Posted on 04/20/2017 9:56:37 AM PDT by w1n1
I bought a deputy’s very slightly used Sig in .380 a year ago at a gun show. The deputy said his new boss mandated nothing less than a 9 mm.
The Sig P-238 is very slim and fits in my jeans pocket as a perfect hidden arm.
I also own a Glock 22 in .40, a couple of Smiths in .38 and a Colt Python 6 inch bbl which I’ve cleaned and retired. I turned down $2500 for the Python.
If you look at recommended hunting calibers for hunting human sized mammals with handguns, it starts from 357 mag and goes up from there.
Note: for mountain lions and black bears, 45 ACP is not recommended.
Answer: .357 Magnum.
Barnes makes a 9mm round that:
1. expands to a full .70"
2. penetrates consistently to the necessary 12"-18"
See here for details on .45 loads, 9mm, and many others:
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/
I prefer the 125 gain .357 magnum round myself if I want to stop someone with a handgun. Yeah there is recoil but with practice it is more than manageable.
That being said if I have to use a 9mm give me a JHP and I can live with this round, recoil isn’t a factor and it’s accurate. If you insist on FMJ, give me a Glock 17/19 with a 34 rd. magazine.
I am perfectly content with a .45 ACP, it’s more of a push backward than a fierce recoil I believe. I prefer the 185 grain JHP, but the 230 grain JHP is just fine. If I have to shoot FMJ, give me the .45ACP. I have 1911’s and Glock in this caliber and an old S&W Model 1917 with half-moon clips. I prefer the 1911.
That depends on who is president after Trump...
My favorite serious urban business firearm is either a 9mm or a .357 mag snub nose. My serious backwoods wilderness firearm is a snub nose .44 mag (another wrist breaker, but then again, it is probably life or death if I have to use it).
There are probably were more people put in cemeteries via handguns through the use of .32 Auto rounds than anything else. If you look at the millions of handguns out there, the .32 Auto is probably the most common cartridge. It was used by police and the military in Europe for a long long time.
The point is dead is dead. If someone is wearing body armor or drugged up, you really want to withdraw and not confront them. For most everyone else depending on where your bullet strikes, dead is dead. If just might take another round or two or three.
The army was fully behind the 9mm, though and a colonel asked at the end of his enthusiastic presentation if there were any questions and I put my hand up. I asked him if the "9mm is the same caliber the Germans lost two wars in a row with" and he told me to "shut up and sit down!" to a room full of laughter.
Afterward, we were led out to a firing demonstration with soldiers in lab coats (making them scientists, I guess) with pistols and the demo was to fire at 55 gallon drums filled with water with cardboard human silhouettes in front of each of them. It was cold, so each barrel had a layer of ice over the water.
Each soldier faced the water barrel/silhouette targets as the narrator (another soldier in a lab coat) described each pistol. The first was a .38 S&W revolver and the soldier fired 6 rounds and made 6 holes and water leaked slowly out of the barrel. The next soldier fired the Beretta 92 and shot a whole bunch of times, turning the barrel into a colander, leaking a lot more.
The last soldier fired one shot with a .45 at the barrel, making a large hole and the silhouette fell to the ground and water poured out like a hose. We Marines cheered and applauded and the demonstration was finished for the day. The army was NOT happy.
“Put Hydrashock in anything and feel confident.”
I’ve done some of my own testing and am fond of the Critical Defense loads. Not as lethal as the Hydroshock, but expansion is more consistent under different conditions. I carry them in a LC9S and occasionally an LCP.
Let’s turn the question a bit and ask, if you were going to take a bullet in the chest, which would you prefer it be, the 9mm or .45 ACP? Assume same type of projectile.
That is a good story.
Well, I like both but the .45 FMJ was specifically designed to put down Juramentados when it was found the .38 Colt did not have the power.
The US army recognized this problem early and reissued .45 Colt Revolvers to their troops.
I would have told you, “yes the same German Army which inflicted many times the number of casualties they suffered”.
We have a duel, you and I, at 20 paces. There are two pistols to choose from, one’s a .45 and ones a 9mm. Which do you pick?
A 45 will never get smaller, but a 9mm may not ever get any larger....
15 misses with a 9mm loses to one hit with a 45....
9 misses with a 45 loses to one hit from a 15 shot 9mm
420 ft/lbs of energy from one 45 center mass hit beats one solid hit and one off center hit from a 9mm...
two peripheral hits from a 9mm beats one from a 45...
9 shots from a 45 is barely 50% of the ability to hit from a 15+ shot 9mm...
A 1911 is the epitome of archaic design while there are dozens of modern but mediocre designs in 9mm...
15 shots provides service to at least 5 bad guys with to the chest and one to head or hip, while a 9 shot 45 require a reload to do the same...
etc and on and on...
Yeah, Hackworth used to write about this topic a lot back in SoF.
In that scenario I would pick a .45.
For general self defense, if I could choose any gun I wanted, it would be one of the Glock high capacity 10mms.
Beside my bed right now are two Browning Hi-Powers. I would prefer something else but the Brownings are what I have and they are OK.
Sorry, velocity is what gets the mass and size to the target and through... Holes kill.
But I hear ya...
Well in the spirit of this silly thread:
Frankly anyone who carries anything less than a 454 Casull likely has to pee sitting down. Furthermore that is the bottom end, you really need a .500 S&W to be sure you are not under-gunned.
My carry gun is a 7.5 inch .45/70 magnum research revolver. Ported you ask?, nah, that is for girls. I keep in training by taking it out every few weeks and firing 3 rounds. I like the original load, a 500 grain lead bullet with 70 grains of black powder. That way if I miss I can tactically evade in the cloud of smoke.
My back-up is a S&W revolver in.500 S&W with a 2 inch barrel, ported. I never fire more than one round at a training session. Frankly the fireball from the round is likely to ignite any intruder at less than 4 yards, or at least blind him for some seconds while I make my tactical evasion. I shut my eyes as I shoot it to avoid being blinded by the fireball, one of the tricks real operators know, which the general public, Rangers , Police and Seals would not.
I use a shoulder holster for the Magnum research, pretty comfortable except at the beach. My orthopedic doctor has pointed out I now have a very slight curvature of the spine but well, it might also be related to the cartilage problems I have from shooting the pistol one-handed. I use a special “crotch” holster to conceal the 2 inch 500 S&W. Has the added advantage that the ladies seem to notice, if you know what I mean.
Reason for a few weeks between 4 round range sessions (3 45/70, 1 500 S&W) is to allow my ligaments and tendons to heal. But hey, that is the price you pay for not shooting a pansy round like the 44 magnum or 454 Casull. Have some self respect dude, if you shoot them you might as well get a “Lady Smith”. Pink might match your color scheme.
So this entire debate of 9mm vs 45 is kind of like 8 year olds debating wither the .22 cal pump daisy rifle is as good as the 5 mm Sheridan air rifle. Grow up ladies.
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