Posted on 12/08/2018 5:51:38 PM PST by MNDude
I believe some of these protesters have been throwing tear gas grenades back at the police but I believe this one actually had TNT in it.
(Excerpt) Read more at twitter.com ...
Actually no. Just a little sleight-of-hand.
They should be using poop gas to clean those Frenchmen out.
That’s what happens when you don’t wear your yellow safety vest kids.
Learned back in 1969 that all grenades are pyrotechnic devices and can go “high order” when you pull the pin to arm them..
A trainee next to me lost a couple of fingers to a smoke grenade. Learned how to arm smoke grenades and similar, non-HE, devices using only three fingers keeping the palm of my hand well away from the grenade’s casing.
Didn’t eat much dinner that night.
Thanks,
That sounds gruesome!
Time to dust off the old jai alai racquet.
I hope someone applied a tourniquet
Um, no.
Those were flashbangs, not gas.
Pertinent:
Oops, bad grammar on my part I guess....not a “combo” CS/Flash bang...I meant that the police started using flash bangs in addition to the tear gas that they had been using previously. No such item as a “Combo CS-Flash Bang” I don’t think.
No, I have never reloaded a .22 cartridge. I do not know anyone who does. The smallest caliber that I reload for pistols are .30 caliber. I also do not cast any bullets smaller than .30 caliber. Do you understand the difference between rimfire and centerfire cartridges?
My favorite powder for pistol cartridges is Hodgdon Titegroup, there are many full power pistol cartridge recipes that take only a couple grains of Titegroup and a projectile in the 90 grain range. A typical projectile in a .22 cartridge is in the 40 grain range or less.
Made a handwich....
Hold my wine bottle and watch this!
You can’t fix stupid!!!
7000 grains to a pound. 4.6/7000 is .0066 lbs or 1522 charges per pound.
Your charge is 437.5 grn/ounce/4.6 grn or 95 charges per ounce, or .0105 ounces.....
Indeed, a small amount of smokeless powder, contained in a cartridge case has quite a bit of potential energy.
Explosives, on the other hand deflagrate nearly instantaneously creating a shock wave, unlike propellants which burn much much more slowly to produce controlled pulses of energy to drive a projectile vice destroy the container into fragments or create a shock /pressure wave.
Ahh. Thanks for the clarification...as Roseanna Roseannadanna used to say...”Never Mind!”
So, it looks like they started using flashbangs along with CS. I only know of this from movies, I assume they look different...CS is cylindrical, flashbangs are spherical?
Sorry, your math that is off by a factor of ten. 4.6/700 = .0066, 4.6/7000 = .00066 lbs.
I said in my post, “a couple of grains of powder, which is 4.6 thousandths of an ounce.” This is an accurate statement, but I did round up. To be more precise 2 grains = 0.00457143 of an ounce.
Your charge is 437.5 grn/ounce/4.6 grn or 95 charges per ounce, or .0105 ounces.....
You are getting yourself confused. When I say my cartridge recipe uses a couple of grains of powder that means around 2 grains, which is the same as 4.6 thousandths of an ounce not 4.6 grains. Smokeless powders vary a great deal in their burn rate. Powders such as my favorite for pistols, Titegroup are designed to burn very quickly. A double charge can be very, very dangerous. If I inadvertently used 4.6 grains instead of 2.3 grains in a handgun that was not designed to handle the amount of pressure that would be developed, it would most likely be damaged or destroyed and could easily cause a serious injury similar in nature to the one shown in this video.
I am assuming that you realize that the “active” ingredients in “smokeless” powders are mixtures of nitrocellulose and/or nitroglycerin and/or nitroguanidine along with various other ingredients which at the granular level are formed into specific shapes, all to help control the burn rate. These are products designed and tested to extremely precise specifications.
I am not really sure of the intent of your post other than to share your knowledge that their is a difference between the smokeless powder used in firearm cartridges and the ingredients used to make a grenade go boom. I am glad that you realize that there is a difference. Fast burning smokeless powders can easily be used in an explosive device they merely need to be ignited within an enclosed container. But even baking soda and vinegar within a pressure cooker have been used very effective improvised explosive devices. You don't need "explosives" to create an explosion.
The only intent of my post was to point out that the power held within even small amounts of chemical compounds is often far greater than what people realize. It does not take TNT to blow someones hand off.
Definitely not a deer-killing load.
I do not know anyone who hunts deer using a pistol. But perhaps in Texas things are done differently.
I can tell you that cartridges I reload for 7.62x25mm Tokarev pistols use only around 5 grains of Titegroup powder and send a 90 grain 30 cal projectile down the 4.6 inch barrel and through the muzzle at over 1,500 fps. This is enough velocity to pierce the brake rotor from a passenger car when using a steel core projectile. Don't ask me how I know. There are plenty of videos on Youtube that demonstrate the penetration abilities of the 7.62x25mm Tokarev cartridge.
To make your case you have moved the goalposts from 2 to 5 grains.
Lots of people hunt deer with pistols.
I can only describe what was standard back when I was on riot duty with the National Guard, and that was back in the 1970s, in the US. This is now 2018, and that is France on our TV screens.
We did not have flashbangs for riot control. We had concussion grenades, for demolition and assaulting fortified positions, and ‘simulators’ for training. The former were cylindrical, the same size as the smoke and burn type tear gas grenades, and black
in color. The latter were cylindrical, smaller than the combat munitions, white, and used a friction fuse rather than the combat ring-pin and spoon detonators of the standard grenades. The simulators replaced the previous training grenades, remembered as the “M80”, which were basically big fire-crackers.
The burn type tear gas grenades were the same size and shape as the smoke grenades, and worked the same way, except that there were lachrymal agents (CN, CS, or both) in the smoke generating charges that started burning as soon as the grenade was thrown or launched. There were also training versions which had much less and much milder tearing agent in the burn charge, but I only heard about those; the NG didn't get them. We used regular smoke grenades for chemical agent (including tear gas) training. Yellow smoke grenades were preferred, as they smelled pretty bad anyway. The CS bursting grenades were spherical, about the size of a baseball, and tan, with a colored stripe around them. The igniter was a button on the top of the grenade: push the button and 5 seconds (more or less) later the disbursing charge would go ‘pop’ and spread the very fine CS powder through the air. The tan plastic shell of the grenade was very fragile so that the disbursing charge would shatter it completely and not spread fragments with the CS. In fact, the shell was so fragile that the grenade would break open if you dropped it on a hard surface, and the CS would disburse itself on any stray air currents.
I do not know what the current tear gas agents are in the current military inventory, nor what they look like. I would assume that the different weapons and munitions would look different and have different sizes and shapes to keep the users from using the wrong one in the field, under the stress of action, but I may be giving the Ordinance Corps and Departments too much credit for good sense. The police departments use even a wider variety of agents and munitions than the military, with no standardization that *I* can see, and many of the ‘pepper’ (capsicum) based agents are available to almost anyone on the civilian market.
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