as the young Stanley Dunham.


18 posted on 08/01/2012 3:15:55 PM PDT by kabumpo (Kabumpo)
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To: Seizethecarp
But this month, the “researchers” appear to have slipped up and revealed that Valerie Sarruf has been the woman whose identity they have been “protecting.”

Who has been trying to protect her identity? She's very well known, at least she is in GB.
19 posted on 08/01/2012 3:18:54 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
But this month, the “researchers” appear to have slipped up and revealed that Valerie Sarruf has been the woman whose identity they have been “protecting.”

Who has been trying to protect her identity? She's very well known, at least she is in GB.
20 posted on 08/01/2012 3:18:54 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
I refute categorically all of the Mal-Val narrative as wildly speculative and unsupported by any evidence that I have seen so far.

I doubt that anyone with that sort of evidence would be sharing it with you. What makes you think that they would?
21 posted on 08/01/2012 3:21:39 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
Where could Malcolm X and Valerie Sarruf have been in 1960 when baby Barry would have been conceived?

Where do you think they were?
22 posted on 08/01/2012 3:22:52 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
In what country could the baby have been delivered?

What country do you think he was born in?
23 posted on 08/01/2012 3:26:10 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
In another distraction meant to keep American voters away from the real issues, Fox News channel announced today that the GOP is in possession of a birth certificate proving beyond doubt that Barack Obama's real birthplace is, in fact, planet Lappa IV, located in the Alpha Quadrant and inhabited by a splinter group of the Ferengi species, who have developed a highly collectivist culture based on the principles of socialist acquisition and redistribution of wealth.

According to conservative commentators, the Democrat presidential hopeful's home planet is governed by the Central Planning Committee made primarily of the State Board of Expropriators and Liquidators, who offer prayers and sacrificial offerings to a Blessed Taxperson in hopes of entering the Divine Pork Barrel upon death, and fear an afterlife spent in a Subsidized Housing For the Common Good they legislated and financed with public money.

This explains Barack Obama campaign's earlier secrecy over his birth site, especially if we consider the outdated constitutional requirement that presidents must be "natural-born" U.S. citizens.

Obama's Birth Certificate Proves He's Not From Earth

24 posted on 08/01/2012 3:37:38 PM PDT by Bubba_Leroy (The Obamanation Continues)
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To: Seizethecarp
They have actually declared flat out that she was never in Hawaii before 1963, contrary to the voluminous evidence including INS FOIA documents!

Could you please provide the readers with copies of the voluminous evidence?

I make this observation as a retired Certified Fraud Examiner and CPA.

Could you please provide the readers a comprehensive analysis of those same documents?
25 posted on 08/01/2012 3:56:29 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer
“I hear you also believe that an indentured servant named John Punch who broke his contract and was sentenced to slavery is an ancestor of Barry because his name rhymes with Bunch.”

I have characterized that as a “claim,” as I usually do regarding assertions made by other experts.

Given that I regard the evidence that Stanley Ann is Barry's mom to be overwhelming, absent a Conspiracy Theory (CT) level of document manipulation, I would assign a “more probable than not” level of confidence that Barry would have the same level of African genes consistent with other members of the Bunch family who had their DNA tested and were found to be positive for African genes.

“and btw, don't you also believe that Communist Frank Marshall Davis who was 55 years old when 0bama was born, is his real father?”

I have not taken a position one way or the other between the most likely sperm donor candidates FMD and BHO Sr. On the record they were extremely active outside their respective marriages, real or alleged.

If the nudie pics are genuine (awaiting facial recognition study) FMD had the means, motive and opportunity to be Barry's father, but by Christmas 1960 when the pics appear to have been taken, he may have been too late!

26 posted on 08/01/2012 3:57:47 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Brown Deer

As crazy as ever, I see. We’ve had this conversation before, Bambi.


27 posted on 08/01/2012 4:05:34 PM PDT by Hardraade (http://junipersec.wordpress.com (Obama Kills))
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To: Brown Deer
When I speculate, I try to use a conditional tense to make that clear.

I try to avoid declarative statements of fact for which I have no evidence, as many of the “researchers” have done, such as:

1. Stanley Ann is not the mother
2. Stanley Ann was never in Hawaii until 1963
3. David Obama, Barry's half-brother, never existed
4. The original Barack H. Obama is the man now known as Roman Obama of Equatorial Guinea
5. Stanley Ann was Barry's nanny, not his mother
6. Roman Obama is the “dark boy” in the family picture with BHO Sr., Ruth Ndesandjo and Mark
7. Three-year-old Barry was substituted for Roman Obama in Stanley Ann's care in HI and sent to Kenya.

Stuff like that I avoid saying.

28 posted on 08/01/2012 4:06:18 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Brown Deer

Just to remind you (and everyone else):

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2562565/posts?q=1&;page=1


29 posted on 08/01/2012 4:15:21 PM PDT by Hardraade (http://junipersec.wordpress.com (Obama Kills))
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To: Seizethecarp
Stuff like that I avoid saying.

You mean like this?

We know for a fact that BHO Sr. was a sexual predator...

and this?

KGB. Had a lot invested in Frank Davis and also in BHO Sr. who was a raving communist speaking at KGB-front union events while in HI and likely being groomed to be a Marxist mole in the anticipated independent Kenya. An alleged marriage and assumed paternity by BHO Sr of FMD's baby would protect both FMD and BHO Sr. from being fingered as father of an illegitimate black baby.
30 posted on 08/01/2012 4:16:51 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Hardraade; Admin Moderator

No need to remind me that you are a retread troll.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2562565/replies?c=57


31 posted on 08/01/2012 4:21:33 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer

No, the absolute proof is a bit of flooring stored in a garage for 50 years.

Case closed!


32 posted on 08/01/2012 4:43:53 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: Seizethecarp
I try to avoid declarative statements of fact for which I have no evidence, as many of the “researchers” have done...

and you actually have evidence showing that many of the “researchers” have made all of those declarative statements of fact in this declarative statement of fact that you have made?
33 posted on 08/01/2012 4:44:17 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp

You’ve gone around the bend.

Why not stop before it’s too late and the men with the extra long sleeved jacket show up.


34 posted on 08/01/2012 4:48:27 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: little jeremiah

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sshPiEUGyZ8


35 posted on 08/01/2012 4:53:45 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer

That’s it.


36 posted on 08/01/2012 5:09:50 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: Brown Deer
“I doubt that anyone with that sort of evidence would be sharing it with you. What makes you think that they would?”

Given the reluctance of the Mal-Val “researchers” to disclose their claimed evidence that Valerie Sarruf and Malcolm X are that parents of Barack Obama, I have opened this thread to see if they or others would finally come forward, especially now that the secret mother's identity in their claimed narrative has slipped out.

37 posted on 08/01/2012 5:11:16 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Brown Deer
“Where do you think they were?”

As I said, I do not find the Mal-Val narrative to be credible in the least, so I do not believe Malcolm and Valerie conceived Barack anywhere. However if you happen to have evidence that would help remove Obama from office, such as evidence that he was born outside the US to a non-citizen mother, wouldn't now be a good time to make the evidence public?

38 posted on 08/01/2012 5:15:33 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp
However if you happen to have evidence that would help remove Obama from office...

What makes you believe that I would have some evidence?
39 posted on 08/01/2012 5:36:30 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer
“Could you please provide the readers with copies of the voluminous evidence?”

In opening this thread I have invited presentation and discussion of evidence that either Valerie Sarruf IS Barry's mom or evidence that Stanley Ann is NOT his mom. For you, I will restate the highlights of the voluminous evidence that Stanley Ann IS Barry's mom.

The U of HI, U of WA, FOIA INS docs, HI vital record index, divorce records all conclusively affirm that Stanley Ann was in Hawaii in parts of 1960, 1961 and 1962 and was associated with BHO Sr and possible FMD at that time. Most significantly, the FOIA INS docs affirm Stanley Ann as the mother of her baby named Barack Hussein Obama as early as August 1961.

Note that the INS FOIA docs destroy the "Dreams" narrative and the reputation of BHO Sr. showing him to have been suspected of getting not only 17-year-old Stanley Ann pregnant, but later a fellow Kenyan student who, though the account is partially redacted, was most likely sent to the UK for an abortion and returned to Kenya.

The FOIA INS docs reveal BHO Sr. having little concern for baby Barry and having actively discussed turning him over to the Salvation Army as of April 1961.

A marriage date of Feb. 2, 1961 is in the INS FOIA docs corroborating the date in the 1964 divorce decree and also corroborated by the existence of an HI marriage vital record for Stanley Ann and BHO Sr. Even though this marriage is most likely a legal nullity due to bigamy, in HI BHO Sr. is shown to have acknowledge himself to be the legal father of Barry, if all of these documents are genuine.

So whether or not BHO Sr. was the biological sperm donor or not he is, on the record, the legal father of Barry and she is the legal mother, affirmed by the 1964 HI divorce decree, (and finally, the Lolo divorce decree after Barry was 18 indicating she had custody when he turned 18).

40 posted on 08/01/2012 5:43:20 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: little jeremiah; Brown Deer
Yes, it's beyond Bunny with the Crepe Beret; it's Keyboard Cat.
41 posted on 08/01/2012 5:45:15 PM PDT by PhilDragoo (Hussein: Islamo-Commie from Kenya)
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To: Seizethecarp

So, you have no actual evidence to share with us?

and you also admit that it’s just a fantasy of yours that FMD might be his father?


42 posted on 08/01/2012 5:48:26 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer
The "researchers" have claimed to have evidence that Valerie Sarruf is the mother of Barry and Malcolm X is the father. That evidence has been claimed to be the basis for aggressive assertions on eligibility threads by the "researchers" that Stanley Ann is NOT Barry's mom.

I am trying to find out if there is any evidence to support the Mal-Val narrative that Sarruf is Barry's mom and what the details of that narrative might be, such as where Barry was supposedly born in the narrative, and how he came to be inserted into the US.

In the Mal-Val video link, Polarik says Barry was born in the ME (middle east) perhaps in Valerie's home country of Lebanon, in his version of the narrative.

43 posted on 08/01/2012 6:03:05 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp
Mal?

Photobucket

44 posted on 08/01/2012 6:34:05 PM PDT by GreenLanternCorps ("Barack Obama" is Swahili for "Jimmy Carter".)
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To: Seizethecarp
perhaps in Valerie's home country of Lebanon

That's a long way from Great Britain!
45 posted on 08/01/2012 6:46:31 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer
So you don't really have any evidence of these factual claims you have made about the many researchers?
46 posted on 08/01/2012 6:49:02 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Seizethecarp
Gilberts has unequivocally matched the nude pictures to Frank Davis' house at 2994 Kalihi. It is asking too much of coincidence to suggest that there was a Stanley Dunham look-a-like who took nude pictures in the Davis house.

Apart from that, if you look at the nude pictures closely in the area of her teeth, you can see that her upper left 2nd incisor is crooked, just like Stanley Ann's was at that age.

47 posted on 08/01/2012 7:02:29 PM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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To: Brown Deer
“So you don't really have any evidence of these factual claims you have made about the many researchers?”

All an interested person has to do is web-search each of the associated declarative claims of the Mal-Val narrative that I listed and the hits will come up...along with the names of some of the more vocal “researchers.” Have at it!

You seem very interested in this thread seeking any evidence that Valerie Sarruf is Obama’s mother or that Stanley Ann is NOT Obama’s mother. Care to share why that is? Do you have any such evidence? Have you made any of the claims or supported any of the claims of the Mal-Val narrative “researchers” that I listed? Or did you just come on the thread to hijack it with misdirection?

48 posted on 08/01/2012 7:03:48 PM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp
BHO Sr. is shown to have acknowledge himself to be the legal father of Barry, if all of these documents are genuine

To which documents are you referring? I have looked and cannot find any document in which Obama Sr. acknowledges himself to be the legal father of Barry.

On August 31, 1961, Obama Sr. filed an application to extend his visa. He stated “married” under marital status. In the space for wife, there is a name scratched out which is consistent with starting with a “K” and is about the right length for “Kezia Obama.” Next to the scratched-out words is “Ann S. Dunham, Honolulu, Hawaii.” The space for name and addresses of children is left blank. However, according to his purported birth certificate, BHO II was born weeks earlier.

On August 17, 1962, Obama Sr. filed an application to extend his visa. He stated “married” under marital status but left blank the space for name of wife. Under names and addresses of children he wrote “Roy Obama.”

On June 6, 1963 Obama Sr. filed an application to extend his visa. He left blank the space for children (and also omitted to mention any wife). There is a second handwriting on the form in which question marks are inserted in the spaces for name and address of wife and the words “he is married” appears.

In January 1964, Stanley Ann’s divorce petition alleged that they had a child BHO II. However, Obama Sr. never made answer to the divorce petition and he did not appear at the hearing in March 1964. It is notable that Stanley Ann did not seek child support against Obama Sr.; she may have known she was on shaky ground as to paternity and did not press the matter.

On April 21, 1964, Obama Sr. filed an application to extend his visa. There are two handwritings on this document – first, a faint one in all capitals in which his name and address and certain other information is filled in (but NOT children) and signed and second, a darker handwriting in which certain information and questions are further inserted in the document such as “Has one?” under social security number. The reference to BHO II is only in this second, darker handwriting (likely that of an INS person).

In various memos in the INS file there are indications that the INS personnel and university personnel at both UH and Harvard knew he had a child BHO II, so presumably he did not argue the point when raised in oral conversation.

Nevertheless, when the rubber hit the road, he never actually signed his name to any document by which he may have been admitting paternity.

And he never used the existence of the child, or even of a US wife, as an argument to extend his visa but always based his claim for his visa status on the grounds that he was a foreign student enrolled full-time at a university.

49 posted on 08/01/2012 7:06:22 PM PDT by Meet the New Boss
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To: Seizethecarp; Berlin_Freeper; Hotlanta Mike; Silentgypsy; repubmom; HANG THE EXPENSE; Nepeta; ...


Or did you just come on the thread to hijack it with misdirection?

Wow! Almost everything I mentioned in what I've posted came from your original post, but now you accuse me of hijacking your vanity thread after you posted "please use this thread for discussion" and ignored almost every question I posted in response? Haven't you noticed, that if not for me, you'd be only be chatting to yourself?

What's your real motive here?
50 posted on 08/01/2012 7:59:01 PM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
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