Two Big Reasons Why Russia’s Aircraft Carrier Is Having So Many Problems

War is Boring ^ | December 9, 2016 | Dave Majumdar

[C19fan]

The Russian Navy has lost two carrier-based fighters onboard its sole remaining carrier Admiral Kuznetsov in the span of only a few weeks. On both occasions, technical problems with Kuznetsov’s arresting gear played a central role in the accidents — which have cost the Kremlin a Mikoyan MiG-29KUBR Fulcrum-D and a Sukhoi Su-33 Flanker-D. While Kuznetsov’s hardware is old, the bigger issue is Russia’s relative lack of experience in naval aviation and insufficient proficiency with launching and recovering combat aircraft onboard a carrier at sea.

[RetSignman]

The rowers they had down below deck were dying off?

[bert]

——the carrier is there is to get practice-—

An academic exercise...... I can go with that.

I watched Tora, Tora, Tora Wednesday and the presentation of the battle within the Japanese navy over a battleship or carrier superiority. The officers nearly came to blows in spite of their white gloves

Since there is only one Russian carrier that has been shown with painful reality to be far from up to snuff, perhaps there is a similar battle within the Russian navy about carriers. What we have is worthless and we need to start all over with new up to date everything vs we don’t need carriers at all, forget a bout it.

[Joe Boucher]

“A rabble of drunken looting bums with no leadership at all.”?
Sounds like my inlaws coming for Thanksgiving dinner.

[Flying Circus]

We have had two in the last year, they have had two in two weeks according to this article. Now they have one carrier versus our eleven carriers and how many sorties have each launched? Our accident rate must be at least one, maybe 2 orders of magnitude less than theirs.

[GreyHoundSailor]

We steamed quite close to them when they made their first Med deployment in 1996. During flight ops, most of the flight deck crew was smoking, many had shorts and no protective gear we could see, and some wore flip-flops. Wonder if all their practice has corrected that?

[KC Burke]

You might like “The Fleet at Flood Tide: America at Total War in the Pacific, 1944-1945” by James D. Hornfischer.

It is a follow up to his “Neptunes Inferno” about the Guadalcanal Campaign that proceeded it. It takes in a much broader picture and ends with air campaign to deliver the bombs.

Those two books if we also add something for Midway all together tell us all the WWII taught us about Carrier warfare.

[Chode]

[rlmorel]

Excellent author. Neptune’s Inferno is one of my favorite military books.

[rlmorel]

Thanks Chode!

[Chode]

having/owning is NOT the same as operating

i know a LOT of people that own guns and couldn't hit the broad side of a barn

[TexasTransplant]

*** “ The U.S. Navy aircraft carriers are truly impressive, both in terms of men and equipment. I fear, however, that they will be sitting ducks when faced with the latest generation Russian and Chinese missiles” ***

Nope! It is Mid Rats... we can handle the Chinks and the Ruskies but Mid Rats....

Enlist and go serve on a Carrier... you will find that the Mid Rat meals are not that exceptional, but ya kind of get used to it. Once you discover that Tabasco is the Key Ingredient to make them palatable, then you can’t get enough. F@ck a bunch of Russians and Chinese it’s easy to kick their ass.
I miss my Mid Rats! Pass the Tabasco ya wannabe asshole!
Real Men eat Mid Rats .. pussy’s eat Salad and Fresh Food during the day, Real Men Eat Midrats, ya hear me!

So your concern pretty much equals
“Never Fear, Navy is Here” and entire Countries appreciate it, especially if it comes in the form of an Aircraft Carrier. I have also been to smaller countries and a Destroyer was just as good, (Yep did that too)
We used to kick bad guy ass, now Obama just wants them to be ass... ain’t happening if I’m there.

I have a History... made E-3 Four times, E-5 Five times and E-6 Three times, (last time cause I got married and settled down)
And DUH if you are doing the Math... never counted how many times I did E-4 because that is pretty much what I always was but I had uniforms for E-5 so I could stand other folks Watches for cash and prizes (E-5 get all the Watches) and on a Carrier no body knows ... just have to show up dressed right and do the job. Then eat Mid Rats
I miss my Mid Rat Dried out burger and cheese, just cardboard dry enough to accept Mayo and Tabasco and still be crunchy. Dang it they were awesome, 40 yrs ago and I still miss them
I think I jinxed the thought and you accepting ... He IS gong to Test me,
I will find you Home” foll3

I am’me surriunde by what?

[bert]

Thanks..... I'll check it out today.

The FReeper non sequiter recommended to the forum the book "Shattered Sword, the untold story of the battle of Midway." by Jonathan Parschall. It describes the status of tha Japanese Navy in detail. It gives a literally minute by minute account of operations on the various japanese and American carriers that refute most accounts that are based on the work of LtCdr Fuchida.

I have read and then reread the book several times.

[KC Burke]

With a different understanding of the Japanese side of events, what major changes to your understanding of the event does it provide? (If the answer is 16 pages of subtle detail — I understand if you want to pass — LOL)

[bert]

1. The Japanese fleet lost two carriers at Coral Sea. They proceeded with Midway under the assumption 4 would do the job because they were superior. The plan was etched in stone, couldn’t be altered.
2. The normal operations on deck and between decks of the Japanese operations was confused by events and was carried out in a normal manner that was slow by American standards and caused problems. Contrary to most books, the Japanese carriers flight deck was not full of planes at the time of the critical US Navy bomber attacks.
3. The Japanese carriers did not have good damage control and their hanger decks were designed in such a manner to prohibit fire and destruction once it started. The very design led to destruction
4. The bridge of Japanese carriers was physically so small, the Commander was hemmed in by too many personnel that “had to be there”. He lacked the freedom to move and think. The American commanders had space and thus some freedom from pressing events.
5. The Japanese fleet was just not prepared to fight the battle of battles in June of 1942

The book is solidly researched from records and interviews on both sides.

The book in question gets down to the nit in many many details including all the pilots and commanders of each vessel. The detail is more than I could describe even if I could remember it all. There are extensive illustrations of all the carriers and the various aircraft.

Shattered Sword is the definitive account of the Battle of Midway.

Once again.... thanks to Non Sequiter

I ordered used paperbacks of the books you recommended.... both for $8.00

[PLMerite]

We need to park one of ours close so they can see and run some real fight ops. Show ‘em how it’s done.

[KC Burke]

Thanks for the summary. Some of that insufficiency revealed by that author was apparently understood by Hornfischer in The Fleet at Flood Tide as he talks of newly understood limitations of their carrier operations.