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Bill Whitaker: Wacoans to learn plenty about bikers, ballistics and the Bill of Rights...
Waco Tribune ^ | June 14, 2015 | BILL WHITAKER Opinion editor

Posted on 06/14/2015 8:00:04 AM PDT by don-o

Four weeks after the deadly Twin Peaks shooting melee that left nine bikers dead, 177 others in jail with million-dollar bonds and way more questions than answers about biker subculture, due process in Waco and conflicting crime narratives, the two sides in all this are only hardening in their positions. In short, a microcosm of the American way.

Some vigorously support local law enforcement. They say the facts that bikers came to Waco’s Twin Peaks restaurant well-armed and that search warrants reveal many wore colors of motorcycle gangs associated by the FBI and Texas Department of Public Safety with criminal activity, organized and otherwise, justifies the bikers’ incarceration and high bonds.

anip

The Trib may well have to revise its own estimation that the Twin Peaks dustup won’t leave a stigma attached to Waco such as that spawned by the 51-day Branch Davidian siege of 1993, which sparked wild conspiracy theories while leaving Waco with a black eye that had only recently begun to disappear. With legal questions revolving around interpretations of the First, Second, Fourth, Fifth and Eighth amendments — including the right to wear motorcycle gang colors if you so choose — there’s enough constitutional grist in this complicated saga to keep state and federal courts busy for years. And that’s allowing also for a conspiracy theory or two. It’s the American way.

(Excerpt) Read more at wacotrib.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: aclu; waco
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To: don-o

Waco has smelled like a Fed Driven event from the beginning. The DA in Waco a few years ago had 1/2 million dollars in his asset forfeiture account. He apparently is running it like a business.

Now think about this>

(Current AG) Loretta Lynch’s Worrisome Answer on Civil Asset Forfeiture

http://www.cato.org/blog/loretta-lynchs-worrisome-answer-civil-asset-forfeiture

Her own words:

http://www.cato.org/multimedia/daily-podcast/loretta-lynch-civil-asset-forfeiture

Coincidence? May be. May be not.


81 posted on 06/16/2015 10:28:27 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: don-o

More here>

Obama’s AG nominee has seized $904 million in private property through “civil asset forfeiture”

http://poorrichardsnews.com/post/102336560238/obamas-ag-nominee-has-seized-904-million-in

Now can we connect the dots?

Intelligence report from DOJ on biker crimes listing “criminal clubs”.

Waco DA who already practices Asset Forfeiture on grand scale. Has 2 prosecutors for that.

I think there is a BATF office in or near Waco. (if my memory is correct)

Waco Police has reputation for wanting to be cowboy law enforcement.

Prior violence in North TX by Banditos.

Published mass gathering locally of bikers (rich target of assets to confiscate)

And remember a conviction is not necessarily involved with asset forfeiture.

Motive to approach the case as RICO. (Fed law enforcement method)

??


82 posted on 06/16/2015 10:37:52 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: Texas Fossil

Imitation (Waco) is the sincerest form of flattery.


83 posted on 06/16/2015 10:47:32 AM PDT by don-o (I am Kenneth Carlisle - Waco 5/17/15)
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To: don-o; Finny; USNBandit

“The piece, from the Chief, that his officers were in their cars, is a crumb that raises the possibility of a panicked reaction that they had not war gamed for.” ———

I think most everyone else believes just that, too. I think it even is rather obvious that the officers panicked. It is maybe a miracle they were as restrained as they were, under panic.

I think that is exactly why Waco residents have not set their own hair on fire over this and joined up in the scorched earth rage of outside bikers against the LE. The residents, I have said from the beginning, know these officers and believe their motivations are as decent as their own would be, under the same circumstances.

It seems like it’s the bikers from outside of Waco and outside of the event itself who can’t get a hearing because, frankly, no one in Waco yet agrees with them, or with their fast draw conclusions, or in the ridiculous conspiracies.

Also, on the clothing question. Gang clothing is a proud identifier. But if you are from a gang that is under, or has been under investigation and you come into Waco armed, it seems to me your clothing isn’t just clothing anymore it’s your ID.

LE should have an interest in your proud gang ID and your weapon and have a right to act on information that you are coming into town. Identification is the name of every game now days and it does have carte blanche, whether we like it or not. It’s also lawful to question your ID. These idiots should have known that and appreciated the nerves of cops right now, given they are under hell fire all over the country.

Go have a picnic at the lake and blast your jets, scare all the fish, but lunch on Sunday in the shopping center, with families? Not so much.

This is becoming a non-story as cooler heads are seeming to prevail. My 2 cents.


84 posted on 06/16/2015 10:59:05 AM PDT by RitaOK ( VIVA CRISTO REY / Public education is the farm team for more Marxists coming)
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To: don-o

Past performance is not assurance of future results, but it certainly reveals the mindset of those involved.

Proverbs Chapter 23:7

For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he


85 posted on 06/16/2015 11:14:51 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: vette6387

The autopsies are being done by a third party in Dallas. It was mentioned in the article.


86 posted on 06/16/2015 12:15:08 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: don-o

This article mentions Loretta Lynch and the coming months of the Obama Administration. It is clear that Ted Cruz understands how horrible she is as AG and how weak the GOP leadership is in dealing with her and Obama.

The ‘Next 20 Months Will Be Very Dangerous’ Cruz Has Dark Warning For America and The World

http://www.right180.com/13213.asp?s=6822&g=0

In light of our discussion of her bearing on Asset Forfeiture and the apparent insanity of the Waco Twin Peaks incident, I thought you might want to read this.


87 posted on 06/17/2015 7:15:08 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: RitaOK
I think that is exactly why Waco residents have not set their own hair on fire over this

Hmmmm. Now where have I heard that metaphor recently? 1600 something, iirc...

Please keep in mind there are separate things going on here. What happened on 5/17 and what has happened since 5/17.

From the OP

With legal questions revolving around interpretations of the First, Second, Fourth, Fifth and Eighth amendments — including the right to wear motorcycle gang colors if you so choose — there’s enough constitutional grist in this complicated saga to keep state and federal courts busy for years.

I am aware of at least three lawsuits already filed.

88 posted on 06/17/2015 7:34:07 AM PDT by don-o (I am Kenneth Carlisle - Waco 5/17/15)
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To: RitaOK

1. On FR we’re on the same team. Most of the time I am lock step behind your posts.

2. I know a number of people who have lived in Waco. All I know have told me there are problems within the Waco PD.

3. In my opinion, the “preparations” of the Twin Peak police presence was based on “intelligence” of the DOJ or Homeland Security. And that “intelligence” was very flawed. It was admitted early by the BATF that they had a presence at Twin Peaks. Now they are scurrying away like cockroaches trying to not be noticed.

I agree that most of the police in Waco are reasonable people. I know the area.

But it is clear by the public information releases that someone is in CYA mode within the Waco PD. The Chief’s recent release was more reasonable than the blame the bikers and blame Twin Peaks crap that came from Swanton. I don’t expect us to hear much more from Swanton.

The RICO approach MUST have been steered by the DOJ or some other Fed Agency. It is the method they use. State Police almost never do that. In this case those methods are terribly misapplied.

This is NOT just a Waco PD event. I think that will eventually come out. It appears the state of TX oversight has kicked in and that sanity will gradually be reasserted.


89 posted on 06/17/2015 7:37:29 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Texas is not where you were born, but a Free State of Heart, Mind & Attitude!)
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To: Texas Fossil

Page will not load for me.


90 posted on 06/17/2015 7:54:21 AM PDT by don-o (I am Kenneth Carlisle - Waco 5/17/15)
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To: Texas Fossil

I can’t disagree with a word you said. What you said is what I believe, and you said it better. You also added some things I didn’t know.

I know no one in Waco, and it’s from press reports and media coverage that I hear crickets from the residents, which makes outside observers like me say that, at least for the time being, Waco people are not into scorched earth mode against their PD and DPS. YET. I sure realize that things can change. And, I really appreciate your information.

Waco residents seems to be waiting to see how this shakes out, as am I. I am not knowledgeable enough to know their problems with the local PD exactly, but only that I’m seeing no coverage of their distress with them in the broader media. (No marches, no riots, no bond fires to stick their hair in. :) )

Anything that involves DOJ or Homeland Security or BATF, particularly under this president, has ended in chaos and tragedy. It’s without fail their trademark!

You mentioned Texas oversight is beginning. I thought all along that if the evidence ever really supports the screamers, that this was really a big evil ambush by a bunch of badges, then eventually it would wind up before the US Congress for hearings at some point. I failed to think about the state oversight. That’s where it all begins.

Thank you for not taking my head off. I hear better when it’s an informative, civil exchange and not a freaked out rant where I have to do more ducking than listening. LOL!

I hope you will keep me informed when you think something official is actually breaking. I’m not interested in more blog speculations and rants. That has run its course with me.

I admit to my bias for beat cops and DPS. I break for them every time, almost until I see the verdict, as I am very concerned for their safety after Ferguson and Baltimore, and of course this coming summer season, especially.

I will try to the follow the state’s assessment of the evidence as it breaks. Sure hasn’t been much news from my TV sources on anything.

Thank you very much, TF.
Rita


91 posted on 06/17/2015 8:37:11 AM PDT by RitaOK ( VIVA CRISTO REY / Public education is the farm team for more Marxists coming)
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To: don-o

Huh?

Something about hair on fire, 1600? WTH are you talking about? Never mind.

Sorry, what is “OP”?

“With legal questions revolving around interpretations of ....... “

LOL!

ALL screamers use that as their opening statement for presenting a case. It nets us nothing because it is so damned ordinary, the typical, traditional, expected, common first sentence to any local, state or federal complaint.

Evidence determines outcomes, not opening lines. Yes, it all may take years, but probably not about the “clothing”.
A no brainer, there.


92 posted on 06/17/2015 8:45:22 AM PDT by RitaOK ( VIVA CRISTO REY / Public education is the farm team for more Marxists coming)
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To: RitaOK
Something about hair on fire, 1600? WTH are you talking about? Never mind.

1600 Pennsylvania Avenue in Washington DC. Hair on fire is a favorite of Obama's mouthpiece.

Sorry, what is “OP”?

Original post that started this thread.

“With legal questions revolving around interpretations of ....... “ LOL! ALL screamers use that as their opening statement for presenting a case. It nets us nothing because it is so damned ordinary, the typical, traditional, expected, common first sentence to any local, state or federal complaint.

The words are those of the Opinion Editor of the Waco newspaper.

93 posted on 06/17/2015 8:54:44 AM PDT by don-o (I am Kenneth Carlisle - Waco 5/17/15)
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To: don-o

Okay, thanks for bringing me up to speed. I appreciate it.


94 posted on 06/17/2015 9:05:38 AM PDT by RitaOK ( VIVA CRISTO REY / Public education is the farm team for more Marxists coming)
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To: USNBandit; don-o
Were the police supposed to sit idly by and wait for the gun fight to reach a logical conclusion?

Let me see how this logic works: Someone in a crowd opens fire on someone else in the crowd so the police kill nine people to prevent anyone from getting hurt.

Isn't that the same thing as destroying a village in order to save it?

95 posted on 06/17/2015 2:41:59 PM PDT by MeganC (You can ignore reality, but reality won't ignore you.)
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To: MeganC

Where is your proof that the police killed 9 people?


96 posted on 06/17/2015 2:46:17 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: MeganC

Unless of course you are trying to say that the 32 shell casing found at the scene, that didn’t come from law enforcement weapons, all missed their targets.


97 posted on 06/17/2015 2:48:47 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: USNBandit
Where is your proof that the police killed 9 people?

It's right next to the proof that the bikers killed each other in an exchange of gunfire while at least 12 shots fired by police sharpshooters all (coincidentally) went wild and hit no one at all.

And I don't believe the police only fired 12 shots. Sharpshooters know to police their brass and it's surprising that 12 casings belonging to the police were found at all. Someone wasn't being careful about picking up evidence.

98 posted on 06/17/2015 2:50:51 PM PDT by MeganC (You can ignore reality, but reality won't ignore you.)
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To: MeganC

I never said the police didn’t hit anybody. What I am asking you for is where you have evidence that the only people killed were killed by police. To answer my own question you have no evidence because you can’t wait for the autopsy and ballistics to come back.


99 posted on 06/17/2015 3:33:00 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: Texas Fossil; RitaOK
Yeah, but Texas Fossil, Rita (who shocks me with this because most of the time I, too, am lockstep behind Rita's posts) says that "cooler heads are prevailing" and because of that, this is becoming a "non-story."

That is someone who is on the wrong team. Someone who has been watching this story from the start and has yet to smell a big rat and IN FACT, seems supportive of excessive bail for nearly 200 Americans, ruined lives in jobs lost, bills unpaid, property repossessed, all because they wrongly assumed they had freedom of association in America. Their "crime" was belonging to a motorcycle club that Rita thinks were criminals because the police are telling her they were.

Rita OK is apparently okay with this flagrant abuse of power that is setting a precedent for much, much worse. She thinks that those of us who are outraged just "have our hair on fire," that hers is the "cooler" head.

Sorry, Texas, but Rita has something seriously awry for someone claiming to be an America patriot.

100 posted on 06/18/2015 11:10:24 PM PDT by Finny (Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. -- Psalm 119:105)
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