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RUSH: Giving up citizenship -which nation is the New America?
Heritage Foundation ^ | 2013 | NA

Posted on 08/12/2013 10:42:33 AM PDT by Deathtomarxists

Just listening to Rush

He is discussing the increase in people giving up US citizenship. I have thought about this as have many in my family. But where to go? Is it really an option politically and financially? Which culture would be the best fit for an ex-American citizen? What kind of legal hassles would result? Please be specific as to why you feel the country you state is the "best" country to immigrate to; political/social atmosphere, wage, social mobility, entrepreneurial opportunities, etc.


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: citizenship; cowards; deserter; desertion; expats; free; freedom; immigrate; livefreeordie; rushlimbaugh; rushlive; tyranny
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To: wku man

Agree with you completely. My Dad didn’t fight in WWII just so that I could throw it all away and run with my tail between my legs. I’m staying and fighting for my birthright. I’d rather die a patriot than live as a coward.


51 posted on 08/12/2013 11:15:55 AM PDT by 2nd amendment mama ( www.2asisters.org | Self defense is a basic human right!)
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To: Fighting Irish

They are kind hearted to you because you have money. If you look at the living conditions of most Filipinos you will realize they are not so nice to each other.The upper and middle classes have nothing but contempt for the poor majority. Lived there before.


52 posted on 08/12/2013 11:16:36 AM PDT by sunrise_sunset
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To: Marcella
I have made my own country in which to live and it's my house and small back garden. I am the President for Life of my country...

Good point.

Where ever you go, where ever you decide to live, build the culture you want to live in. Build the country you want to live in.

53 posted on 08/12/2013 11:16:50 AM PDT by marron
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To: Romulus

If you are a foreigner you will NOT find work in Australia.


54 posted on 08/12/2013 11:17:33 AM PDT by TheRhinelander
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To: 2nd amendment mama

May be a moot discussion because the courts have ruled that you may REQUEST to renounce your US Citizenship, but the Government does not have to grant your request.

And given this trend, I think that “no” is going to become their standard pat answer.


55 posted on 08/12/2013 11:17:47 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Deathtomarxists

Where in Idaho is that new NSA facility?


56 posted on 08/12/2013 11:17:48 AM PDT by ColdOne (I miss my poochie... Tasha 2000~3/14/11)
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To: Romulus

Australia has no second amendment or fourth amendment.

The litmus tests should be (in no order):

codification of normal marriage.
second amendment rights.
regulation minimum business environment.
tax cap
no national sales tax
no socialized or single payer tax system
etc.


57 posted on 08/12/2013 11:18:52 AM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: Buckeye McFrog
May be a moot discussion because the courts have ruled that you may REQUEST to renounce your US Citizenship, but the Government does not have to grant your request. And given this trend, I think that “no” is going to become their standard pat answer.

And if that's the case, freedom may become a felony.

58 posted on 08/12/2013 11:18:56 AM PDT by marron
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To: Deathtomarxists

The ONLY way I would give up my US Citizenship, would be to support the “Republic of Texas II”. Had ancestors born here during the previous Republic.

I want no part of secession, but if there was no other option to remain a free man I would defend her. (If TX did ever secede she would not be the only state to do so)

And judging from the fact that 1,200 to 1,500 people per day legally move to Texas, the migration has already started.


59 posted on 08/12/2013 11:20:02 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one)
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To: RoseofTexas; Deathtomarxists
Living on a border town I can honestly tell you America is no longer the America we grew up with. Every where I go it’s nothing but Spanish and nasty disrespectful people and they flaunt their love for Mexico. They don’t even try to hide the fact that they are illegal and are obligated welfare ,free rent, free phone, free Medical services, free dental, free prescriptions, discount in their utilities, and pay no taxes!

Divide the united.

It's what governemnt is doing and has been doing for 30+ years...

As Americans pay government to create their own demise.

And some people still can't figure out what's happening....

60 posted on 08/12/2013 11:21:16 AM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: Deathtomarxists

I knew a family who relinquished their U.S. citizenship and moved to Canada during GWB’s second term. I didn’t really find out their reason for leaving, other than that they “didn’t like where the country was headed.” I assumed they were left-leaning, but I really was not sure; they might’ve been more libertarian politically. But, they were nice people.


61 posted on 08/12/2013 11:22:01 AM PDT by Tired of Taxes
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To: Noamie

I’ll put my idea to the test:

Nations with no laws on drinking age:

Albania
Angola
Armenia
Cambodia
Comoros
Cuba
Equatorial Guinea
Ghana
Guinea-Bissau
Jamaica
Macedonia
Montenegro
Morocco
Norway
Romania
Swaziland
Togo
Uruguay
Vietnam

General top “firearms freedom” nations
(Rating by FreeExistence Index of Worldwide Gun Rights, 2011, freeexistence.org):

Antigua (4.7)
Bolivia (6.5)
Bosnia (5.0)
Bulgaria (7.0)
Chile (4.7)
Czech (6.4)
Guatemala (4.8)
Guyana (6.0)
Iraq (5.8)
Jamaica (4.2)
Lithuania (5.2)
Madagascar (6.5)
Mali (6.0)
Monaco (4.2)
Montenegro (4.7)
New Zealand (2.0)
Pakistan (5.6)
Papua New Guinea (5.2)
Paraguay (5.4)
Peru (6.0)
Philippines (6.8) ***** FULL AUTO is LEGAL
Russia (3.1)
South Africa (6.0)
Switzerland (6.0)
Timor (8.0) ***** FULL AUTO is LEGAL with License
Turkey (5.7)
*****U.S. (8.0)
Yemen (9.0)

Winner: Jamaica, or Montenegro? OH, my....


62 posted on 08/12/2013 11:23:49 AM PDT by Noamie
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To: Fighting Irish

“Philippines!
Western friendly, English spoken in nearly every province, kind, warm hearted people, amazing beaches, the American dollar goes a long way.”

Full Auto guns are legal in the Philippines, too.....


63 posted on 08/12/2013 11:25:08 AM PDT by Noamie
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To: George from New England

I visited Chile in 2005 with thoughts that I might someday be forced to do an end run, so to speak. Pinochet was ruthless, but he cleaned out a lot of leftist scum in the process.


64 posted on 08/12/2013 11:25:47 AM PDT by Rockitz (This is NOT rocket science - Follow the money and you'll find the truth.)
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To: Deathtomarxists

People in Thailand are real nice people. Problem is Thailand has a large number of jihadi-death-cultists who go around murdering, bombing and raping.


65 posted on 08/12/2013 11:25:56 AM PDT by I want the USA back (Democrat party: criminal enterprise masquerading as a political party.)
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To: Deathtomarxists

Problem is that Texas shares a borderline with Mexico! Come next presidential election Texas will have a higher percentage of Hispanics voting Democrat than anytime in Texas history. They’re coming in in droves and their droves are extending all across the great state of Texas. If I’m not mistaken New Mexico used to be Republican and faithful Red and it flipped ...there is a great chance next presidential election Texas might flip too. When they pass amnesty I guarantee you that this great state will become blue in less than 20 years.


66 posted on 08/12/2013 11:26:26 AM PDT by RoseofTexas
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To: Deathtomarxists

later


67 posted on 08/12/2013 11:26:43 AM PDT by wjcsux ("In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - George Orwell)
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To: Deathtomarxists

I ain’t leaving. If the laws get too much, I break them.


68 posted on 08/12/2013 11:27:43 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Abortion - legalized murder for convenience)
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To: Noamie

If I take the drinking age to 16 then the best nations are:

Switzerland
Bosnia


69 posted on 08/12/2013 11:30:50 AM PDT by Noamie
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To: Buckeye McFrog
May be a moot discussion because the courts have ruled that you may REQUEST to renounce your US Citizenship, but the Government does not have to grant your request. And given this trend, I think that “no” is going to become their standard pat answer.

I remember Ron Paul saying that you may not want a fence put up to keep out illegals but not so for you to escape this once great nation.

70 posted on 08/12/2013 11:39:18 AM PDT by Digger
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To: longtermmemmory
No Napoleonic law
71 posted on 08/12/2013 11:40:20 AM PDT by Oorang (Tyranny thrives where government need not fear the wrath of an armed people - Alex Kozinski)
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To: marron
And if that's the case, freedom may become a felony.

Or at least they'll hound you to the ends of the earth trying to collect taxes they claim that you owe. Including the confiscation of any property left behind here.


72 posted on 08/12/2013 11:40:37 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: wku man

Has anyone watched the kids movie “Bugs Life”? Whenever someone talks about we being the majority, it brings to mind all of the angry ants. We are no different.

Surprising lesson for the kids in that movie.


73 posted on 08/12/2013 11:41:54 AM PDT by Guardian Sebastian
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To: servantboy777

“Americans don’t run.”

*****

German Jews don’t run. - 1938

Polish Jews don’t run. - 1939

Cubans don’t run. - 1959

East Germans don’t run. - 1961

Zimbabweans don’t run. - 1979

Venezuelans don’t run. - 1999

At a minimum, one should have an escape plan in place and the ability to implement it immediately.


74 posted on 08/12/2013 11:42:19 AM PDT by peyton randolph (Tagline copyright in violation of Directive 10-289)
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To: Marcella

There is something screwy here.

I am not a Dutch citizen but I receive a monthly Dutch SS check because I paid into the system while I worked there in the late 60’s.


75 posted on 08/12/2013 11:52:52 AM PDT by 353FMG ( I do not say whether I am serious or sarcastic -- I respect FReepers too much.)
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To: Mr. K

You can still collect SS.
My uncle never had a US passport and he retired back in Poland after working in the US on a green card. His wife went and got a US passport, but he didn’t want one.

He collects Social Security and does not have a US Passport.


76 posted on 08/12/2013 11:56:01 AM PDT by Bon mots
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To: Deathtomarxists
Giving up citizenship -which nation is the New America?

Denmark would be my choice!!

But I'll FIGHT for the USA!!

77 posted on 08/12/2013 11:59:49 AM PDT by ExCTCitizen (Ben Carson/Rand Paul or Sara/Nikki in 2016)
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To: Deathtomarxists

I’m staying here but moving to a town with <3,000, in a county of <10,000, more than an hour from the nearest Interstate or city of any size. Many poor people, but with dignity, who work in agri and aquaculture. Town has about a dozen churches, no movie theater, an award winning charter school, etc.


78 posted on 08/12/2013 12:04:34 PM PDT by clintonh8r (white Caucasian)
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To: Deathtomarxists
I don't know if there is anywhere "better". Certainly there are aspects that can be better.

But, there is certainly something to be said for just not being here while the USS Titantic is hitting the iceberg and watching it more as a cold spectator, of that makes sense.

Also, it's easier on our blood pressure being somewhere that you don't really understand their political system, don't really care and have little emotional investment.

79 posted on 08/12/2013 12:07:37 PM PDT by riri (Plannedopolis-look it up. It's how the elites plan for US to live.)
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To: lurk

I love Thailand. The free market on steroids. Women driving mopeds with babies on their laps...1 person per square foot selling everything known to man!


80 posted on 08/12/2013 12:09:14 PM PDT by riri (Plannedopolis-look it up. It's how the elites plan for US to live.)
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To: Deathtomarxists

Thailand has many advantages and attractions - but it is not paradise. Chiang Mai is a very nice place in the North Mountains (kinda North West)... It is hot in Thailand everywhere - just less hot in some places in some seasons. I don’t recommend it for American families unless you have or can get an international employer with a job in Thailand. It is very difficult to find work in Thailand for Foreigners of all nature (Westerners are called Farangs) - jobs are protected for Thai Citizens (novel idea the USA ought to try it). If you are a retiree or co retiree couple - have savings and a monthly retirement pension of at least $1,800 for one person or about $2,600.00 for an older couple - then you can live just fine in Thailand... Medical care is very affordable and of high quality in many cities especially Bangkok (but it cost more to live in BKK). Foreigners cannot own land in Thailand unless you are married to a Thai then the Thai spouse actually owns the land. Foreigners can own Condos - just the structure part. Rent is cheap, cars are just as expensive or more in Thailand. Immigration is a hassle - there are various visa options but most of those require leaving the country every 120 or less. A retirement Visa requires proof of at least 28,000 in a Thai bank (never ever under that mark). But about 500,000 Expats live in Thailand and make a go of it. Many are doing quite well. You can own a business with a Thai partner and a lot of other stipulations. I am going to retire there in a month or two... Basic Thai language is not difficult. I have a friend who lives near Phuket in a nice - small bungalow and his total monthly expense is less than $1,200. and he lives nicely in a tropical beach paradise.

Panama is bending over backwards to get American Retirees to move there - very few restrictions on Visa - you can work there, etc.


81 posted on 08/12/2013 12:09:14 PM PDT by ICCtheWay
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To: peyton randolph

Ok, let me rephrase...Texans don’t run.


82 posted on 08/12/2013 12:09:21 PM PDT by servantboy777
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To: longtermmemmory

Somalia.


83 posted on 08/12/2013 12:13:22 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: Deathtomarxists

bfl


84 posted on 08/12/2013 12:16:22 PM PDT by Errant
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To: Texas Fossil

It is time to for us to unite. We need a Freeper convention and discuss a new path for America. Our children’s lives depends on it. I am tears over what is going on with our borders. Washington is totally out of touch and our country is being destroyed by communists. It is their agenda to take us over by removing our borders. God help us.


85 posted on 08/12/2013 12:23:19 PM PDT by lone star annie
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To: Deathtomarxists

More about Thailand to clear up posted misinformation. The Muslims are less than 3% of the population ... 96% Buddhist ..1% other... Muslim terrorism is only a problem in the extreme far south on the Malaysian border. There is next to NO problem with Muslims anywhere else in the entire country.

Thailand Visa - again - yes on most Visa types you have to leave the country several times a year - BUT this is not a big deal - Laos, Cambodia and Burma are only a bus ride away and most Expats make a ‘Visa Run’ with friends and make a sight seeing tour out of the effort.

I don’t recommend for anyone to consider living in places like Phuket and Pattaya and parts of Bangkok ... The ‘Tourista’ business has ruined it. If want a secluded site near (but not on the beach) I suggest Krabi, If you like more rural and mountains I suggest Khon Kaen, or Sakon Nakhon in the Isaan Region... You can rent land and farm.


86 posted on 08/12/2013 12:31:02 PM PDT by ICCtheWay
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To: Deathtomarxists

Welcome to Mexarica .....


87 posted on 08/12/2013 12:31:12 PM PDT by SkyDancer (Live your life in such a way that the Westboro church will want to picket your funeral.)
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To: servantboy777

“Ok, let me rephrase...Texans don’t run.”

****

I’m Texan...However, in addition to being a U.S. citizen, I’m now also a permanent resident of another country because demographics are destiny. The Lone Star State is being invaded from the south and the north by those who will destroy it within 10-15 years.

Unless Texas secedes in the next couple of years and protects its borders as an independent republic, it will become the next Mexifornia. Secession is unlikely to occur unless (a) there is hyperinflation or (b) a national gun grab.

To paraphrase Rand, you can deny reality, but you can’t ignore the consequences of denying reality. Have an escape plan in place even if you never have to use it.


88 posted on 08/12/2013 12:31:40 PM PDT by peyton randolph (Tagline copyright in violation of Directive 10-289)
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To: ICCtheWay

There is exactly ONE Mosque in South Korea. Sure it can be seen for many miles because its atop the main hill in the Itawon portion of Seoul, but nothing is perfect


89 posted on 08/12/2013 12:32:35 PM PDT by GeronL
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To: abb

I’m not leaving, either. I’ll be 65 this year and time marches on with no escape. Best to be at peace with my Lord and Savior and know that this vale of tears is for but a season.

Meanwhile, get in the best possible shape I can, keep the hardware cleaned & oiled, and pray that when my time comes I will be on my feet.


90 posted on 08/12/2013 12:37:43 PM PDT by elcid1970 ("The Second Amendment is more important than Islam.")
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To: Deathtomarxists

For those who want to stay and fight -— I suggest you join me an my Group - March on D.C. 2013 - along with a number of other groups we plan a sizable protest demonstration in D.C. on September 9th. Contact me and I will send you the Facebook address of my group and several others.


91 posted on 08/12/2013 12:39:32 PM PDT by ICCtheWay
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To: Deathtomarxists

I very,very,*very* strongly wish to leave the United States.However,I don’t want to leave North America and I’d like to stay as close as possible to the place of my birth.The solution? Secession! The red states should secede and create a more prefect union.I’ll move to what is now known as North Carolina,Georgia,Tennessee...even West Virginia or Indiana.Let the blue states issue as many EBT cards,as many Obama Phones,as many marriage licenses to perverts,as many green cards as they wish.


92 posted on 08/12/2013 12:54:06 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (If Obama Had A City It Would Look Like Detroit)
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To: Guardian Sebastian
Never saw it...what's the moral of the story?

Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!

93 posted on 08/12/2013 1:01:26 PM PDT by wku man (Amnesty? No Way, Jose (No Se Puede!) by 10 Pound Test http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsTUQ8yOI2c)
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To: Deathtomarxists

Internationally one will generally find that established, stable governments tend to run towards the authoritarian end of the spectrum. Civil liberties and basic property rights are subject to restriction in most developed, first-world countries.

Owning firearms, owning land, keeping the money you make, choosing how to raise your family, practicing your faith or lack thereof, voicing your opinions, enjoying your intoxicants of choice without paying five times their value in taxes or having your bedroom door kicked in by the local thugs in the police force, things like these are hard to come by.

Conversely, it’s easy enough to find unstable nations that don’t have much in the way of “official” taxation and regulation. Most of the time the unofficial “taxation” and “regulation” will more than make up for the lack of government oversight. Want to own a business? Better pay the local police for a “license” that doesn’t show up on any books anywhere, and don’t forget to pay “fees” to the local labor union and community leaders to keep your business from catching fire at night. God forbid you settle down in a nice tropical paradise right in time for the government to nationalize your property and your bank accounts. Understand that you may need to aim for the right balance between local corruption and centralized control.

In many areas of the world westerners are seen as money trees - just run up to them and shake them down for a bit of quick cash. It’s also comparatively harder to fly under the radar in some nations when your color, dress, or language loudly proclaims that you’re a foreign devil.

Human beings are tribal creatures, something most people in the west have both forgotten and take great pains daily to try to disbelieve. Outsiders have to manage to get along chiefly without the benefit of social support from the local community, without the allegiance of the dominant local groups, and without the social credit and trust that comes from being a “cousin”. If possible, try to ingratiate yourself into existing immigrant communities or faith-based communities which you might reasonably have some allegiance to. It’s better to be an Irishman living in the Irish communities in Boston than it is to be the proverbial lone Irishman living in Haiti.

Never, ever forget that countries are temporary and fleeting artificial creations. Invasions, revolutions, coups, demographic displacement, and religious displacement are some of the reasons that the map of the world gets redrawn every couple of years.

That’s a lot of unpleasant social and legal terrain you’ll need to navigate around.

You can improve your odds of living a long, happy, productive life by following a few general rules.

First, try to maintain as much financial independence as possible - don’t place all of your money in the government run banks, things like checking accounts, savings accounts, retirement accounts, these are like piggy banks for unscrupulous governments (re, all governments). Read up on the economic troubles in Argentina to get an idea of what can happen to your bank accounts and your IRA when the government has bills to pay. Further note, currencies can and do fail - don’t neglect to have a reserve of foreign currencies set aside, or some assets in specie. If the local currency turns in to so much toilet paper over night, it helps to have a well-respected and recognized international currency.

Despite the ever present risk of robbery, it’s often a good idea to have some hard cash on hand for emergencies. Temporary disruptions of goods and services should be expected the world over, it’s naive and simply wrong-headed to assume that you can walk into a bank or hit up an ATM any time of the day or night whenever you need to. Likewise, during times of civil unrest or in the early stages of a government transition, what you have on you and in your pockets may be the only things you’ll have that will help you escape or subsist.

Having multiple sources of revenue adds a level of security as well. What would you do if your pension checks, or your social security checks, just stopped coming one day? Professional knowledge and marketable skills are certainly easily transportable and hard to steal, and the right ones can keep you from going hungry or ending up in a refugee camp.

Consider maintaining some degree of physical mobility. As a general rule you don’t want all of your eggs in one basket, and that rule can encompass having a second little property in another nation to escape to if your current nation changes radically over night. Likewise, if you’re sailing around the world on your dream boat, don’t discount the possibility that some corrupt little government official will appropriate your yacht and leave you stranded on shore - have a backup plan.

Research the nations you plan on frequenting! Understand both the written and the unwritten laws of a nation. Too many people in the anglosphere assume that the rules are written down, and that anything not written down is A-OK. A hell of a lot of what passes for governance in the world goes on off the books.

Look at the history of the nation to understand how its borders came to be, what its relations with its neighbors are, what peoples and cultures and religions control the various political and geographic units, and pay special note to any long-simmering ethnic or cultural conflicts that spark into genocidal violence every 50 to 100 years. All cultures and tribes are not created equal, and some cultures and tribes are so incompatible that you can bet good money that they’ll be warring with each other until kingdom come (or one wipes out the other).

Your general strategy will be different whether you’re planning on retiring some place, whether you plan on living and working in another nation, whether you want to raise a family and create a legacy that will last for generations, or whether you plan on traveling while in semi-retirement/semi-work. Do your research carefully with an eye towards your real needs. Check and see if there’s a thriving expat community living there already. These people may be a wealth of information for you.

Develop good street sense. Most of the world doesn’t have the benefit of huge, professional, well-funded and mostly non-corrupt law enforcement agencies. Kidnapping is big business in many countries. Home invasions as well. Sometimes you’ll find the local law enforcement “moonlighting” in these occupations. Staying away from drugs, steering clear of revolutionary movements (even of the ideological kind), avoiding prostitutes, not gambling, and keeping a low profile will help avoid some trouble, but you’re still probably going to appear wealthier and easier to knock over than the locals. The world isn’t Mayberry.

Check your illusions at the border, keep your head up and your eyes & ears open, be flexible, be mobile, be realistic, be cynical, have backup plans to your backup plans.


94 posted on 08/12/2013 1:06:18 PM PDT by jameslalor
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To: longtermmemmory

Translation: Time to start a new country
(not that I disagree with you in anyway)


95 posted on 08/12/2013 1:10:03 PM PDT by jimjohn
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To: snoringbear
at some point Texas along with some like minded states should declare a semi-autonomous relationship with the great US... comments welcome :)


96 posted on 08/12/2013 1:10:26 PM PDT by Albion Wilde ("Remember... the first revolutionary was Satan."--Russian Orthodox Archpriest Dmitry Smirnov)
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To: Deathtomarxists; All
I am curious a few years ago why Rush went ( other than surgery for his then wife to be ) to the Czech Republic.

Look at their Tax Code via Goog;e etc and it is enough to make Steve Forbes Drool.

They haven't darn near taken over the Gen-Av airplane market by shear luck, tax code and smart engineers, all home grown all helped...

Rush is talking more ominous everyday IMHO.

I wonder if the day EIB 1 wheels go up not to return are not to far off...

97 posted on 08/12/2013 1:11:04 PM PDT by taildragger (The E-GOP won't know what hit them, The Party of Reagan is almost here, hang tight folks....)
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To: Deathtomarxists

As John Cazale said in “Dog Day Afternoon”: Wyoming.


98 posted on 08/12/2013 1:13:36 PM PDT by miss marmelstein ( Richard Lives Yet!)
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To: Deathtomarxists

Social Security Benefits are paid to all who have qualified, whether U.S. citizens or not. There are specific Nations where SSA beneficiaries cannot receive payments due to lack of various treaties etc., but they are few.


99 posted on 08/12/2013 1:20:48 PM PDT by ExSES (the "bottom-line")
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To: peyton randolph
I agree with everything you say...except an escape plan.

If things go in the same direction for another three years, this country will be in civil war.

Escape, good luck to ya and can't say I blame ya, but I'm stickin.

I love my country, my state and am willing to fight and die if necessary to keep her free.

May sound grandiose, but it is not. Kinda like a dog getting in the chicken pen for the first time. Once they taste blood, you'll never keep’em out.

Those who have tasted freedom (especially my generation), will never allow it to be taken without a fight.

Not advocating anything, just plain tawk.

100 posted on 08/12/2013 1:21:36 PM PDT by servantboy777
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