Posted on 01/05/2020 6:31:29 AM PST by CatOwner
I am about to receive a Dell PC with Windows 10 Pro installed. It will have both an SSD drive (first one for me) and a SATA drive. With the past Dell PC purchases, I would take the supplied Windows OS disk and reinstall from scratch. Too much junk gets installed by Dell, and it seems trying to delete programs is more cumbersome than just performing a fresh install. I also like learning the clean install process before I actually put personal information on the new PC.
Only issues are I have not used Windows 10 at all (initial need is for installing TurboTax), and I don't think Dell (or anyone else) supplies a Windows 10 installation disk with purchased PCs. I am looking for advice as to how best to approach this.
BKMRK.
Maybe, maybe not... if you’re married to mouse clicks, you’re placing limitations on yourself. Many hotkey combinations have been around since ‘Windows BC’, and they still work. I don’t know how many mouse clicks it takes you to get to Device Manager, for example, but I can do it with 1 in Windows 10.
Some things have changed from previous versions, some have been added, some have been removed. Make a point of learning something every time you sit down with the new O/S - just one little thing. It adds up.
Looks like I will need installation media to accomplish what I want. The built-in reinstall feature doesn’t have an option to eliminate the applications Dell provides with the build. Thanks.
Probably going to do that first and see what happens. Last time I attempted this with a Dell PC, there were "Dell features" installed I couldn't get rid of.
Nowhere in my post did I say that Windows 10 was easy. Maybe you meant to respond to someone else.
One the machine is booted and ready to go, you can go to the MS site and download a utility to make a Windows 10 bootable USB install disk. You will need a blank flash drive that will be totally erased and rewritten. You can use this disk to boot to an installer. Do a custom install and delete any partitions on the main SSD, then instruct it to install to the now blank SSD. Skip any dialogs asking for a serial number (it should register itself once it boots up, as Windows 10 licenses are tied to the machine).
I get that, but I had no problem in the past just performing a new installation. Prior to purchasing Dells, I used to build my own PCs, so installing the OS was no big deal. Knowing the process before I put data on a PC came in handy when I got to the point where I needed to perform a clean install.
I haven’t reread all of the MS Win10 licensing conditions in the last year, but went through the same experience when I built my own machine about the time Win 8.1 came out and completed it as Win10 free upgrade was announced.
In a nutshell read the following regarding OEM Win10 install.
A few notes as when I installed Win10, I wanted the full documentation, but when I went to purchase the OS from Newegg, only the OEM version was available, and most self-builds at https://pcpartpicker.com/product/CYH48d/microsoft-os-fqc09131 seemed to use it fine.:
First off, it isn’t as simple as replacing the hard drive, if you are using the OEM installed OS. Circa 2016 Win10 registers the OS on only one computer (”CUSTOMER SYSTEM”) and the CustSystem is defined as 5 elements: the CPU, (w/serial number), the RAM/NAND (SSD)&/or Hard Drive (w/SN), the Motherboard (w/SN), the Power Supply, and the Case, all registered to one copy of Win10 with the 20 some odd digit license code or whatever they call it.
Any change to that original system and Win10 OS can void the OS and cause a system crash. Technically, change the HDD with the OEM installed OS without OEM management and it voids the OS License. It may be possible to “Re-Activate” the OS License upon a change to the Customer System, but say if the Motherboard is changed, then the OEM Product Key won’t work, hence no OS re-activation, even with a full retail version.
There are lots of folks who have changed out system components and it continued to operate, but in one case, where I don’t believe I changed anything, the 9Feb2019 Win10 upload / refresh automatically generated by MS, crashed my hard drive and now the system won’t even boot. I had migrated a Windows XP HDD to Win 8.1 Pro 64, without a problem and then processed the automatic free Win10 upload. Worked fine for 3 years until the Win10 1809 upload, and now the boot hangs with a dimly lit background of a Windows XP screenshot (which I never saw in the last 4 years of operations).
In order to recover, you need the Win10 License Key, but in my case it was the Win8.1 License Key which MS updated to Win10 automatically by download over the net from MS.
So I’m looking at the LINUX USB alt boot solution to try to recover my files before attempting to re-image the HDD. At this point I’m probably 1-2 yrs out from building a new system, at which time I’ll revisit the HDD/SSD solution.
Best way around this, is to buy the retail version for your PC, say Win10 Pro 64bit (if your CPU & Motherboard are 64bit systems) and I’d recommend buying it with the USB dongle.
It’s about twice as much as the OEM version. Same SW, but allows you to reuse the OS on a different system, if you choose to upgrade or change PCs. Still only one PC at a time.
Regarding the OEM OS version.
You can tell which OEM installed it, generally by the boot sequence. If BIOS is UEFI, then after BIOS is loaded, the configured boot device, generally your hard drive, will begin the boot and display a screenshot made by the OEM installer. Even if the PC has Dell labels on the outside, verify the screenshot for the OEM installer. (might be somebody else, and might have even cloned a Dell screenshot, but when you first bought and registered the PC, Microsoft will have your account and the OEM info.
Technically, MS won’t answer or support problem resolution on OEM installed PCs OSs,..that is the OEM responsibility.
Also, if your PC has Bing on it, it is virtually impossible to take it out without buying a new OS and custom installing it. Even then, if a MS Service comes along and updates the OS, they might install it without your consent,...or if consensual, it is usually buried in cross-referenced SW phrases in the licensing agreements, which get unilaterally updated every 6 mo to 2 years.
If you see the Bing icon on your bottom taskbar, it’s loaded and virtually impossible to remove from Win10. MS recommends and includes the Bing upload in their std OS config app given to OEMs as a Toolkit. Most OEMs will simply use that toolkit to comfortably install Win10 without knowing the system.
BTW, it’s getting more difficult to document the system installs.
I noticed how much the system documentation had changed from the 80s and 90s in 2015. It is as if all the Documentation Writing departments ave been laid off and documentation isn’t even written anymore.
As you read through the legalese in the licensing agreements, it is obvious even the lawyers aren’t chopping the documents. Everything is cut & pasted without wherewithal applied to total system functioning and control.
In 2017, documentation seemed to migrate into MS blog trains. Now in 2019-2020, even the MS customer reps who answer questions on the blogs, resort to making the questions personal, by lamenting how they had already answered similar questions 2 years prior, without any linkage or without answering simple questions shared by multiple customers. Then they resort to simple “smile & Agree with the customer approach” to customer relations without addressing the problem or solution.
IMHO, Microsoft management has removed themselves from their customer base so much, that they no longer find a need to provide products to answer the customer’s requirements. It then drives their staffing and policies to the point where product documentation is lacking to void, removing themselves from servicing customers, and seeking to process all the responsibility of their work out as 3rd party contracts. The 3rd parties know less than MS should know about their products, but MS has so removed their documentation that now 3rd parties know more about MS products than does MS.
Regarding Linux,..might be a good solution.
There are multiple videos on how to load a USB dongle with a full LINUX Mint! OS and boot your PC from the USB port, since the BIOS may be configured to boot from the USB prior to booting from the hard drive. It will be a slower system, but can be appropriately managed.
One other note:
Your initial intent has been outsmarted by MS.
Once they have Bing on your machine, they can pretty well track and upload anything they want on it, even without your intentional consent or rejection. It’s in their boilerplate licensing agreements.
Also MS has removed themselves pretty much from responsibility as they have shoved the customer service off on the 3rd Party OEM. In turn, many of the Customer System definitions are hinged upon insuring the OEM is able to provide customer support.
IMHO, Microsoft remarkably emulates a socialist run racket.
I presently have a Win 7 Pro machine that I’d like to upgrade to Win 10 Pro.
The process you describe should work on it, correct?
I actually have 3 machines with Win 10 Pro, one with Win 10 Home, 2 with Win 7 Pro, an old laptop that I rarely use with Vista on it (UGH!), an XP Pro machine (well loved, but now only used rarely for a couple programs I’ve not been able to easily replace / upgrade) and an ancient but still runs fine for the DOS apps (and huge full length specific app [electronics testing] board in it). I find I prefer Win 7 Pro, but increasing numbers of websites won’t work on it and IE 11. (I detest “Edge”, BTW, and am not thrilled with Chrome, not to mention the fact that I’m old enough that I think I’m running out of brain cells and trying to be modestly knowledgeable in several different browsers, OS’s, etc., on top of everything else - personal, business, “outside” consulting jobs, Mom’s affairs, Dad’s affairs (elderly & divorced), family, etc... may make my head explode.)
OTOH I have a couple programs on the Win 7 Pro machines that I can’t get to work on Win 10, regardless of what I do with compatibility settings and such, and I’ve not yet found suitable replacements, so I’ve hung on to 7 Pro for that reason too. However, the machine I’d like to upgrade from 7 Pro to 10 Pro is my “main”, machine, so it’s time to do that... IF it is practical and I can keep all the other programs and data. (The couple programs that would lose functionality are almost not large enough to bother uninstalling, but I likely would just to reduce clutter.)
If keeping the installed programs, does the USB Flash drive need enough room to store them? Data — I would have backed up anyway.
Thanks.
these days there are petitions on the OS drive that lets you reinstall the OS from the preboot environment, unfortunately you’ll still get all the bloatware back. your best bet is to make a microsoft ID. from there you can download the win10 installers. There is a piece of software “windows creator” if I remember, that you use to make a bootable win10 install usb stick. I’d suggest having separate copies of the video card and wifi drivers just in case. Once you have the boot stick the reinstall should be easy. I use a program drivereasy to find and download updated drivers. BTW the usb stick should be at least 16gb, but your better off with at least a 32gb stick. once your new system is setup as you like, you can use it to make an emergency reinstall stick from with in windows.
When you get the machine, before changing anything, backup the entire system to a USB drive. Then burn the Mint 18.3 to a live DVD. Boot Mint to see if you have no issues.
If good, install 19.3 and a vm player, I am partial to virtual box. Open a new vm instance and restore Windows to the VM instance. Archive off the VM instance (USB drive)
Now you will have linux Mint, can run Windows, can create other Windows instances from the USB if needed.
Just talking out loud
Since you are feeling frisky, before you do anything, perform a Win 7 Backup (see Control Panel or Settings). The result is backup files created as VHDX files. You may then also learn that Win 10 may not recognize VHDX files. However, there are various ways to figger this out by mounting the VHDX file as a drive, restoring therefrom, reading files from the VHDX files, etc. VHDX was designed to actually create up to 64 TB files. Wow! Anyhoo, do the backup, and learn, at this early stage, what happens when you need to restore/recover data from a backup (VHDX files). You can also do a clean install by dlding the build file from the Microsoft catalog website, creating a bootable disc, and installing from that, using your key.
Anyone using Win 10 needs to become intricately involved with making backups, restoring backups, and restoring selected files. Please, do this NOW, before you need to restore a previous backup. You may feel that since you made the backup, you are good to go! WRONG!! Test your backup and restore skills NOW, with WIN 10!!!
Nice unit, looked it up. It does not have a disk drive and i need one. almost 1500 and no dick drive!
I drove with my knees once, but that?
Teaches me to look it over twice!
I have upgraded Laptops running widows 7 to the latest with no real issues save some updates I got. Even put a Samsung ssd in one that is many years old and it is a flyer now. I have also used a Micron 2280 format SSD drive in one and it flew as well using a Sabrent Converter to SATA and it works in a LAptop and Desktop running Win 10 versus the Win7 machines they were
As to your initial question I know it works for Win10 home but not premium, although my research showed that functions in 10 Pro I would never use. When you make the USB it only stores the O/S and leaves everything in place, have never lost a file or anything yet. In fact I used the Media Creation Tool in place on the system and it went right through
On the latter, ok, only the old OS is removed, leaving all else in place. Good. This Win 7 Pro machine already has a 128 GB SSD as the C: drive (boot / OS / most programs) and a 500 GB HD as the data drive "D:", so, no real issues there unless for some reason I want to put in a larger SSD.
I did the SSD upgrade on this machine, a few years back, but with no OS upgrade, as Win 10 was not yet out. IIRC, I used Macrium Reflect to transfer "everything".
Funniest typo of the New Year!!!
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