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Einstein's gravitational waves 'seen' from black holes
BBC ^ | Fed 11, 2016 | Pallab Ghosh

Posted on 02/11/2016 9:49:13 AM PST by jpsb

Scientists are claiming a stunning discovery in their quest to fully understand gravity.

(Excerpt) Read more at bbc.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: einstein; gravity; relativity
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To: VanShuyten
This means gravity runs at light speed and is not instantaneous.

Albert Einstein 1, Isaac Newton 0.

21 posted on 02/11/2016 10:19:12 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: Borges

Did they verify the speed or just detect the existence?

They say it matches equations, which implies the speed is verified, but it is not explicitly stated in the article that they verified that piece of it.


22 posted on 02/11/2016 10:20:16 AM PST by fruser1
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To: dfwgator
 photo 1850ce0e29b9f8e6eecddd00fd08530e_zpsozmfhnkh.jpg
23 posted on 02/11/2016 10:20:57 AM PST by Zeneta (Thoughts in time and out of season.)
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To: Borges

“General Relativity states that gravitation is not instantaneous.”

Oh yes it does. If it weren’t instantaneous, we wouldn’t be in stable orbits around the sun, because the drag from the moving gravitational source would have sent us all spinning off into deep space long ago.


24 posted on 02/11/2016 10:21:33 AM PST by Boogieman
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To: Boogieman

yes


25 posted on 02/11/2016 10:25:32 AM PST by jpsb (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied. Otto von Bismark)
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To: Lurking Libertarian
Isaac Newton 0.

That's a little harsh don't you think?

26 posted on 02/11/2016 10:26:55 AM PST by jpsb (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied. Otto von Bismark)
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To: Boogieman

Some among us are already spinning into deep space and don’t realize it.


27 posted on 02/11/2016 10:27:49 AM PST by TruthWillWin (The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples money.)
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To: jpsb
That's a little harsh don't you think?

Actually, yes. Nothing can take away from Newton's incalculable contributions to science and mathematics. All I should have said is that on the one point where Einstein's theory of relativity contradicted Newton's theory of universal gravitation, Einstein has been proven right.

28 posted on 02/11/2016 10:33:14 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: jpsb

The technology utilized in this cosmological search is nothing short of astounding.


29 posted on 02/11/2016 10:33:46 AM PST by onedoug
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To: jpsb

Yes, entanglement seems to operate instantaneously.

Why or how... that’s a mystery still I think.


30 posted on 02/11/2016 10:37:25 AM PST by Boogieman
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To: jpsb
True but is not the communication between photons emitted from an excited electron instantaneous?

Nope; just too fast to measure.

31 posted on 02/11/2016 10:38:48 AM PST by JimRed (Is it 1776 yet? TERM LIMITS, now and forever! Build the Wall, NOW!)
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To: Boogieman

Help me understand this. The earth is 8 light minutes from the sun. Is the gravitational effect of the sun on the earth measured by where the sun was 8 minutes ago or by right now?


32 posted on 02/11/2016 10:41:22 AM PST by ModelBreaker (')
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To: Lurking Libertarian

Much better, I did not know that Newton even address the speed which gravity operated. I find that very interesting. I suppose not address the speed implies instantaneous.


33 posted on 02/11/2016 10:48:49 AM PST by jpsb (Never believe anything in politics until it has been officially denied. Otto von Bismark)
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To: ModelBreaker

It’s instantaneous. Our orbit is based on where the sun is right now, not where it was eight minutes ago.


34 posted on 02/11/2016 10:56:14 AM PST by Boogieman
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To: jpsb

Cool news. I have friends who worked on the LIGO project.


35 posted on 02/11/2016 11:09:47 AM PST by Cooter (Radicals always try to force crises because in a crisis, everyone must choose sides. - J. Goldberg)
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To: jpsb

Can’t belieive the British are still calling it a black hole.


36 posted on 02/11/2016 11:15:13 AM PST by Cyman
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To: Boogieman; ModelBreaker
It's instantaneous. Our orbit is based on where the sun is right now, not where it was eight minutes ago.

From Earth's frame of reference it's effectively instantaneous but if the Sun suddenly disappeared then Earth's orbit wouldn't change for 8 minutes. It would appear to be pulled to the point the Sun would have been in 8 minutes had it not disappeared. Is that incorrect?

37 posted on 02/11/2016 12:14:04 PM PST by Reeses (A journey of a thousand miles begins with a government pat down.)
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To: Reeses

No, you are correct, and I think you are really getting to the heart of what the difference is between the speed at which gravity propagates and the speed at which gravity waves propagate. Your example would be an example of gravity waves propagating, and not gravity propagating, which is why it would act at the speed of light.

It helps if you stop thinking about gravity itself and think about it as an effect of the geometry of spacetime. Mass warps spacetime, and gravity is the effect we feel as we travel through warped spacetime. Once the spacetime is warped, we feel these effects instantaneously, because they are produced by the geometry of the local spacetime we are traveling through, like the slope of the road you are driving your car over.

Now, if the sun were to disappear, spacetime would “unwarp”. That “unwarping” could not happen instantaneously. THAT is what would propagate at the speed of light, the “unwarping” of spacetime. Gravity, being an aftereffect of the local geometry of spacetime, is always going to be instantaneous, but the changes in that geometry can’t happen instantaneously.


38 posted on 02/11/2016 12:23:47 PM PST by Boogieman
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To: jpsb

Hey sweetheart, would you like to see my gravity wave machine?


39 posted on 02/11/2016 1:13:10 PM PST by AndyJackson
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To: jpsb

“True but is not the communication between photons emitted from an excited electron instantaneous?”

Not sure, but a green photon from a traffic light and dude behind you honking is sometimes instantaneous.


40 posted on 02/12/2016 5:57:16 AM PST by getitright (If you call this HOPE, can we give despair a shot?)
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