Posted on 11/27/2015 12:53:16 PM PST by amorphous
In his role as Norad commander for Alaska, McInerney dealt with more Russian fighter jet incursions (which he calls "bear penetrations") than anyone else in the world.
So McInerney knows how to tell innocent from hostile incursions by foreign fighter jets, standard rules of engagement of foreign fighter jets, how to read radar tracks, and the other things he would need to know to form an informed opinion about the shootdown of a foreign jet.
Yesterday, McInerney told Fox News - much to the surprise of the reporter interviewing him - that assuming the Turkish version of the flight path of the Russian jet is accurate, Russia wasn't threatening Turkey, and that Turkey's shoot down of the Russian jet "had to be pre-planned", as the jet wasn't in Turkish air space long enough for anything other than a premeditated attack to have brought it down:
(Excerpt) Read more at zerohedge.com ...
No. Simply no.
That tiny little finger of land that dips down into Syria is in dispute. The Syrians claim that land as theirs, and it appears as part of Syria on all their official maps. Syria has claimed that territory as belonging to Syria since the French drew the maps back in the 1930s.
There is no evidence that Russia ever flew across the border into Turkey Proper, and that teeny little piece that they flew over is in dispute.
This has nothing to do with airspace violations, and everything to do with the fact that Erdogan's son is the primary buyer and seller of ISIS controlled oil stolen from Iraq.
Erdogan is upset because the Russians are killing his ISIS allies. That is what this is about.
While it may be possible, we cannot know unless someone releases the precise distance
a) needed for missile lock for that particular missile and its range;
b) the precise distance the F16 was from the SU24 when lock occurred and;
c) the exact position of both in that moment.
According to the Russians FWIW, both planes were in Syrian space when the missile was released.
Good information to have. The sort of information one should expect to have. If they don’t want one of their jets shot down. /s
Another piece of information they should have is that you can't trust a nation which is run by an Islamic nut bag to not stab you in the back when they get a chance. It's a good thing for them that it only cost them a Jet, a Helicopter and a couple of pilots to learn this.
It could have cost them a whole lot more in the future.
Now Poor little b*tch Erdogan is begging them not to shoot down his planes in Syria.
Don't beg Erdogan, just take your spanking like a good little boy.
The flaw in the commie account is that they have been violating Turkeys air space for months and have been warned about it. What’s with the commie supporting brigade here at FR anyway? Erdogan sucks, Putin sucks.WGAS if they shoot at each other?
What is "true" is based on whom you ask. That tiny little finger of land sticking down into Syria is not shown on Syrian maps of the region. The Syrians claim that territory, and have always claimed that territory as theirs.
Syrians hold the view that this land was illegally ceded to Turkey by France, the mandatory occupying power of Syria in the late 1930s. Syria still considers it an integral part of its own territory. Syrians call this land Liwa' aliskenderun (Arabic: لواء الاسكندرون‎) rather than the Turkish name of Hatay. Official Syrian maps still show Hatay as part of Syria
It is possible that the Russian pilot might have been under the impression that he was flying completely over Syrian land, and that he was unaware that Turkey laid claim to that 2 mile wide piece.
Putin builds churches!
Alternatively, he knew and didn’t care, and got his ass shot out of the sky for it. Good riddance.
If you are talking about overflying that tiny little finger of land that pushes into Syria, then F*** the Turks. There is no reasonable objection to the Russians overflying that little land peninsula. It does not constitute anything remotely like a serious airspace violation.
Given that Russia and Turkey had something like a 30 billion dollar annual trade, it makes even less sense to make an issue over it.
Is there any evidence that any Russian aircraft were flying deep into Turkey proper? I bet all these "violations" are regarding that tiny little piece of nothing that sticks into Syria.
Obama build mosques!
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/aug/10/tax-dollars-to-build-mosques/
Google search how many times the U.S. has been accused of violating someone or others air space. Everyone does it from time to time. Most do not shoot down the plane. There was no threat to Turkey. They are just trying to be in the Syrian war without being officially in the Syrian war.
No rational person would have ever suspected (assuming he knew that finger belonged to Turkey) that anyone would be shot down for overflying that 2 mile wide stretch.
It is obvious that that little finger of land was used as a Chip on Erdogan's shoulder.
Even our own Generals are saying that was a way overreaction to an incredibly minor provocation, if indeed it was even a deliberate provocation at all. But then they are more rational than you seem to be.
Lol. What happened to you? It’s Turkeys airspace. Russia was told to stay out. They refused that advice. Turkey shot the plane down. End of that particular story. Size, in this case, is irrelevant.
You’re an open border guy now? Sorry, I’m not. Putin got what he asked for. Tough sh3t.
Top U.S. Air Defense Commander: Turkey's Shootdown of Russian Jet "Had to Be PRE-PLANNED"
Open borders? That’s crazy. Listen to the entire short Fox interview with the General. He knows about these sorts of things because it is his chosen profession. This is not about open borders. That’s ridiculous.
Again, if you think that was fair then what about when the U.S. does it? This is a common complaint. I read a story that stated Turkey had violated Greece’s air space over 2000 times recently. You can find all sorts of similar stories. You really think the think to do is for countries to shoot down the planes for such minor incursions in the air? Wow. That sure would do squat for world peace.
World peace? Lol. Here is what I think. Good fences make good neighbors. Sovereign countries need borders. Those borders should be defended. Erdogan and Putin CA blow each others brand out and I won’t lose a wink of sleep. World peace? OK Hillary.
I’m with you on the borders. The walls are not tall enough to keep a plane out of 17 second usage. It is just not the same thing.
I threw in the world peace thing to make you laugh. I thought we could use something to lighten things up.
In that case, I suppose one could suppose that Erdogan supposed that Putin would suppose that he [Erdogan] would attack Russia's jet. It that was indeed the case, it still makes Erdogan the bad guy no matter how you suppose it.
BTW, sorry for my earlier sloppy post. I proofread, but sometimes too fast. It was suppose to be “You really think the THING to do is for.....” I looked at my world peace post and thought, oh no, how sloppy.
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