Posted on 06/28/2012 10:25:40 AM PDT by US Navy Vet
SOMEBODY give us SOME hope!
Did the umpires marry the opposing teams and the opposing fans during the seventh inning stretch?
Never before has every man, woman, and child been subject to a "fine" for refusing to do the government's bidding.
Everyone is livid and I understand completely why. I agree with Redstate on this one.
Nof for the rest of the panicked here...
Remember unintended consequences. A few have already been mentioned. Illegals getting healthcare...waivers/Muslim/Catholic suits...this opened a hugh and series barell of hell for the election prospects for Dems. It’s going to kill them.
Even with MR, the GOP will now have the ultimate platform to battle the Dems on. Not that that is without issues itself, but they will get the house, senate and exec...and by a significant margin.
Again folks, I am pissed off too. It should have been tossed wholesale. But get out of panic mode and realize that there is some good to come from this. It is up to US to ensure that we don’t toss it away.
Or we just give up now. The choice is ours. Period.
BS. This is no longer about just Obamacare. The precedent has been set that the government can force you to do anything as long as they call it a tax. You have lost your liberty and don't even know it. Stop the crap. This dicision violates the Constitution.
Gun sales might increase along with the beer. Hey maybe they will have to hire some clerks to keep up with the increased sales.
More of your countrymen realize that they are now slaves of a corrupt regime & are starting to get organized .
More of your countrymen will get pissed at the lickspittle GOP~e that were to cowardly to fight with all their heart & soul & instead tried to be accomidateing to the Democrats who were in favor of slavery in the 1860’s when slaves were private property & who are still in favor of slavery now that the slave is property of the state.
More of your countrymen will buy copies of the book RESISTANCE TO TYRANY by Joseph P. Martino ,more of your countrymen will read this book learn from it & act on that knowlege.
More of your countrymen will prepare for when the slaveowner wannabes decide to make a few examples to resist with extreme prejudice.
Silver Lining: This is one of my favorite vanity posts.
She Stoops to Conquer.
Think of the legend of Emily West Morgan - the Yellow Rose of Texas - keeping Santa Anna distracted at the battle of San Juacinto.
“We just witnessed a slap-down of the power to regulate our lives via the commerce clause. That is hugh.”
Oh, boy. That’s like instead of being annoyed by a bee at a picnic now I’m beign strafed by a F-16.
Let’s review: the commerce clause does not extend to regulating non-activity. Okay, but it still applies to any activity whatsoever without it having to be commerce or interstate. However, Congress has been affirmed in its power to mandate me to do anything whatsoever, so long as the penalty for not doing it is called a tax. That’s a gift of the magi.
I agree with Restate as well - it IS up to us. WE elect the people in Congress ... Congress votes taxes. If we continue to elect the type of people we’ve been electing, we’ll continue to get what we voted for. We can change this around, the question is whether there is the collective ‘will’ to do it. Obama may have given an ‘upbeat’ sort of speech, but he’s in deep trouble now that the TAX has been hung around his neck with a chain and padlocked by the court. The “less educated” (for lack of a better term) may ignore ‘individual mandate’, but mention ‘more taxes’ and they’ll go nuts.
I know I will be. I just wish some of our freeper brethren would get the message and stop fighting for our enemy by promising to stay home. This is for all the marbles...sorry we don’t have that pretty blue one you’ve had your eye on...play anyway.
Well the former atty general just admonished the rats to be wary of smoking the ‘exploding cigar.’ We just witnessed a slap-down of the power to regulate our lives via the commerce clause. That is hugh.
hugh who? Just trying to lighten the moment.
Silver lining?
1- We know Roberts is a good punter
2- We know we can’t depend on his court upholding the constitution therefore we need to stay engaged.
3- We know we will have more energy on our side in November.
I have not had a chance to read the opinion yet and have not read the ACA. Maybe you can help me think through this. The Court said that the commerce clause does not give the government the power to mandate that people buy insurance. So that tells me the ACA didn't mandate that people buy insurance. If it said that, the mandate would not be constitutional because it exceeded government power. So the ACA must instead say that anybody who doesn't buy insurance will pay this fine, which has now been defined as a tax. As a tax, a repeal can pass the Senate with only a simple majority. Or, if it is not repealed, after paying the tax someone could appeal the legality of the tax. Is that a correct analysis?
There’s an FR article practically every other day about somebody getting fined by some level of govt for not doing something the govt mandates. Helmet laws, seat belt laws - and the EPA is a master of issuing inaction fines from regs they’ve cooked up unbeknown by the taxpayers.
New Tea Party Rally on the Hill in D.C. We need ONE this fall!
If the Stupid Party plays their cards correctly, this can spell trouble down-ticket for the Dim Senators and Representatives who voted for The Largest Tax Increase Ever Passed, Anywhere or Anytime.
Women, minorities and children hit hardest.
My only “hope” is that the Feds have so over-extended themselves, they will go bankrupt, despite all the efforts of the Cental Bank.
It won’t be pretty, but it’s the only way I see to restore rights to states and local governments .
As usual, in times of darkness, go to my guiding Freeper light and those wise minds who reassure and placate through deliberation.
And it seems, in looking at the decision stating that oblahcare is a tax and all the Constitutional ways of dealing with a tax, the libs on the Court as well as Roberts have just shown that the libdim party who emphasized up and down that oblahcare was NOT a tax, have proven themselves to be the lying liars they really are.
Now will anyone care...
A silver lining?
You mean, like the end of the book “1984”?
You remember, where Winston, who was on his way to Room 101, heroically attacked the guards escorting him, broke into Julia’s cell and rescued her and fought his way to freedom. Then he came back to the Ministry of Love with a Tommy gun, a .45 and a bazooka, singlehandedly killed all the guards, wasted O’Brien, and then cornered Big Brother in his office, ripped off his mustache, and filled him with lead while yelling, “Death to tyranny! Long live the proles!”
No, wait......sorry about that.
“1984” ends with Winston getting drunk on cheap, nasty Victory Gin, a tear in his eye, his heart filled with love for Big Brother and Ingsoc, happily awaiting the bullet in the back of his neck so he could die loving the Party.
George Orwell was a remarkable observer of human nature, and more often than not, he was accurate. This, ultimately, is how people are. They will come to accept the loss of freedom, because the concept of security matters more than being free.
“Do you want a picture of the future, Winston? Imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.”
There are only two kinds of men who are truly free; those who choose to live outside the law, and those who are dead. - AnAmericanAbroad.
Ah, but those laws don’t apply universally, only to people engaged in certain activity — helmet laws only apply to motorcyclists; seat belt laws to auto passengers; etc.
This marks the first time that everyone is subject to “do this or else pay” by the simple virtue of existing. That makes it a whole different ball game.
LOL. Doubtful. There isn’t a lot of love between those two clubs.
This is what the health insurance companies are counting on.
I also wonder if these companies are now going to cut their non-profit healthcare donations to zero on the pretext that obamacare is the safety net. We could see charitable giving to healthcare services dry up completely.
If it silences the “there’s no difference between Romney and Obama” crowd, thank God!
You’re kidding....right ? Roberts changed a mandate into a tax. He rewrote the opinion from the bench. That activisim.
Can someone explain to me how the SCOTUS can say it unconstitutional as written as far as the commerce clause is concerned but if they call it a tax it’s OK. The bill was not written calling it a tax. The court is supposed to vote on the bill as written I thought, not rewrite it.
But we already knew, or should have known, that Congress has that power, so long as the language in the legislation implies it. Roberts said as much really, without comment on the correctness of it. Yeah it's onerous, but we need to be careful about our elected Congresscritters.
And, still, I'll take this little victory; did you hear Troll Ginsburg was reported to be upset with this part of the opinion? Anything that causes her consternation gets my attn and encourages me.
You must be knew here. Seriesly.
Holy Crap! Just read all three links that supposedly show the good news. Sorry if that is the best news about this decision, we lost and lost big.
With the developments today I think they will.
I’m even leaning to believe, as others here have mentioned, that Roberts did pretty much the correct thing. It isn’t up to the SCOTUS to legislate from the bench.
It is up to US to vote and decide our future and the future of The Republic for ourselves.
We do alot of things just to exist, like eating, sleeping, having 4 walls and a roof. Even before this it is darn near impossible to just exist and avoid all taxes. This is just the first time the govt has been so direct and bold about it.
As a mind-game try looking up how many Catholic hospitals there are. Hint: The last one in AZ was divested late last year.
You absolutely nailed this, what we won, limits of the commerce clause, we lost even bigger. The government has the right to use taxes as a punitive measure. Thanks Roberts.
Election day is just over 130 days away.
Sorry I disagree, this mandate was presented as a fine all throughout this fight. They finally admitted it was a tax during the final hearing in front of the Supremes. How can something be passed as a fine, and then declared as a tax by Roberts? Isn’t this judicial activism at its worst? I truely believe Robert’s is too compromised to sit on the court. As a adoptive mother myself, I believe this has to do with Robert’s children. Illegal adoption?
A weird victory for federalism
"Who would have thought that we could win while losing?"
You'll get no argument from me on that assessment. I only provided links to some additional analysis of the weak positives, which are the 'best' we got and they aren't good.
Where did the tax come from?
The mandate was not presented as a tax until the disingenuous appeals by the government lawyers (Which was news to the Congress and POTUS who declared the mandate as a non-tax during every stage of the abomination's lifespan) who even proclaimed the mandate was not a tax, then a tax, not a tax, ad nausea, hence Roberts is a whore for fraud or too naive to see through the lies presented by the government whores who were appealing Judge Vinson's ruling.
Roberts struck down the mandate and then legislated from the bench; calling a for a tax where there was none sincerely created from the legislature and signed by the Executive, crazy tax Roberts created, hmmm...
Roberts should not be celebrated, only treated with disdain for being a statists whore and not following Judge Vinson's ruling (Roberts com padres sure as hell wouldn't by ideological default) who laid out well reasoned ruling based on historical precedence instead of creating a tax out of the thin unconstitutional air from a fine/mandate that was never a tax to begin with.
“The Anti-Injunction Act prohibits the Court from ruling on the Constitutionality of a tax until someone actually pays the tax. If Obamacare survives repeal efforts, then in 2014, someone will pay the “tax” and then challenge its Constitutionality.”
That is not what the opinion says.
* On the one hand, Roberts holds that, for the purpose of the Anti-Injunction act, the penalty in the mandate is NOT a tax. Therefore, the anti-injunction act does not apply.
* OTOH, Roberts then holds that, for the purpose of determining whether the penalty is a proper exercise of Congress’ taxing power, that it is a tax.
I know it sounds stupid and it is. But I just finished reading the decision (I practiced law for 20+ years) and that’s exactly what it says.
The challenge based on whether the penalty is unconstitutional is OVER. DONE. FINISHED.
Silver linings:
1. Obamacare is issue #2 after the economy. Its unpopular and will help Obama lose.
2. 5 Justices said Obamacare violated the commerce clause.
3. 4 Justices want to throw ACA out entirely. It survived only very narrowly.
4. “It’s a tax!” Obama’s hypocrisy on this exposed.
5. Opponents will be fired up. We HAVE to defeat Obama now to repeal Obamacare.
Silver linings:
1. Obamacare is issue #2 after the economy. Its unpopular and will help Obama lose.
2. 5 Justices said Obamacare violated the commerce clause.
3. 4 Justices want to throw ACA out entirely. It survived only very narrowly.
4. “It’s a tax!” Obama’s hypocrisy on this exposed.
5. Opponents will be fired up. We HAVE to defeat Obama now to repeal Obamacare.
“But the principle that the commerce clause is a LIMITED power is one that will no doubt be cited so long as America and the concept of a government of limited and enumerated powers endures.”
That doesn’t matter much when, in the same decision, Roberts expanded the taxing power to allow the government to penalize any activity or non-activity. It just means the blah blah in the preamble to the bill will be a little different.
And, amazingly, Roberts did so despite that the government did not even raise this issue because Obamacare says over and over that the mandate is a ‘penalty’. Thus, Roberts had to twist himself in pretzels in the decision to find that the penalty was really a tax.
This is no silver lining at all.
My husband and I live in CT, but near the MA border. We were very active in Sen. Scott Brown's "the people's seat" campaign back then.
We were stunned at the sheer numbers of Democrats (many union members) who came up to us - some were MEN in tears - absolutely outraged (and fearful, in some cases) in being forced to ditch their private health insurance for ObamaCare and stated that - for the first time in their lives - they were going to vote for a Republican (Brown). ObamaCare was the sole reason.
The GOP needs to tap into those voters again in 2012.
The one silver lining is that forcing the Medicaid expansion on the States was declared unconstitutional. Hopefully, most states will refuse to take on those extra costs. That will mildly affect the implementation of the bill.
Hmmm.... interesting. I hope you're right.
If the only way to escape life under ObamaCare is to move to an "opt-out" state - a Red State obviously (if I understand the ruling correctly), then hubby and I will move out of The People's Socialist Republik of Connecticut by 2014.
The Supreme Court once upheld slavery and segregation, and look what became of them.
Sorry I disagree, this mandate was presented as a fine all throughout this fight. They finally admitted it was a tax during the final hearing in front of the Supremes. How can something be passed as a fine, and then declared as a tax by Roberts? Isn’t this judicial activism at its worst? I truely believe Robert’s is too compromised to sit on the court. As a adoptive mother myself, I believe this has to do with Robert’s children. Illegal adoption?
WHEN? We'll be there, like we were in March 2010 when we tried to stop this monstrosity.
I will always love the many GOP Congressmen and women who literally were out there "in the trenches" with us (outside the US House): ie, Steve King (IA), Michele Bachmann, Mary Fallon (now OK governor), Louie Gohmert, Marsha Blackburn (TN), Phil Gingrey, so many others whose names escape me at the moment.
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